Elementalist Mage PVP

stealthmoe · 05/01/07, 4:19 PM

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=RZVgGzd0cRhZVVrfobxobo

I have been PVPing with a heavy arcane build in PVP for some time and I ran across this build. Seems to fit my play style and I think it has some intense survivability and control. If this is a dead horse topic, my bad! Gimme some feedback!

Drully · 05/02/07, 1:34 PM

Haven`t played it myself, but i have definitly thought about it.
It offers huge survivability, and just about nothing else. Could be nice for BGs 2v2 and 3v3, depending on your set up.
BUT it definitly misses the burst damage an arcane build offers. I have played deep frost for a long time, which is basicly also high survivability and no burst..., I like AP/frost much more...
At least 4 5v5 AP/xy seems the only way to go, since burst is what the mages bring into the team as a speciality.

Try it, and give us some feed back!^^

Maligne · 05/02/07, 2:13 PM

There's already a thread:

[Mage] The Elementalist

Also some discussion here:

Mage PvP Thread (or: Ice Block, discuss)

Your build looks pretty solid. I would pick up imp cone of cold and master of elements though.

Drully hit the nail on the head - this build shines in battlegrounds and 2's and 3's. For 5's Arcane/Frost is still uncontested.

Vontre · 05/02/07, 2:56 PM

Originally Posted by Maligne

There's already a thread:

[Mage] The Elementalist

Also some discussion here:

Mage PvP Thread (or: Ice Block, discuss)

Your build looks pretty solid. I would pick up imp cone of cold and master of elements though.

Drully hit the nail on the head - this build shines in battlegrounds and 2's and 3's. For 5's Arcane/Frost is still uncontested.

Uncontested? Zenturil from Clan Hex uses a 61 point ice build... (though even I think that's rather silly). And there is an elementalist mage, 0/36/25, who is 3rd place in 5v5. "Uncontested" is a pretty strong word for a build that some of the top 5v5 mages aren't using.

Maligne · 05/02/07, 3:40 PM

Originally Posted by Vontre

Uncontested? Zenturil from Clan Hex uses a 61 point ice build... (though even I think that's rather silly). And there is an elementalist mage, 0/36/25, who is 3rd place in 5v5. "Uncontested" is a pretty strong word for a build that some of the top 5v5 mages aren't using.

Yeah, you're right. I was thinking "overall favorite", not "there are no exceptions." Bad choice of words.

Drully · 05/02/07, 4:26 PM

Originally Posted by Vontre

Uncontested? Zenturil from Clan Hex uses a 61 point ice build... (though even I think that's rather silly). And there is an elementalist mage, 0/36/25, who is 3rd place in 5v5. "Uncontested" is a pretty strong word for a build that some of the top 5v5 mages aren't using.

There is a german phrase, which i would translate freely into:

"Exceptions con(af)firm(?) the rule."

Anyways, worth a test, if i ever get myself to do it...^^

Footspeedy · 05/02/07, 9:36 PM

While Ice barrier is amazing for solo pvp, it is much much less important in arenas were a healer can spend ~200-300 mana to heal you for 1000, and you can spend 500~ on the same amount, giving healers superior regen, and the length of some games when both sides have a healer having a mage that doesnt have to run away as early to drink or hide behind a pillar to evo gives you a big advantage. Ice barrier just runs you out of mana, if your being assisted hard enuff to mash icebarrier you should probbaly just iceblock (Dieing in the global sucks). While it may save you once in a while, I much prefer a 40/21 build that is centered around scorches for higher sustained damage and mana effeciency.

Darkmantle · 05/02/07, 10:15 PM

Originally Posted by Footspeedy

While Ice barrier is amazing for solo pvp, it is much much less important in arenas were a healer can spend ~200-300 mana to heal you for 1000, and you can spend 500~ on the same amount, giving healers superior regen, and the length of some games when both sides have a healer having a mage that doesnt have to run away as early to drink or hide behind a pillar to evo gives you a big advantage. Ice barrier just runs you out of mana, if your being assisted hard enuff to mash icebarrier you should probbaly just iceblock (Dieing in the global sucks). While it may save you once in a while, I much prefer a 40/21 build that is centered around scorches for higher sustained damage and mana effeciency.

However if a team has decided to leave a pet on you to keep your casts down then ice barrier is invaluable since frost has no anti interuption.

• frmorrison · 05/02/07, 10:31 PM

Originally Posted by Darkmantle

However if a team has decided to leave a pet on you to keep your casts down then ice barrier is invaluable since frost has no anti interuption.

2 Piece Tier 4 will give that, as well as Mana Shield.

Xunwael · 05/02/07, 10:45 PM

Yes, mana shield is a wonderful application in PvP. If you want your frostbolts to cost 2000 mana and an extra global cooldown per cast, then mana shield is your friend. Otherwise, never use it.

Footspeedy · 05/03/07, 12:34 AM

However if a team has decided to leave a pet on you to keep your casts down then ice barrier is invaluable since frost has no anti interuption.

Elementalists almost NEVER cast full rank frostbolt, especially with burning soul's 70% uninterruption of scorch (our most mobile nuke).

Darkmantle · 05/03/07, 2:58 AM

Originally Posted by Footspeedy

Elementalists almost NEVER cast full rank frostbolt, especially with burning soul's 70% uninterruption of scorch (our most mobile nuke).

Good point and with conc aura it will go up 100% which is just so wonderful to be able to finish someone else off when you have a rogue/warrior on you.

I suppose I was thinking that anyone that had 30 in frost in likely to cast frostbolts and so in the context of the tree it is good. Rather than evaluating it in terms of using a 21 frost build with scroch instead.

oldirtybasti · 05/03/07, 7:22 AM

Regarding the mana problems in the other elementalist threads: When i played elementalist, i found the Mark of Defiance quite useful to counter mana problems. An average of 150 mana back with a proc chance of 15% translates to roughly 12.5% reduced mana costs for scorch excluding Master of Elements. Remember that this single item is better than 5/5 Clearcast when scorching.

Drully · 05/03/07, 7:56 AM

You guys forget, that the elementalist is most likely played in 2v2 and 3v3 as well as any BG.
Depending on your team set up, frost barrier can be HUGE to avoid a quick ice block. And even in 5v5 it adds to survivability. Sure, it is not as cheap as a heal spell, but better than dying and its an instant the mage controlls himself.
It is a powerfull spell, espacially in 1v1 situations.

stealthmoe · 05/03/07, 3:52 PM

great replies, still got 1 mroe day or PVE till i can test this out

• frmorrison · 05/03/07, 7:16 PM

36/25 seems to me to be the best Elementalist build, but 30/31 seems too.

Are there any other ones that people have used with success or other Mages with experience using earlier one of those builds?

Drully · 05/03/07, 8:31 PM

Originally Posted by Maligne

There's already a thread:

[Mage] The Elementalist

Also some discussion here:

Mage PvP Thread (or: Ice Block, discuss)

Your build looks pretty solid. I would pick up imp cone of cold and master of elements though.

Drully hit the nail on the head - this build shines in battlegrounds and 2's and 3's. For 5's Arcane/Frost is still uncontested.

http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/#c...27jaeden&n=Jcg is his 30/31 build and more infos are in the links..., considering the frostbite nerv, and the fact that he, and one in general, hardly uses frostbolt, i would drop frostbite all together.

Maligne · 05/03/07, 11:21 PM

Originally Posted by Drully

http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/#c...27jaeden&n=Jcg is his 30/31 build and more infos are in the links..., considering the frostbite nerv, and the fact that he, and one in general, hardly uses frostbolt, i would drop frostbite all together.

Yeah, next respec I'm definitely not maxing frostbite. I'll probably get permafrost, as it's really nice to keep healers from playing LOS games in the arena.

Are there any other ones that people have used with success or other Mages with experience using earlier one of those builds?

Something like this (38/23) would give you a little more kick and some PVE viability with molten fury and combustion. If I didn't do battlegrounds or world pvp that's probably what I'd be. But at the moment ice barrier is pretty great for solo play, plus it's getting a new rank next patch.

Cel · 05/04/07, 9:49 AM

From a rogue perspective fighting an Elementalist mage is the worst of the 3 specs when in small groups. Watching them Ice Block an inch from death, catching a heal, then procing Blazing Speed, dropping a Blastwave and running off to safety is so terribly frustrating.

Maligne · 05/04/07, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by Cel

From a rogue perspective fighting an Elementalist mage is the worst of the 3 specs when in small groups. Watching them Ice Block an inch from death, catching a heal, then procing Blazing Speed, dropping a Blastwave and running off to safety is so terribly frustrating.

Not to mention multiple impact procs off molten armor. Rogues are incredibly easy for me now as long as I have an iceblock. Warriors are actually giving me the most trouble - I have to be extremely careful with them.

Tommybooy · 05/04/07, 2:56 PM

I havn't seen this build, but it looks good to me.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=RZVgG0bZVVGcofxsbot

You get most of the good frost talents, while still getting points to help your scorch damage. Impact, and Imp Fb are great for pvp. I havn't tried it, but IMO it looks solid.

Drully · 05/04/07, 3:10 PM

Originally Posted by Maligne

Not to mention multiple impact procs off molten armor. Rogues are incredibly easy for me now as long as I have an iceblock. Warriors are actually giving me the most trouble - I have to be extremely careful with them.

uiiiiii? Molten procs impact???? iiiik, respeccing right now!!!

Maligne · 05/04/07, 3:16 PM

Originally Posted by Tommybooy

I havn't seen this build, but it looks good to me.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=RZVgG0bZVVGcofxsbot

You get most of the good frost talents, while still getting points to help your scorch damage. Impact, and Imp Fb are great for pvp. I havn't tried it, but IMO it looks solid.

Yeah, with the artic winds change I would probably do something like 0/10/51 if I ever got serious with PVE again or my arena teams went to an endurance strategy. What scares me about using frost to do your damage though is you rely on big crits in a time where 250-300 resilienece is not uncommon. It's also much more of a "precision" spec in the sense that proper use of the elemental and novas is key.

uiiiiii? Molten procs impact???? iiiik, respeccing right now!!!

It's a beautiful thing, but really only against rogues. Warriors don't swing fast enough to make it worth it over ice armor, and if you're not careful you'll ignite your sheep target (though that's supposed to get fixed in 2.1).

Drully · 05/04/07, 3:38 PM

Hm, sitting on my next specc which will definitly include impact. Rogues are my biggest problem right now, well, and hunters.
I would also like to get some brakes from hunter pets, I hate to throw away frost novas for them.
What is the exact effect of the "dazing" of the blast wave?

Cel · 05/04/07, 3:44 PM

Originally Posted by Drully

Hm, sitting on my next specc which will definitly include impact. Rogues are my biggest problem right now, well, and hunters.
I would also like to get some brakes from hunter pets, I hate to throw away frost novas for them.
What is the exact effect of the "dazing" of the blast wave?

It's a slowing effect.