Frost DPS | Cataclysm 4.0.6, This Is My Life - Page 9

Jaysue · 01/05/11, 6:30 PM

Originally Posted by Darkside

Did some fights with [Darkmoon Card: Hurricane] tonight and I'm very pleased with the results. The proc appears to be roughly 2.5-2.9% of my damage on a standard fight and works out to around 400 DPS. I'm not entirely certain where that places it against the other heroic trinkets, but it appears to be definitely worth the money at this juncture.

Here's the logs for the night: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis & World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Don't have any logs handy but I can say I have about the same experience with the trinket - very happy with it also. I have also found the trinket crits fairly often as well (20-30%) but does it do double damage on a crit ? will test it later on a dummy to find out (unless someone already knows).

Morrtir · 01/05/11, 11:36 PM

Originally Posted by Iasonas13

Can anyone else verify this? ie. that when you spec into Rime, the bug appears?

I respeced DW frost minus Rime to test this and still encountered the bug. On a hunch, I speced out of Brittle Bones and still encountered it as well. I've done quite a bit of messing around to try to locate a specific ability that causes this. So far I have noticed it (to differing degrees) while using IT, PS, CoI, and HB. HB will cause it nearly every time (regardless of Rime proc or not). The other abilities seem much more sporadic and often cause a much smaller, less noticeable jump.

♦ Darkside · 01/06/11, 12:50 AM

I checked my rune regen rates a while back when rumors of Icy Talons slowing them down were floating around and didn't notice any negative effects. I was getting ~9s rune times with ~10% haste. Now with this hotfix supposedly in my rune times are the still the same.

Thyrial · 01/06/11, 11:37 AM

Might of the Frozen Wastes now also has a 4/8/12% chance to proc from your melee attacks. 15/30/45% chance to proc from auto attacks remain the same.

2H Frost buff on the PTR... Is it just me or is that an extremely underwhelming buff? A little napkin math is showing it at less then a 1% dps increase IF we can use all the extra RP. (not counting the extra DPS from extra RE procs) I'm starting to think they don't realize how far behind it actually is.

LKratos · 01/06/11, 1:25 PM

Originally Posted by kwekson

I was wondering what meta to use until they change the [Chaotic Shadowspirit Diamond] to it's original requirements and saw that in de OP it's suggested to use [Destructive Shadowspirit Diamond].

Isn't it better to use [Fleet Shadowspirit Diamond] in combination with the +50 mastery on boots enchant since mastery is valued higher then crit?
At least as long as you use 2 yellow gems already to match socket bonuses.

Mastery is only decimals ahead of crit, while strength is worth over 3 times as much.

Looking at the stats simply numerically (with the stat weights),

Chaotic shadowspirit: 54 crit, 80 str (2 red gems)

Fleet shadowspirit: 94 mastery, 40 str (those turned to yellow gems instead, being 20str/20mastery)

At ilvl 359, crit has an EP of .58, mastery is .82, and str is 2.62.

Mathematically, chaotic is therefore (54 x .58) + (80 x 2.62) = 240.92

While fleet is (94 x .82) + (40 x 2.62) = 181.88

A difference of about 25%.

Now, IF you have two yellow sockets in your gear, and socketing for them gives you at least 20 str, then yes, the fleet shadowspirit is more worth it. But if you don't have at least 2 yellow gems you'll be socketing for anyway, then the chaotic shadowspirit is ahead by a decent amount.

EDIT: Just saw that last line of your post rofl, sorry. I wanted to run the numbers myself anyway, so oh well.

♦ Darkside · 01/06/11, 1:29 PM

Originally Posted by Thyrial

2H Frost buff on the PTR... Is it just me or is that an extremely underwhelming buff? A little napkin math is showing it at less then a 1% dps increase IF we can use all the extra RP. (not counting the extra DPS from extra RE procs) I'm starting to think they don't realize how far behind it actually is.

The change datamined on MMOC is incorrect, is should read:

Might of the Frozen Wastes now also increases all melee damage by 4/8/12% while wielding a two-handed weapon.

As per: PTR 4.0.6 Patch Notes - Forums - World of Warcraft

Suphix · 01/06/11, 2:32 PM

I see the internal CD on the Angerforge trinket was lowered, meaning the charges proc more often. This might be worth looking into more?

Suphix · 01/06/11, 5:57 PM

You need to read the unholy changes too. Whatever way you look at it, Howling Blast was doing a bit too much damage. They lowered the cost of it's use, they removed it's AoE cap and it hit's hard across many targets. We can still pull some incredible single target and AoE dps, I wouldn't worry too much.

Besides, Unholy has been dual wielding and speccing into NoCS, something blizzard will address since they already stated that their wish is for Unholy to use 2 handers.
Another thing to note is that these changes are still early on into this expansion and everything is subject to change

Valestik · 01/06/11, 6:26 PM

I'd say it's safe to say that we'll still be ahead on AoE fights like magmaw, just not by the same drastic amount we were before. This change was bound to happen... doing 50% more aoe damage than every class in the game with one button that doesnt have a cool down was pretty intense. (Granted, demo locks did it with just their pet and a spell or two.)I was just hoping they'd beef up our single target a little more. A simple change to Rime that made icy touch do 100% increased damage with rime procs would have helped and would have saved us in those occasions where breaking cc is bad.

Alas hopefully things work out for us in the long run. I'll have to check out the ptr personally though.

Nahela · 01/07/11, 9:07 AM

At this point in time I can't see switching back to Icy Touch being a positive thing. The combat simply flows better when you're just using HB vs. juggling two spells. It would be hard to balance without adding a deep Frost talent specific to IT, which would just seem out of place. Outbreak handles CC-break-avoidance relatively well and most tanks now have learned to pull things away from CC.

I'd be interested to see how 2H Frost plays out now with the changes, that's been a long time coming. I get the feeling it'll still be behind, but certainly much closer than it is now.

bwfrazier · 01/07/11, 6:54 PM

Originally Posted by Suphix

I see the internal CD on the Angerforge trinket was lowered, meaning the charges proc more often. This might be worth looking into more?

If we could keep the proc up every cooldown, it would provide a static 321 Crit and 321 Strength (1926 Strength *20/120), so it would probably be slightly above the Crushing Weight trinket (static 321 Strength and 321 Haste) but still below the Darkmoon card (321 Strength along with 300-400 DPS from Lightning Strike according to parses I've looked at). Since we probably won't be able to keep the proc up every cooldown, I'd expect it to fall behind the other trinkets in practice.

emothianes · 01/08/11, 7:26 PM

Originally Posted by bwfrazier

If we could keep the proc up every cooldown, it would provide a static 321 Crit and 321 Strength (1926 Strength *20/120), so it would probably be slightly above the Crushing Weight trinket (static 321 Strength and 321 Haste) but still below the Darkmoon card (321 Strength along with 300-400 DPS from Lightning Strike according to parses I've looked at). Since we probably won't be able to keep the proc up every cooldown, I'd expect it to fall behind the other trinkets in practice.

I'm not so sure. Its nearly possible to keep it up now assuming you're meleeing consistently so assuming the buff is reasonable it should make it reliable.

Also, the crit can be reforged to Mastery where as the haste on the weight cannot.

Ishxan · 01/08/11, 9:43 PM

For those who have been playing the PTR, I am curious, have they fixed the rune regeneration push-back?

alloy20 · 01/09/11, 5:54 AM

Originally Posted by Suphix

Besides, Unholy has been dual wielding and speccing into NoCS, something blizzard will address since they already stated that their wish is for Unholy to use 2 handers.
Another thing to note is that these changes are still early on into this expansion and everything is subject to change

It was quite obvious that Blizzard would break dual wielding Unholy as it effectively adds one more Dk DPS spec that would need to be balanced and having a two hander and dual wield flavour of each DPS tree is kind of ridiculous.
DW Unholy and Frost AoE aside, hats off to them so far on the single target side of things with Unholy two hander and DW frost being theoretically balanced right now as well as both offering very different ways to play a DK.

I'm quite interested in the changes to MotFW adding as additional 4/8/12% melee damage for two handers. However with the current state of two hander frost I have to wonder if it will be enough to allow the spec to catch up with Unholy and it's DW counterpart. It is certainly a step in the right direction and if it still comes up short I suppose they could just tweak that % bonus until it balances out.

Hidden · 01/09/11, 6:22 AM

Originally Posted by alloy20

It was quite obvious that Blizzard would break dual wielding Unholy as it effectively adds one more Dk DPS spec that would need to be balanced and having a two hander and dual wield flavour of each DPS tree is kind of ridiculous.
DW Unholy and Frost AoE aside, hats off to them so far on the single target side of things with Unholy two hander and DW frost being theoretically balanced right now as well as both offering very different ways to play a DK.

I'm quite interested in the changes to MotFW adding as additional 4/8/12% melee damage for two handers. However with the current state of two hander frost I have to wonder if it will be enough to allow the spec to catch up with Unholy and it's DW counterpart. A large portion of two hander dps (at least a chunk more than DW) is frost damage and with the change only effecting physical damage I don't see that happening. It is certainly a step in the right direction and if it still comes up short I suppose they could just tweak that % bonus until it balances out.

Where did you get physical damage from?
It's increased melee damage and should thus include FS.