ol'man willow

I would try staying on the DK open with a sap on the healer then stun the DK dismantle him then evasion. Just keep doing max damage and incapacitates to keep your damage to him higher than his damage to you. disarm as often as possible etc ... try to use blinds on the healer to force mana inefficiency and keep the pressure up on the DK. Use gouge on the DK to separate and possibly LOS to restealth and reopen on him. I think the key is to control the DK and minimize his damage while maintaining semi constant damage on him thus allowing your priest to win the mana war.

 

Boxerr

This is my first post so cut me some slack if I screw up on something. First, a little bit about myself. I have been playing this game for just over 2 months and am loving the PvP scene. My friends told me to level as fast as I could because the game really started at lvl 80. So, I got to 80 in about 4 weeks and dove right into raiding and such. Over the past month I have accumulated some fairly decent gear(2/4 T7.5, 1/4 T8.5, MH KTreach, OH Murder) I can pull around 5k on patchwork 25man. However, after a month or raiding I was getting a little bored and was looking towards PvP. Now, befor I played WoW I was playing halo 3 at a fairly competitive level, so I know how to handle pressure and be "clutch." So, my friend who I know in RL was a lock and we did some skirmishs together and thought it was really fun. He is a Destro lock and I am a standard spec MUT rogue, so with our burst we can take down most people we play in the skirmishs that arent amazing. Normally, we CC the healer and burst the dps as fast as we can. And when it comes to double dps against double dps we almost always win with the CCs also. This strat has gotten us to about 1600 rating. However, getting into the higher rating we come across some teams like Arms Warrior/Holy Palli. So when we try to CC the palli he can trinket out and still have bubble as backup or he will bubble right away and then we cant do shit to him as he heals the spinning warrior coming towards are squishy selves. Finally, my essential questions are what are some tips for us, and what can we do for the combos stated above?

 

Chaggi

Typing in paragraphs helps. A lot. Armoring you, it looks like you have half decent gear. Your warlock should get more PvP gear though. The ones I PvP with have 700~ Resilience.

I would wait out the bubble and control again.

 

Troisloeil

On a somewhat related subject, does anyone actually understand the logic behind the Nitro nerf? First they knock the duration down to 2 seconds, OK, sucks, but I'll live with it. The given reason was that they we're to powerful in PvP. So they dropped it's duration down, increased the CD, and added a Crit bonus to balance it out. Now they've disabled them completely in Arena & BG's, ostensibly for the same reason.

"Huh?" Outside of helping me close with a target that's just out of range, how exactly is this out of balance on the PvP side? The given logic doesn't seem to mesh with reality. What's next, my Pyro Rocket? The direction they're moving, it suggests that if I can create an actual, non-passive, usable item, it's better then a passive buff, regardless of the relative power level of the effect?
There's no way the piddling few things I can make as an Engineer, compare in actual value, with something like the ring enchants, extra gem slots, special item buffs, etc, offered by other professions.

Any insight is appreciated.

 

Chaggi

Honestly, I have no idea. I think Blizzard's stance (at least on the Goggles) was that they didn't want a Profession to be so dominating in one aspect of the game (PvP). If you wanted to be a competitive PvPer as a Rogue, you needed the Goggles. The boots were just extra. I think that's probably part of the reason for the nerf.

 

ol'man willow

3.1.3 just changed the way that over kill works, which changes the way our burst works as mutiprep. I felt a reduction in burst, and an inability to make use of the entirety of the duration of overkill. It may somehow have been a buff in pve but in pvp that nerf hurt me pretty bad. As a result my question is, does anyone this SHS hemo should come back as a result of this. Muti burst is no longer as quick or easy due to the change. SHS has premed/cold blood which can lead to a fairly fast evis crit and has better mobility and higher attack power. With the rebuffing of hemo is this the way to go? Should I put down my daggers for my sword?

 

Chaggi

You have essentially 3 Overkills. 1 from start, and 2 from Prep Vanishes. I don't know what comp you play, but I don't think that the Overkill "nerf" is bad enough to switch over to ShS/Hemo. It still has the problems that it did in TBC, and without Deadly Brew, I'd find life a lot harder.

 

Grunge

Well, hyper accelerators are very comparable to other professions (~~103ep value with my gear) in PvE, and for PvP the rocket gloves themselves are worth the profession.
While I only had the boots for 3 or so weeks, I didn't really feel the need for them.
I believe that the nerf was due to other classes that lacked a close-gap ability.

Also Blizzard said that the boots might not be dead and buried and that they'd like to bring it back at some point in some incarnation.
In the meantime enjoy the rockets.

Fans glory to the Gladiators,
Gods glory to the Heroes.

 

Tower

As for the boots, honestly I think it was a rogue/priest nerf, just link the hotfix to fear and blind being on the same DR. Rocket boots on a priest pretty much guaranteed a fear on your opponent. Just dispel or wait for a snare to wear off then zoom in and fear. It's amazing how fast developers smack down priest/rogue compared to the ever dominant healer/dk that's looking to go for 2 seasons of dominance, sure to make it three.

I haven't done any 2s since the Overkill "balancing". Sure will be nice not dying to Human rogues nearly as often by losing the opener and getting vastly behind in cooldowns because of Perception, but obviously a big hurt to beating those ever prominent healer/plate teams.

 

Twistedfortune

Can anyone run the math on this pvp spec for me and which one you may find will deal more damage.

I know this is the standard cookie cutter spec

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

But what about this?

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Would the switch to give you 60-75% chance to land an instant poison on your off hand, while running wound on mainhand deal more damage then relying on the 4% bonus damage to offensive skills and 2 energy on your crits? I would think that burst wise you would get more damage out of the instant poison offhand since the nerf to mindnumbing im more interested in running with 2 damage poisons. Or possibly putting Instant on MH and wound for OH

Anyone able to run math on this? because considering this isnt pve, and since people have resilience i would think the chance of getting 2energy procs to be lower then it would in pve hence having the switch in those 5 talents deal more damage.

Any feedback on my idea? (Sorry if this was suggested before i couldnt find a post like this)

 

Awshlia

Pretty sure EJ isn't about doing things FOR you.

On that note, can somebody do something for me?

I'm running resto druid (me), ret pally, rogue 3's, and we're doing OK, but the rogue dies fast. I don't want to tell him how to play, but he's trying to play like a warrior and I can't heal him through it- it leaves the ret pally and me to 2 v 3 the battles, which sometimes we win and sometimes we don't. I've been trying to find a good video (with commentary, if available) of a rogue that plays "garrote, rupture, run" strat, if that's a viable strat (which I think it is). Does anybody have a link to a video that they think is a good rogue? I've searched a bit of youtube and wowmovies, but so far, to no avail.

 

Valustria

A rogue's bleeds are far from enough damage to get the job done or even contribute meaningfully if he's just running away afterwards. Bleeds are what you can use to whittle down plate that can't heal after you've used all your stuns and disarms and Vanish to avoid going toe-to-toe with a Mortal Strike or Obliterate.

It'd be better for him to think of himself as intense pressure that can force mistakes when applied to the right target. Stunning and beating on their healer while your Retty smashes another target, for instance, can put the healer in a situation where he's gotta choose between healing himself or his teammate. If he staggers or makes the wrong choice, you get a kill. If he doesn't, your rogue friend needs to use what tools he has to reset the fight or force those kinds of mistakes. The best way to do that is rarely ever to stand there and play warrior while something in plate beats the shit out of you.

P.S. If I come across a video that might help you, I'll let you know. = )

"In emptiness there is good, but no evil. Wisdom exists, logic exists, the way exists, and the mind is empty."
~ Miyamoto Musashi, The Scroll of Emptiness, The Book of Five Rings

 

Rmxr

Could anyone give me some advice on how much Resi you should normally have in 3v3?(RMP), In my PvP gear which is hate/deadly/furi(4/5) i have about 470 and i wonder if i should swap some of my t8 Conq into that for more burst or get more pvp gear? btw talking about 1850+ rating.

Thanks

 

Awshlia

This is usually the strat that we do, or else I cyclone healer a few times and we get the kill. The trouble comes when their DPS focuses my rogue. He's sitting around 650 resil so he could certainly use more, but he just has trouble getting away (mainly warrs or rogues). When their team has a rogue, he usually sits in stealth and waits for their rogue to pop, but the tables always turn and he ends up cheapshotted, then kidneyshotted, then dead. Is this a skill discrepancy perhaps?

 

streaka

Well to gain the advantage in stealth vs stealth, is the goggles and clever macro's designed to attack/sap stealthed players as soon as possible. For example:

#showtooltip Sap
/targetenemy [noexists]
/cast Sap
/cleartarget

That macro should help alot, can be altered easily to fit his personal needs if wanted.

 

Awshlia

Thanks, I'll pass that on to him. Although this video may have been shared already, I wanted to link it. It's a commentary on macros and seems pretty helpful. Since I have long since retired my rogue, I'm not sure how current and useful this movie is, but it looks to be good.

 

Valustria

A still rogue is as good as a dead rogue, even stealthed. I don't know how many times I pass other rogues in stealth, and there are a lot of factors that decide who gets the sap -- racial bonuses to stealth/detection, connection speed, macros, etc. -- but there are plenty of times we pass each other like ships in the night, with no more than a glimpse and the sound that tells us we saw something, but it's not there anymore...

"In emptiness there is good, but no evil. Wisdom exists, logic exists, the way exists, and the mind is empty."
~ Miyamoto Musashi, The Scroll of Emptiness, The Book of Five Rings

 

Offelia, Rogue

It’s not so bad, I rely a lot on timing my AR correctly (which I don’t always pull off) and using Shiv to keep them slow while I’m fast. It’s been working pretty well but yes, I do get caught out on occasion.

 

Troisloeil

I modified my spec somewhat for exactly this reason. I found myself way to energy staved. I haven't experimented yet with balancing the points differently to get the same effect. Vitality seemed to be the key talent.

The World of Warcraft Armory

Damage is solid, I find I can burst down most all except plate if I get the open, but as far as I can tell, this spec requires a healer to be viable. It seems a Pally or Druid is best. I find I can live through a stunlock long enough to execute a tactical escape, but you're really gonna need a heal.

With enough resilience, I've find the spec incredibly tough.

 

rknDA1337

Hi all, I'm new to this forum. Anyway, I'm in need of some friendly advice.

Me and my friend have been playing some dual rogue 2on2s, and he likes to play with mostly PvP-gear while I insist on using PvE-gear for the burst, because that's what we live on, right? Anyway, his stubbornness have made me question what is really the best way to go with our setup. We both play 41/5/25.

tl;dr: Should we try to max our PvP or PvE gear as dual rogue setup? Or just a mixture?

I realize some PvP gear is probably better burst than most of the PvE-gear available (furious>t7.5?), but some clarification on the subject would be nice.

 

Chaggi

I'd wear 4/5 Furious and maybe some off pieces. PvE is great, but in the end, you're looking at maybe a few hundred AP less, with a lot less damage taken. Rogue/Rogue fights are about mangaging your CDs and resetting fights after blowing the other team's defensive CD's. That does mean tanking, and not just going in there to gib someone.

I'd probably keep around 600~ resilience, maybe 700.

I'm looking at your spec and I don't understand a few of your points. Specifically why Throwing Spec over Nerves of Steel. You're going to get opened on much more without a full MoD (which you should have, I'm not sure why you bother with 2/3) and HS. I'm also not sure why you spec'd only 1/2 into Imp Sap and yet 2/2 in Sleight of Hand.

Also I'm not sure if where you're getting the bursting down most all except plate. I assume BG because it doesn't look like you have any games played in arena.

I tried Combat earlier in the season, and I found it to be quite hard to play, difficult to execute, and worse results compared to Mutilate. I play with a Holy Paladin too, so it's not necessarily my partner's fault. Poisons are hard to keep on, and you have to Shiv to make sure Cripp stays on. Your real burst, is simply KS. You need a weapon switch macro to switch your swords to get a slow/slow while keeping slow/fast while normal.

The only good part of this spec that I saw, is going toe to toe with some Rogues through Evasion. Being able to KS through Evasion is priceless. That being said, I don't think it's worth it.

 

Ozzmar

Hey gents!

I was poking around on Arena Junkies and saw a thread about a Shadowstep Hemo spec, something like this:

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Since the Overkill change, the burst of Mutilate has decreased slightly (although the energy regeneration for 20 sec is nothing to sneeze at). On top of that, when I quit raiding, I was left with only [Twilight Mist] and [Murder] for Mutilate weapons, whereas I managed to score [Malice] from Ulduar which would be a great Hemorrhage main hand (would offhand [Webbed Death]).

I typically do 2v2 with a Resto druid, and I was thinking the little extra mobility from Shadowstep out of snares might come in handy as the matches that seem to give us the most trouble typically involve a Death Knight or Frost Mage kiting me around. Mutilate has done well enough for me, but I don't see myself getting an 1800 rating for Gladiator weapons anytime soon, and I would like to use the 179 DPS sword I have.

Any thoughts on anything at all? Talents, Glyphs, strategies? Is Mutilate with my inferior Naxx weapons still going to outperform Hemo with a much higher DPS weapon?

Much thanks in advance guys!

 

Cos-

Hemo has freakishly bad pressure, I'd never use it with a druid healer. If you don't want to do mutilate with your daggers get the blue sword from Knights of the Ebon Blade for an offhand then go Killing Spree.

 

Hildegard

Unmercy used a trick called "Instant Trinket" in his latest Video Unmercey 7: Hana By Unmercey My question is about this trick (used about seven minutes in the video). I just don't really get, what he is doing there. Ming wrote the following in his blog WoW Riot | WotLK, Wrath of the Lich King, WoW, World of Warcraft, Arena Season 5 "a very nifty trick to health stone + trinket spam to trinket a stun the millisecond it lands".

Anyone care to elaborate ?

Edit:
As it seems the trick works as follows. You need full health and a health pot oder health stone (which means only warlock teams and alchemists can do that in the arena). You create a castsequence macro for using the health stone and then the pvp trinket. The castsequence cancels as long as you have full health and pops the very second the stun is applied.

If this is the correct explanation this trick costs you the health stone.

Edit 2:
After watching the video multiple times frame by frame it seems that he is actually channeling the hearth stone. "another action is in progress" shows as error text. Seems like a duell-only trick to instantly trinket and Vanish during rogue duells with alternating openers.

Hildegard Sprigglespruxx - Wissenschaftlerin am Institut für Pfuschkunde

http://forscherliga.wikia.com/wiki/Hildegard

 

Zoephobia

At the beginning I just thought him to be showing off completely inhuman reactions - neilyo-style. However there does seem to be a real trick there.
Although one duel he does it to a blind, when he hasn't lost any hp so you're version cannot be correct. I'll look into this later today, when I have time.
Edit says: That trick however wouldn't work on a more classical sap => cs opener. In that case one may have to revert to the healthstone version.
(btw: <= Kage ausm inwow)