Well what I said applies to the current raid content. I can't think of a fight where one can not utilize AMS for RP generation. Maybe chimaeron would be minimal AMS usage but really all other fights have spells and fires on the ground you can use.

Of course the other thing is what Consider also said; RE makes frost more unreliable and also adds to the human error margin because you can't anticipate your rune regeneration as well as unholy.

I was wondering the same thing actually.

Crit rating is still better than haste; the less crit you have, the better it is, so the fact that we have so little (read: none, really) to start with is actually a good thing for the stat. Going from 10->11% crit is, obviously, a greater dps gain (in terms of percentage) then going from 40->41% crit.

Haste rating would be great, if DW didn't have GCD issues baseline. The fact is, you're going to be global capped in 359 gear even while ignoring the stat (due to the fact that a certain amount is unavoidable), and thus the stat takes a huge hit.

It is worth nothing, however, that the difference is rather slight. I mean, 0.10 dps per rating more for crit than haste? That means reforging from one to the other or vice versa won't give you a gap more than maybe 50 dps at the absolute most, which is well within the margin of RNG, and won't be noticed (nor will prevent a top parse from still being a top parse, even though the player could have eked out a bit more damage.

As to Magmaw, the adds are a part of the fight. They have to be dealt with somehow, and if you happen to be assigned to them, higher dps is still higher dps. Yes, what strategy a group uses will affect which spec performs the best, but that doesn't change the fact that overall, Frost is performing better on the fight, and through perfectly valid means.

This logic is sound, however Kahories has been consistently telling me that in my gear (346 blues with 359 exalted pieces, and a BoE), that haste vastly outperforms both crit and mastery, and even exhibits a self-stacking property similar to what ArP had.

Reforging/enchanting for haste:
EP CritRating 0.46
EP MasteryRating 0.62
EP HasteRating 1.48

Reforging/enchanting for crit:
EP CritRating 0.4
EP MasteryRating 0.6
EP HasteRating 1.18

Ideas?

On a whim, I've been reforging crit->haste on all my gear and have reached ~12% haste outside of raids. So far I have no experienced any issues with being global capped in raids. There will be periods of time where I have to be very careful not to waste any RP (esp. during Bloodlust) but there is always some point in every encounter where I find myself sitting around for several seconds waiting on Runes because I got unlucky with RE procs, or Rime procs or whathaveyou. Is the data that indicates we ought to be global capped for low levels of haste from a simulation or do you have different observations than mine in raids?

Looking through my logs in a spreadsheet, there are many instances where my time between abilities is 2-4 seconds as I wait for runes to come up. Granted, I'm not using HoW as often as I could, but in the ideal case that should be cut out of the rotation entirely to make room for actual damaging abilities.

Consider I do realize we are GCD capped but I'm talking in lines of 346 going to 359 gear. I feel like 16% buffed crit isn't doing much since raid bosses have 4.3% crit suppression. I do know what you mean when we are 372+ geared though. But i guess I'm more along the line of min/maxing at the moment.

Whoa, you should rephrase that. While I know what you mean, there is no such thing as "main hand miss chance" or "off hand miss chance". There's only a single wield (like a 2 hander, or special attacks) and a dual wield miss chance.
Phrasing it as you do might mislead people to belief that they would actually only make their off hand hit more often, which is simply not true.

Also, you seem to double dib on Nerves of Cold Steel.
The dual wield penalty is 19%, so together with the base 8% miss chance for single wield that is 27%. Substract the 3% from talents, and you're at 24%. Not 21.

Unless of course there's something I've missed with Cataclysm. I'm a rogue by heart after all.

Since you are focussing on heroics, Epidemic is probably the one to take points out of, as its value compared to Improved BP is significantly diminished compared to a raid scenario. For the most time during a heroic you run a HB-centric one-disease rotation, so FF is frequently refreshed, while BP is more or less meaningless. Especially in kiting situations the Chillblains-debuff only lasts 10 seconds, so you need to refresh FF at that point anyways, making Epidemic pointless.

The big issue I find with crit vs haste is situational.

On AOE fights where I want to spam howling blast on adds, the extra haste will be better. This I found to be especially true on Magmaw and Cho'gall where going to > 10% haste gave me enough extra rune refresh to get an extra howling blast in on adds I would not have had at lower levels. This is -also- true because bosses have crit suppression, but non-boss adds do not, meaning crit has lower relative worth when attacking adds than it does when attacking bosses, because you have higher default crit against non-boss adds. On our Cho'gall kill and some wipes I topped add damage by a considerable margin. Frost currently has the most spammable cheap AOE in the game right now in howling blast and being able to cycle runes fast enough to get 6 per 6 sec (with blood tap) is a huge deal.

More KM procs is also something I'm finding to be a big deal. Mastery is still the first secondary stat I will stack (until HB is inevitably nerfed, at least). However more KM procs means I will get more bonus KM procs to use on FS (where I'm close to RP cap or don't have the runes to OB due to crappy RE RNG or whatever). I can also more often "store" a KM proc when switching between targets or having to run across a room because I more often get a proc either just as I switch off or just as I start attacking something. I don't find myself trying to hold KM procs with a few seconds left before I can OB again, because more often than not I get another proc for that OB anyways. We are GCD capped if we're forced to store resources, more haste enables us to dump resources faster so we get greater turnover.

The thing with frost is we're GCD capped only if we're lucky with RE, which we're often not, or unlucky with KM. I most certainly don't enjoy depending on RE and have found higher levels of haste to be beneficial in practice (quite a number of top 20 parses for frost, anyways). In theory, as always, on a patchwerk sort of fight crit may be that tiny bit better, but with the (annoying) RNG factor of RE I find haste to give more consistent results.

With the last GC post about upcoming adjustments, we were pointed out along with Survival Hunters and Warlocks as having too much AE dmg. So, it's just a matter of time at this point.

Though, it's likely they'll just put a cap on the AE dmg, like everyone else, and the single target numbers will remain, keeping Mastery as useful at it was before for single target value.

Not sure if that'll have the desired effect on abnormal DPS for some bosses, since if the AE damage cap is in place, it's likely that we won't be as useful as another ranged class that doesn't have to move to DPS the adds down, and just stay on the boss full time like other melee. Thus our DPS will fall in line below other classes that are doing abnormal single target dps. Lose/Lose :P

Nah, just creat a "/cast [target=addname] Howling Blast" macro, no need to jump targets anymore.

I just wonder if it's possible to create a macro where it'd target the adds if they existed or just hit your current target if they didn't. Would be brainless then xD.