Darkrenown

That's been working for quite a while, although there's not much point at the moment with how little DC hits/heals for. Oh, and if you ghoul is at low hp just mount and unmount, he'll return with full hp.

 

Reinhars

Does someone know if heart strike affects parry based haste on boss ?
It seems like a stretch but it's always good to know.

 

mrboh

I was just having a read of this post on the beta forum which has some info about the updated Unholy Blight coefficient and damage. However, the author incorrectly calculates the coefficient and fails to calculate the base damage. Taking into account Impurity and all the multipliers in his talent build, I get:

coefficient = 0.00767
base damage = 33.6

These values are per tick. Which is a massive nerf, unless the spell is somehow bugged in beta.

 

Cabal

100% sure it does not, as a parry "haste" is not a haste effect at all, just a reset of the weapon swing timer.

 

Mild Confusion

I really need to get to a training dummy to confirm this, but it seems like there is a bug where attack power isn't scaling properly with spells. Most damage is doing exactly tooltip damage. I'll test out frost since that is my spec of choice. I'll do damage tests with no talents, armor on and armor off. Then go deep frost and go armor on and off again.

 

PhoenixVynna

Double check your recent patch notes, a few DK abilities for some reason don't scale anymore.

I'm pretty sure death coil is included on that.

"Death Coil is no longer modified by attack power." - build 8885
"Strangulate is no longer modified by attack power." and
"Corpse Explosion (Tier 3) now does shadow damage, and is no longer modified by attack power." - build 8820
etc.

 

Hearteater

They removed the "scaled by attack power" text from the tooltips, but the spells still scale by AP. (Source)

 

Weidekuh

This is just a wrong interpretation of the tooltip i guess. Bluepost said they took all the ''scale with attackpower'' out of the tooltips, because every skill scales anyway with it. It would be pointless to write it down for every single ability.


EDIT: Awww... too slow.

 

Mild Confusion

I'm referring to icy touch and howling blast anyhow. They only seem to be doing base damage.

 

Kantri

Misinformation, spell hit cap has been lowered to 9% to coincide with the melee hit cap for hybrid casters such as Death Knights, Shaman, Druids, etc. The only recent change was removing the 1% "never gonna get there". I believe there is still a DW penalty just like TBC and lower however.

 

Mild Confusion

After some base testing, nothing fancy, icy touch is still getting damage bonus from attack power. Howling blast however is not getting any AP damage bonus plus doing half the base damage of the spell, that's without frost fever on the target. With frost fever, it's doing slightly above base damage, but that's just from talents to increase it's damage. I don't have any numbers, but apperantly Ghostcrawler is aware of it HB being either bugged or over nerfed.

 

Roywyn

No, it's still 17% for spells. Proven with some thousand casts in the level 80 combar rating thread.
The 9% theory came up because nobody know that shaman DW spec alos affects spell hit (which is counterintuitive as well).

That's why you have the +8% taunt hit glyph for tank classes that bridge the difference between melee and spell hit cap.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.

 

Pyros

But taunts became physical attacks some patches ago(to reduce resists), are they back as spells?

 

Roywyn

Taunts have always been "spells of the physical school", but the Zul'Aman (I think) made them affected by melee instead of spell hit.
It's always been the 17% resists chance evenpost patch according to testers (Zul'Gurub 1/2-man tests at 80).

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.

 

Gograh

after this nerf I tried the frost and blood builds and couldn't reach a conclusion on which one is better. It looks like I am playing with resurrection sickness. I chose blood because it looks like I have less downtime (bandaging). Is unholy still worthy?

 

Darkrenown

I'm currently 74 and Unholy, I did 2 Drak'Tharon Keep runs as DPS last night and came 2nd on the first run and first on the 2nd run (despite having went unholy pres to run out of the first instance and forgetting to switch back to blood untill after the 2nd boss). That's with me being unable to use UB or bloodboil.

 

Scraps

With the DK specials nerfed so hard, has anyone thought ot compare DW spec dps v other spec DPS again? Maybe the white damage, Necrosis, BCB, etc can make it more reasonable?

I personally dislike DW aesthetically but I'll spec whatever I need to during leveling/testing.

US Beta servers have been pretty laggy for me recently, so I haven't had a chance to try much out.

Also, not sure what the best DW spec looks like now, here's a guess using all three trees and HB for the Obliterate slot.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deat...00000000000000

 

Cloudgatherer

If the special attacks remain in their present state, that may be a real alternative for single target DPS. Though, I can't imagine some of the specials won't be re-buffed at least a bit. This last patch really feels like a knee-jerk reaction with the blanket nerf bat of most of the DK skills. Sure, a handful of abilities needed to get tuned down a bit, but it feels like collateral nerfing to other skills nearby. It feels like AP->Damage scaling broke this patch, hopefully that gets addressed.

Though as a weapon based class, perhaps there was some high end testing done and DKs were just hitting too hard. Any DKs running Naxx with a meter of some kind who could shed some light on how the damage is at 80? How are the comparisons against rogues, enhance shaman, fury warriors?

 

Sinazeel

Is it just me, or is it kind of annoying that Blood has to go 13 points into Frost just for Annihilation? Unholy doesn't have that problem, and Frost is putting points into the tree anyway. It would probably make more sense if they switched it with Glacier Rot or something, since GR returns best on deep Frost spells.

I'm also wondering if they're having trouble balancing all the "X per disease" abilities. Blood and Frost only have access to two diseases, while Unholy has 3-4 (edging toward 4 if UB can be kept up all the time). It would make sense to give the other trees a new disease that they can use, so that Unholy's edge is cut from "2 more diseases" to "1 more disease", and they can balance around everyone having 3 diseases on the target. Converting the Bloodworms and Chillblains effects into diseases (barring some talent placement changes) sounds fairly reasonable.

Or am I just embarrassing myself up here?

 

Zaroua

That'd be a bandaid solution. The real fix would be to have abilities not scale with diseases as base and have the talents (Bloody Strike/Annihilation/Rage of Rivendare) give a scaling per disease portion attached to them. Preferably something like "Your Blood and Heart Strikes deal an additional 5/10/15% damage to diseased targets".

Dogma also claims that God has a sense of humor and at times presents Him as a joker of sorts, thus again lowering Him to human level. While I am certain God has a "sense of humor" since He gave it to us, I find it most difficult to believe He finds humor in sin since He will cast the unforgiven sinner into the lake of fire for eternity. Not very funny at all.

 

Lujaar

Re: Sinazeel, I don't see the 13-point dip into frost as mandatory. 52 blood/19 unholy has a couple possible rotations that can make use of the longer disease duration. You just have to use death strike over oblit any time the oblit won't be immediately followed by a disease refresh.

blood/unholy:

PS-IT-DS-HS-HS -- Oblit-PS-IT-HS-HS -- HS-HS-DS-HS-HS -- (repeat, but swap first DS for HSx2 from here on out)

Compare to blood/frost:

PS-IT-HS-HS-Oblit -- PS-IT-HS-HS-HS-HS -- (repeat)

Compared to an ezmode blood/frost rotation, you're throwing an oblit on 1 in 3 rune sets instead of 1 in 2. However, you're also trading a PS/IT pair for a death strike, and after the first 60 seconds you'll be getting more heart strikes per time. The blood/frost cycle above averages 3 HS's per rune set. The blood unholy/cycle gets 8 HS's in the first 3 rune cycles, but then 10 HS's per 3 rune cycles after that.

Once Blizzard gets done tweaking the mechanics we can figure out whether that tradeoff is worth it, or whether the extra white damage you (probably) gain from an unholy dip makes up for the difference if not.

 

Clandestine

edit: nvm I see what your goal is.

 

Lujaar

If you do it the other way around, you end up with this problem:

PS-IT-BS-BS-DS -- Oblit- ...oh shit I just oblitted my diseases off and I only have blood runes up.

 

Clandestine

Yeah, I made a stupid assumption. I see how your rotation is supposed to work now.

 

Roywyn

What do you think of the following rotation without Annihilation:

1) Oblit - IT - PS - HS - HS
2) HS - HS - Oblit - HS - HS
3) IS - PS - HS - HS - HS - HS

Both Obliterates have 2 diseases up (1 from 2 and 2 from 1). The 2 Heart Strikes in cycle 2) have none up.

Compared to your mentioned rotation, we gain 2 HS with 0 diseases, 1 Oblit with 2 diseases, and lose 2 DS.
That should be roughly a 80% weapon damage + 78 gain. Vicious Strikes vs. Subversion should make only a rather small difference.

With your DS-2*HS swap, the trade-off is:
I gain 1 Oblit with 2 diseases, you gain 1 DS and 2 times 2 disease bonuses from HS.
That should still be a 60% weapon + 38 damage bonus I think. Plus Vicious vs. Subversion.


Am I missing something why this rotation could be worse?
This isn't even looking at gear scaling, which the disease bonuses seem to lack (and get outscaled sooner or later).

Also, this should even be doable with 12s diseases, but then it's really really tight. Not that Unholy has any other useful talent in that tier though.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.