Colan

In case all of you haven't seen all the sunwell loot, here's two items that seem like they'll have a huge impact on arenas come season 3.

http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/...onkaelthas.jpg

http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/...alfocusing.jpg

Now in my opinion, the first trinket definitely has to potential to kill the recent popularity of double melee teams in 3v3 (druid/warrior/rogue, druid/double warrior, druid/warrior/ret paladin etc.) if enough people start using the trinket. While the second trinket can be a major buff to warlocks, despite the 15-17 second internal cooldown that it seems to have, the 400 damage still seems like it'd be very strong in arenas.

Right now, it sure seems like arena will be turned on its head with the coming of 4 piece tier 6/season 3 and Sunwell loot.

 

Darceidus

Changes will always seem more drastic in the minds of anxious players. These items won't be as game-breaking as your thorough research suggests.

 

heel

I expected to see a thread about Vial of the Sunwell, which is going to be absolutely ridiculous for pretty much all healers in all brackets.

 

Suesse

Same here. I think the dodge trinket would be more exciting if they hadn't implemented the gear swapping fix (which I guess was done for resist gear, but you can think of armor/avoidance as the melee equivalent of resist gear).

 

Raiste

meh vial of the sunwell is pretty underwhelming for most classes. Paladins i can see being excited by it for pvp, but a 2k pt heal (1k with MS?) every 1 min even when you are spamming heals seems pretty weak. If the energy accumulated faster maybe it would be a more solid choice all around.

 

Mex

The Vial does seem to have a lot of potential. It's not going to suddenly make double DPS teams redundant or make healer X invincible, but it'll certainly help to minimise co-ordinated CC chains and spell locks. It's not something I'd ever spam on cooldown to try and maximise output, but a 1-3k instant heal (depending on MS and crits) can easily turn the tide of a game.

 

doogless

From what I read, the charges from the Vial only have a 10 second duration. That's fine when you're chaining heals, but a school lockout followed by a CC, or two consecutive CCs - when you want to use it the most - will guarantee that the charges drop off.

edit: I'm a bit slow. It's a trinket, and therefore is usable during a school lockout.

 

Mex

2 CCs will cause the charges to fall off, but as far as I know it should be usable during a school lock / silence.

One thing I've just read though, apparently it only has a 10 yard range? It seems like using it in that case would almost be a liability ...

 

Phoe

The range is less than that - tested it the other day and my guildmate had to be standing right on top of me for it to work. Am kind of thinking that's a bug though.

 

xarg

I really can't see that many players wearing that dodge trinket at all. It's a lot of dodge, but it still is only 20%. For a caster that's going to put them at 25%.

I'd still rather go with battlemasters.

 

heel

It got nerfed down to 8%, from 20%.

Vial of the Sunwell is ridiculous because it can be used during lockouts, it's instant, it's not on the global cooldown, and it costs no mana. It's Desperate Prayer for everyone.

 

Colan

Ack, my mistake for missing the Vial of the Sunwell.

and yes I do agree that it seems extremely powerful, especially when combined with the fact that it can't be locked out of any school (and of course give much needed healing in the face of burst).

Really, I still think the dodge trinket will have a decent impact on arenas. The dodge is still nothing to scoff at, and while I suppose the removal of the /ignore function takes away a lot of the utility of it, the trinket can still prove very useful.

 

Sniddie

No, just no.

No person with a decent brain would ever use that trinket in arena, perhaps a protection Warrior in the 1400 bracket.

Which class would EVER want to use that trinket?

http://siggen.xembler.org.nyud.net:8...stats1udbP.jpg

 

Morakk

I believe the Vial of the Sunwell has been changed to a 2 minute cooldown on the PTR.

 

Kaber

Dodge rating is quite useless when you're stunned or being attacked from behind. It would probably only play a role in melee vs. melee fights where you are generally trying to face eachother the entire time rather than run away to get some range. In arena you can't guarantee that you would even face another melee on the opposing team so why would you use a trinket that will be useless against more than half of your competitors?

The heal at full stack is about the same as the Battle Master trinket, and if I am reading this right it has almost no range, so really you would only use it on yourself. I'd rather have the battle master's trinket.

 

Maynard

The range on the vial must be a bug. If blizzard intended it to be self-only, they would've worked that in to the design rather than having a silly 1-yd range mechanic instead.

 

Talgog

Not to mention that "increased chance for squishy to dodge warrior when below 35% health" is not exactly a good ability, especially if you are facing a double warrior team. The "best case" scenario for the trinket working against the latter results in you dying instantly to twin Overpowers.

Even against a single warrior, it would probably get you bursted to death from Overpower ---> Execute after the Overpower drops you below 20%. This is not Evasion. Even with the pre-nerf value it is still much more likely than not that a warrior will hit you following the attack that you dodged.

This trinket is not for Arena.

 

Tower

This. This is why rogues aren't mitigating a ton of incoming warrior damage, a warrior focusing a rogue will have him hamstring and be doing a lot of runthrough to avoid dodged Mortal Strikes.

Melee users would never use it, rogues would much rather put an offensive trinket on, as will warriors (or something that is more magic defensive like Battlemasters, shield+defensive+plate armor is enough to deter melee damage). It is a complete waste of DKP on a caster, any melee focusing a clothie snares first, dps's later. If you're clothie isn't consistently running away from a melee, putting his back to the assailant and making dodge rating useless but attempting to break melee range, then your player is going to die even faster than they would with 4 t7 trinkets...

 

Alstor

The Commendation of Kael'thas: i don't see how this will have any impact on any arena bracket. Yes it's 57 stamina, 60 for enlightment priests but the dodge is somewhat useless for most classes.. Ok it might be slightly annoying with that proc + Elune's grace from an NE priest, that's like 40% avoidance right there.. but yes definitly a PvE trinket!

Edit: Thinking this trinket working with the protadin talent where you have damage taken reduced by xx% when you're below Xx% hp, gonna be pertty damn unkillable :P

Timbal's Focusing Crystal: how often will this trinket proc? will the proc have it's damage reduced by resiliences' periodicly damage reduce? hmm i guess not, but still 285 to 475 damage on a proc is not that big of a boost to be honest, ofc dependant on how often the proc is possible...

Vial of the Sunwell: Well if i understood this right the charges fades after 10 secs, that makes this trinket pretty worthless, sure you can spam some low rank heal on yourself when you are oom and then activate the trinket.. but still dosen't seem convincing to me as a PvP trinket.. Someone said it was like desperate prayer for anyone.. please think again you need to charge this 20 times to get a 2000 heal, that's not even compareable to desperate prayer

'Al

 

• frmorrison

The 10 second buff on the Vial isn't that bad, you usually will be casting a heal at least every 10 seconds. The current 10 yard range is the problem, but perhaps that is by design.

Know Thy group function; Thy DPS shall avoid aggro, Thy tank shall not attempt to DPS, and Thy Healer shall not go AFK without notifying Thy group.

 

Alstor

in pvp? atleast i dont heal that consistently in pvp, for me this would fade out all the time and be pretty useless.. maybe for a restro druid, or for a paladin or 5v5, but that's all.

 

xarg

You can dodge attacks from behind you. You cannot parry or block but you can still dodge.

You cannot parry dodge or block when stunned.

Dodging mortal strike is a lot more useful than activating the warrior's overpower. A lot of the time a warrior will lose too much rage to bother overpowering anyway, with exceptions such as evasion.

 

Tojara

No.

Players cannot dodge from behind period. The easiest way to test this is to have a Rogue use evasion in a duel and attack them from behind for 15 seconds, he won't dodge one attack despite having 80-90% dodge. I have tested this multiple times with people I know that share this common misconception about how dodge works on players. While dodges can happen from behind this is typically a rare occurance in which lag has taken place.

I think the culprit that is clouding the minds of people is the fact the npcs act different. While they share the same common ruleset in regards to parry and block, they are completely different in regards to dodge. NPC's can dodge from behind, while players cannot.

Anyways perhaps some of the other trinkets might possibly change the face of arena to some extent, but this dodge trinkets is defintely not one of them. There are far better trinkets that I can think of that I personally would rather use.

 

rycho

I think that the best trinket from Sunwell for PVP is going to end up being Glimmering Naaru Sliver, 119 passive healing with a use to restore mana is probably better than anything else in that slot for an arena healer.

The DoT trinket from the heroic 5-man is strictly worse than hex shrunken head if it goes live with the internal cooldown, and the 2 minute cooldown combined with the range on Vial of the Sunwell make it unattractive in my opinion, although it could possibly be useful for paladins/shamans during lockouts.

One thing I was wondering is if Vial of the Sunwell procs off of second wind ticks? If so it might be nice for a warrior in the smaller brackets and in duels, I was just curious and haven't seen anything on this.

 

Mex

I very much doubt that second wind, bandaging ticks, blood craze, nature's guardian, vampiric embrace and other similar effects will proc VotS.

In fact, the description says, "from healing spells you cast". The only thing I could imagine being in question is gift of the naaru.