2.4s possibilities to mix raid/arena gear?

Madlax · 02/12/08, 12:02 PM

Preword: I found this to be more fitting in the PvP forums than the Public discussion.

I haven´t seen any comments on the 2.4 change towards 8 part tier6 by now, so I´ll throw my thoughts up ahead:
CTProfiles.net: World of Warcraft Profiles � Madlax � Arena
+18stamina/20resi to head enchant.
+70 resilience from both set bonus
---
425 resilience without bracers/boots/belt

The 3 remaining Malefic items provide 24-30 resilience(epic gems ye) and a total of 120! non-enchanted stamina.

Totalling it all up, including stamina enchants(12/boars) on bracers and boots:
455 resilience
849 spelldam + soulfrost enchant
79 spellhaste
177 crit rating
829 stamina(no demonic embrace)
and for the top of it both T6 bonus.

From my warlocks point of view, i´d have to say this is quite good.

Just looking over the other classes T6 bonus I found
Shadowpriest 2part
Healing Pala 2/4part
Mages 4part
Warrior 4part
Rogue 4part
Elemental shaman 2/4part
interesting as well.

If anyone has made up his thoughts on this matter I´d appreciate input.

Kasi · 02/12/08, 12:19 PM

Wouldn't really work well for elemental shamans. We have to have the 4 piece arena bonus. Which means that we'd have to go 4 piece (likely head, legs, chest, and of course gloves) and then go shoulders, belt, bracers, boots for the 4 piece. The 2 piece is useless since you'd never have all 4 totems down for any length of time. So you're giving up a bunch of resilience for 5% more damage on LB. I just don't think its really viable since you'd be under 300 resilience with this setup.

Nutters · 02/12/08, 12:58 PM

These gear compositions are going to be VERY VERY strong it seems. Also already with 3 new pieces of t6 dropping on PTR within days of it's arrival, when patch goes live this stuff is going to be happening after the first raid few nights. It appears that this will be a large advantage to raiders in arena. Certainly Blizzard didn't miss this, we'll just have to see what else the patch will bring us.

I think making honor bracer/belt/boots into a set or ring/neck into a set (or both?) and adding some similar level bonuses would be an interesting way to offset this.

Tamonten · 02/12/08, 1:08 PM

This seems very viable for warriors, who don't particularly need to run with a lot of resiliance. This, combine with a build incorporating improved MS, would have warriors with the reduced intercept time, +35 resiliance bonus, -rage on both hamstring and execute, and 10% increased MS damage.

Mixing sets for casters will be less viable, I think, because they just can't afford to loose the resiliance/armor provided by Arena gear.

Tower · 02/12/08, 1:23 PM

As a PvP only player, I'm really not looking forward to fighting Shadowstep rogues in even more PvE gear, but with more resilience as well. Same with warriors wielding 140dps+ weapons. I'm a little worried this is going to break PvP until the expansion, moreso than resist gear did.

sargsui · 02/12/08, 2:06 PM

As a PvP only player, I'm really not looking forward to fighting Shadowstep rogues in even more PvE gear, but with more resilience as well. Same with warriors wielding 140dps+ weapons. I'm a little worried this is going to break PvP until the expansion, moreso than resist gear did.

I agree. Also, as a PvPer even if you manage to "buy" the new Sunwell parts (guilds will overflow with them fast I think), you still have to get at least one other part for the 4pc, that means getting a guild to drag you through a BT run as well.

It seems like a really bad design decision, widening the gap even more, but we haven't seen any PvP changes yet so I guess we'll see!

holydevil · 02/13/08, 2:10 PM

Yeah, it's stupid. I don't want to have to PvE to be competitive in PvP... same shit all over again.

Angeron · 02/13/08, 9:21 PM

Let's just hope that S4 comes out at the same time as 2.4 and introduces matching upgrades for those item slots.

Grunge · 02/13/08, 10:15 PM

Originally Posted by Angeron

Let's just hope that S4 comes out at the same time as 2.4 and introduces matching upgrades for those item slots.

Problem is that for some classes (rogues in particular) you can equip quite a few PvE items without risking instagib.
I for one will be most likely using 2pc slayers from belt/boots/bracers (a combination) since you give away so little resilience in exchange to a 5% haste on snd+offensive stats.
Even now I'm using several PvE items and so far it hasn't proved a weakness.
There's stuff like [Bladed Chaos Tunic] and [Leggings of the Immortal Night] that I could very well see myself using over S4.

I'm really hoping for season 4 though. waiting on the RNG can be quite a bitch (QQ Illidan, No Warglaive for me!?) and seeing how there's no oh upgrade in Sunwell is kinda sucky.

Lodekim · 02/14/08, 3:12 PM

I see this maybe being viable for some classes, but at least for warriors, to me it seems like a pretty big loss of Resil, for a class that is already getting less on it's gear. I checked the profile of someone in full S3 warrior gear, s3 weapon, all the s3 honor gear, the 20 res trinket, battlemasters trinket, 15 resil chest enchant and 1 10 resil gem, and he still only had 399. Warriors dropping to get the 4 piece bonus are going to have to gem for resilience so much more that it barely seems significant to me. I might be wrong, but just taking off 4 pieces of his gear and keeping the 4 set bonus, that's a loss of 97 resilience, if you use a pve weapon too, that's just not going to fly.

At best I see it as valuable for classes that have worthless 4 piece bonuses on their arena sets. Perhaps some other classes will have enough resilience anyway, but it seems like a pretty big sacrifice for most.

Kasi · 02/14/08, 3:31 PM

It's going to help most for people who have strong 2p T6 bonuses that are useful for pvp. That to me would include hunters, ret pallies, holy pallies, warriors (7 rage executes sound nice), enh shamans, rogues, resto druids, maybe feral druids.

The ones it will be best for is those classes have a really strong 2 piece bonus and a very strong 4 piece bonus from pvp. Resto druids to me seem to top that list. 2 seconds off swiftmend plus their run speed bonus is nice. Warriors and rogues maybe fit in there well too. I think the only classes that are going to be able to really just go with 4 piece t6 is holy paladins and rogues. I could see warriors doing it, but they would have to socket their pvp gear heavily towards resilience to make up for it. Any class who is consistently being focused would just be better off going with 2p t6 or no piece t6.

Darkmantle · 02/14/08, 4:34 PM

From my experience in pvp these days warriors are almost easier to attack than shadowstep rogues. So warriors definately can't go skimping on the resilience too much.

Kasi · 02/14/08, 4:39 PM

Well with socketing with lionseyes (in the pvp gear, I would assume your T7 guild might not like giving you 2 sets of T6 from sunwell with lionsyes in ones and spinels/pyrestones in the other), using the new pvp helm enchant, enchanting chest towards resil, using a pvp weapon (although if you could use that one off Kil'Jaeden no idea why you wouldn't) you should be able to make up the resilience you lose.

Cybelirrae · 02/14/08, 5:04 PM

It will be interesting to see what blizzard does. Since 2.32 effectively forced rogues to go ShS (putting aside the strong mutilate minority for a second), you have a bunch of rogues that are highly mobile, yet have weak overall damage. The ability to scale your AP 200 to 300 points higher than pvp-only rogues without sacrificing much in the way of resilience is indeed a huge advantage. 4 pc slayers/4 pc glad and ShS is going to be very, very strong. Especially with warglaives. In 2 dps 2v2 and RMP teams the pure damage output is going to hit the next level. I do not think this is very fair, but I will enjoy it before it gets nerfed, compensated for.

Kierran · 02/14/08, 7:26 PM

Originally Posted by Angeron

Let's just hope that S4 comes out at the same time as 2.4 and introduces matching upgrades for those item slots.

MMO-Champion lists new Vindicator pendants featuring spell haste. I don't believe any of the old Veteran-class PvP items are still for sale (save the ring, since you can have two rings). The existence of new Vindicator items therefore seems to imply that Season 3 will be around for at least a while longer. Alternatively, they could just be testing the the new pendants under the Vindicator name, with the intention of renaming and upgrading the items for Season 4 when 2.4 drops.