[Druid] The Resto PVP Thread - Page 2

Zure · 07/30/07, 11:51 PM

Also, you can easily have fun in the arena with less than amazing gear. Knowing how to maximize your class is worth thousands of HP. Eventually you'll start running into teams that have both the skill and the gear and hit a wall, but I wouldn't forego the arena just because you don't have 10k hp, 300 resil.

All that being said, your gear now is just awful. You'd probably be off in all "of the Physician" lvl 70 greens!

Shifting the discussion some:

I have a huge problem with stunlocks, I am pretty much forced to burn NS off the bat if a rogue opens on me. Does everyone wait for the KS to trinket as I do, or trinket immediately to force a shorter duration stun?

I also have problems starting the match in cat. Ideally, I would get a pounce off but it's just excuriatingly slow to move in stealth and the cat hitbox seems tiny. I have had some luck with popping dash, but ideally I would save that for an important escape situation. Any tips?

Currylaksa · 07/31/07, 12:51 AM

I myself am learning to play in arena. I normally dash for the pounce, got sick of looking like a moron trying to get into the hitbox

The dilemma right now is what to put in the gladiator gem slots.

+8 resilience (mystic dawnstone)
+12 stamina (solid star of elune)
+9 healing 2 mp5 (royal nightseye)
+9 healing 4 int (luminous noble topaz)

Sort of leaning towards noble topaz. Is it a good idea to start looking into mana pool and healing once reaching the cutoff point of 10k HP and 300 resilience?

Herrera · 07/31/07, 4:28 AM

Originally Posted by DecimusGarona

No it does not, you can't be mana burned in feral forms.

You can be burned in travel form, you can't in cat/bear _unless_ mana burn started casting while you were caster form.

Miaw · 07/31/07, 7:52 AM

Originally Posted by Herrera

You can be burned in travel form, you can't in cat/bear _unless_ mana burn started casting while you were caster form.

It still won't burn. The only mana you will loose is the cost of shifting into your feral form.

and the good thing about shifting to prevent mana burn, is that the mana burn still goes off, meaning the priest will loose the mana cost of it.

Herrera · 07/31/07, 8:00 AM

Oh, didn't know that. Just yesterday I mana burned a druid who catshifted mid-cast and Mana Burn went off, but I had no idea it didn't affect it. Does this affect travel form, too? I can't recall for sure.

Miaw · 07/31/07, 8:06 AM

Nope, in travel form you still get burned, unfortunately.

Nitz · 07/31/07, 8:22 AM

Simply put, if you have a mana bar you will be burned. The only two options to not have a mana bar as a druid are the bear and cat form.

• Maligne · 07/31/07, 9:41 AM

Originally Posted by Currylaksa

HT is not bad, if you know when to use it in the presence of trigger-finger dispellers. The real reason is we don't have the spare 7 talent points for healing touch.

I could be wrong, but I believe that 23/38 locks are better off with Paladins. Without treeform, resto druid mana can't sustain an attrition fight. An affliction or demo would suit you better as you aim to burst down one within a couple cyclone-fears.

Well, you have to really decide whether you want to play resto fulltime since the gearing up part will test your resolve. Because arena with anything less is a quick gib.

Head: Spirit shard turn-in Exorcist's Wyrmhide Helm - Items - World of Warcraft
Neck: Veteran Salvation
Shoulder: HWL Kodohide
Back: Honor reward
Chest: The Netherstorm quest reward Lifewarden's Breastplate - Items - World of Warcraft
Bracer: Veteran Kodohide
1H: Dagger from 3rd boss Botanica Runed Dagger of Solace - Items - World of Warcraft
OH: Anything with +sta and +healing from AH
Relic: Nagrand quest reward Harold's Rejuvenating Broach - Items - World of Warcraft
Glove: HWL Kodohide
Belt: Veteran Kodohide
Pants: halaa token turn-in Dreamstalker Leggings - Items - World of Warcraft
Boots: Veteran Kodohide
Ring1: Veteran Salvation
Ring2: Veteran Dominance, Seal of the Exorcist or the Karazhan rep ring
Trinket1: Medallion of the Horde
Trinket2: I recommend the Talisman of the Horde

Awesome, thanks for that. I'll be picking up the chestpiece and hopefully the dagger ASAP.

Last night I tried some 2v2s each with the warrior/rogue/warlock. It wasn't pretty. In general we had the most success when there wasn't a healer, as I could easily keep both of us up long enough for my DPS to kill one. With the warrior even teams with healers were pretty easy (went 6 and 4), as we just put him on the healer while I cycloned/rooted the DPS. I only got to play 7 with the rogue and they weren't so great because we kept getting melee/healer combos in which my 7k health/7k mana is not just enough to win out against Gladiator geared opponents.

The comments in this thread are spot on about the warlock too - afflicition/soul link just doesn't have enough "oomph" to take someone out quickly, and there's no way I'm winning a mana battle with my gear. These were some of the longest and most painful games. I'm going to suggest he goes UA - I was the one getting focused anyway.

I learned a lot though, most importantly that if you ever find yourself taking your season 2 gear for granted, try playing an alt in greens. It will put things into perspective very quickly.

Persian · 07/31/07, 9:45 AM

Originally Posted by DecimusGarona

No it does not, you can't be mana burned in feral forms.

The poster below you said that travel form can be mana burned, I suppose I'll have to test if it's the exception or rule.

What about mana drain on a feral, it still drains mana, yes?

DecimusGarona · 07/31/07, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by Persian

The poster below you said that travel form can be mana burned, I suppose I'll have to test if it's the exception or rule.

What about mana drain on a feral, it still drains mana, yes?

As has already been said, if you don't have a mana bar (read: you are in cat/bear form) you cannot be mana burned under any circumstances - your mana bar does not exist as far as game mechanics other than mana regeneration are concerned. When I said feral forms, what I really meant was feral combat forms, sorry for the misunderstanding.

Zure · 07/31/07, 1:53 PM

The astute player will recall that one's mana bar still displays while one is in travel form -- and indeed why shouldn't it, as travel form uses neither energy nor rage?

I have never heard of mana burn working so long as it was cast before the druid shifted into cat/bear, but have not tested it in the most recent patch. Quite frankly I suspect the poster of that comment conflated being able to cast mana burn with mana burn actually having any effect.

Unraveller · 07/31/07, 1:59 PM

Serious question:
Why does everyone have 2 points in Living Spirit!?!?

High end druid PVP gear has NO spirit, in a lot of cases these 2 talent points are granting a grand total of +10 Spirit!

So, my question is, why aren't these points in Feral Swiftness (Movement speed and dodge) or Feral Instincts (stealth level)?

I think we might start seeing the switch to 8/13/40 in the future, as this realization becomes common place.

Grymm · 07/31/07, 2:34 PM

I'm thinking of busting out my bal/resto hybrid druid for some PVP action (at least on a low level). My perspective partner would actually be a well geared main soul link warlock. He serves as the caster tank in raiding so already has plenty of hp (albeit no resilience).

The nice thing about the 33/0/28 spec I use for raiding low end stuff like Karazhan is the strong healing touches and mana efficiency. While I don't have the strongest hots, I think the soul link warlock covers for this as I can hot his pet and him for double healing - though the pet shouldn't need as much unless it is being focused.

The downside is, using mostly high 5 man blues and a couple Karazhan epics, my druid has very low HP. I'd have to play the hiding game until the warlock is being focused on and has one opponent feared or deathcoiled. That would almost require me blowing NS when coming out of stealth which is not as smart with a team make up better suited for outlast. Luckily, our goals are pretty modest.

Is anyone PVPing well with a build that doesn't include feral charge?

• Maligne · 07/31/07, 2:42 PM

Originally Posted by Unraveller

Serious question:
Why does everyone have 2 points in Living Spirit!?!?

High end druid PVP gear has NO spirit, in a lot of cases these 2 talent points are granting a grand total of +10 Spirit!

So, my question is, why aren't these points in Feral Swiftness (Movement speed and dodge) or Feral Instincts (stealth level)?

I think we might start seeing the switch to 8/13/40 in the future, as this realization becomes common place.

I don't have living spirit, and haven't really seen anyone else who does in this sort of build. I agree it's worthless, and instead put 1 point in Tree form because hey, for one point it's incredibly useful if you ever PVE, and I just threw the other extra point into Subtlety.

Unraveller · 07/31/07, 2:52 PM

Originally Posted by Maligne

I don't have living spirit, and haven't really seen anyone else who does in this sort of build. I agree it's worthless, and instead put 1 point in Tree form because hey, for one point it's incredibly useful if you ever PVE, and I just threw the other extra point into Subtlety.

If you check the top20 or so 2 on 2 resto druids, most of them throw away at least 1 point in LS, and I have no idea why! Although, I am starting to see some 8/13/40 creeping up the charts...

On the Feral Tree, the split seems to be even between Feral Instincts (better stealth) and Thick Hide (10% armor). So, why not take Both and skip living spirit. Although I agree, subtlety might be a better use... 8% reduce dispel seems lack-luster.

DecimusGarona · 07/31/07, 4:29 PM

Originally Posted by Unraveller

If you check the top20 or so 2 on 2 resto druids, most of them throw away at least 1 point in LS, and I have no idea why! Although, I am starting to see some 8/13/40 creeping up the charts...

On the Feral Tree, the split seems to be even between Feral Instincts (better stealth) and Thick Hide (10% armor). So, why not take Both and skip living spirit. Although I agree, subtlety might be a better use... 8% reduce dispel seems lack-luster.

It might just be because a lot of the top end PvP restoration druids also happen to PvE as well...

• Zyla · 07/31/07, 9:25 PM

Originally Posted by diotox

Good, I've been wanting to ask this for a while now but didn't really have a relevant thread to post it in. A good RL friend of mine just hit 70 on his druid a couple of weeks ago and he really likes to pvp. The problem though is that he's very casual, doesn't ever read about the game outside the game, and is overall very ignorant of most game mechanics. He's been hounding me to play 2v2 arena with him, and I don't mind too much(I massively outgear 1500-1600 rating players for the most part so it's mildly amusing), but what I do mind is that I cannot seem to explain certain things so that he understands them. Things like how counterspell works, what a felhunter can do, and most importantly, kiting. To give you some more perspective on this guy, I got a huge earful about how "It's bullshit that priests get AE fear, that's not fair." I had to bite my tongue on that one.

Is there a druid kiting for dummies FAQ anywhere I can point him to? Or perhaps a good pvp video I could refer him to that preferably isn't really huge? I referred him to the Fat Cow videos, but he just rebuked me because those "are 700 MB and take way too long to download." Sigh. The stickied thread on the official druid forums seemed like it was aimed mostly at sub level 70 players. Heck, even any minor tips and tricks you guys learned that might seem like common knowledge would be appreciated.

I wrote up a little bit of it on the blog I've started at : Blog Archives | GAMERIOT

Currylaksa · 07/31/07, 9:57 PM

Originally Posted by Unraveller

Serious question:
Why does everyone have 2 points in Living Spirit!?!?

High end druid PVP gear has NO spirit, in a lot of cases these 2 talent points are granting a grand total of +10 Spirit!

So, my question is, why aren't these points in Feral Swiftness (Movement speed and dodge) or Feral Instincts (stealth level)?

I think we might start seeing the switch to 8/13/40 in the future, as this realization becomes common place.

The answer is pretty obvious, druids gotta raid too

But if you can abandon treeform, 12/11/38 is the popular spec of pure-play arena restos. Extra 6yd range on CCs makes a big difference.

Davidson · 08/01/07, 2:36 AM

Originally Posted by dantae

I play 2v2 with a warrior generally and we've run into issues against frost mage/rogue teams. I don't really see any reliable way to beat them, I can stay in stealth long enough for them to open on my warrior at which point I have to NS because I can't risk a CS if the mage is quick enough, then they just go on me, I'm down NS and between stuns and freezes/slows from both of them I just can't get away fast enough. I can't really cyclone either because a CS = game over. I have a little over 10k hp and 375ish resil, but I still drop so fast it's not funny. Am I doing something glaringly wrong or is it just one of those combos I have to stop queuing against?

Have the warrior kill the rogue, without heals he will fall over like a sack of bricks. To keep the dmg down on the warrior, open with cyclone from stealth on the mage, then you can either re-cyclone him, or feral charge. By the time all that is done, the rogue is probably dead, or almost dead.

Unraveller · 08/01/07, 1:18 PM

Originally Posted by Currylaksa

The answer is pretty obvious, druids gotta raid too

But if you can abandon treeform, 12/11/38 is the popular spec of pure-play arena restos. Extra 6yd range on CCs makes a big difference.

I doubt this... I lot of druids are Feral for raiding. Complete respecs are required. The 12/11/38 is interesting, but completely lacking from high end druid specs, so I don't think people are willing to give up a single point in their Improved HoT's, and it's our bread and butter so I am not surprised.

Siddown · 08/02/07, 2:52 AM

Originally Posted by Unraveller

I doubt this... I lot of druids are Feral for raiding. Complete respecs are required. The 12/11/38 is interesting, but completely lacking from high end druid specs, so I don't think people are willing to give up a single point in their Improved HoT's, and it's our bread and butter so I am not surprised.

You have to understand that if one person has success with something and is well respected by at least a portion of the community he is part of, people willl follow their lead. From what I can remember, Mookysolo talks about this build and even broke down the math on the Druid Forums about how the extra 6 yards on your CC is more inportant than an Improved HoT.

Not saying it's right, but you'd be amazed at what becomes popular based solely on the person who advocates it.

Zure · 08/02/07, 2:33 PM

I'd like to get some opinions on cloak enchants:

Armor, shadow resist, and all resists seem like decent choices, but I'm considering 20 spell pen.

Anyone with MOTW, or any warlock, nightelf or tauren target has nature resist, which can occassionally frustrate CC. Any thoughts on this?

Unraveller · 08/02/07, 2:39 PM

Originally Posted by Zure

I'd like to get some opinions on cloak enchants:

Armor, shadow resist, and all resists seem like decent choices, but I'm considering 20 spell pen.

Anyone with MOTW, or any warlock, nightelf or tauren target has nature resist, which can occassionally frustrate CC. Any thoughts on this?

I went with +20 Spell penetration. Having your Cyclone/Roots resisted can be a major pain. Most of the high level druids seem to have it on their cloaks.