Death Knight: Simple Questions/Simple Answers - Page 169

RoflCow · 01/12/10, 5:05 AM

Diseases up on all the targets on whichever side you are DPSing and then just switch targets based on what you can hurt. Never bother with mobs that are empowered or resurrected, just DPS normal mobs then the boss. It isn't Rocket Surgery.

Tianshaan · 01/12/10, 11:31 AM

I have been hesitant to post this because of its non-confirmed, only observed status.

I started noticing DnD doing alot less threat about a week or more ago. Generally, before this, I could AoE pull in heroics and both 10 and 25s with DnD>IT>PS>Pest and go into a lazy tabbing-thru-targets rotation until I had to use DnD again if needed.
This was plenty of threat by a long-shot.
Suddenly, I started having mobs walking THROUGH my DnD to get to people, and this would even happen on the pull. Once people started asking where my threat went (I have never had threat problems) I began to watch Omen.

Sure enough, on a standard run in and drop DnD AoE pull in all dungeons (Hs,10s & 25s), I did some testing with a healer. Getting to 100K threat in a heroic using only a DnD>IT>PS>Pest rotation used to be about 20 seconds.
However, when I tested I never made it. Or rather, I gave up and started tabbing targets. It was common for a mob to run out to the healer. I have ThreatNamePlates so I could watch them and the threat I had on that mob. It was very common for the mob to have only 2K threat on it. As a matter of fact, using only DnD WITH THE GLYPH never changed this. Still only about 2K threat on the untargeted mobs. I am still using the Glyph right now mostly because I am just hoping it works, even though I see no improvement.

TPS in raids was the same. I had mobs walk out of DnD with hardly any threat of them (still using Glyph). Several people including my wife (the healer) now have witnessed the phenomenon and simply chalk it up to the 'DKs are all nerfed now' mentality. I don't believe that, and have seen nobody else experiencing this, nor any mention of a stealth nerf to DK AoE threat.

This is very frustrating, and I assure you it is not something that has been there all along and that I am just now seeing, I have been tanking this toon a long while now.

Silarn · 01/12/10, 4:58 PM

As far as I know this hasn't been mentioned elsewhere, and seeing as how it applies more or less to all DPS specs,

As of last week it would seem that pestilenced diseases on Faction Champions are now being mitigated as they are on the Blood Beasts.

Asphyxialol · 01/12/10, 8:32 PM

That is most certainly not true: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

As you can see in that report my diseases had nearly the same amount of ticks (58 vs 54), and my tick on my primary target (Fjora Lightbane) did an average of 2877 damage, where my average tick on the other Val'kyr (Eydis Darkbane) averaged 922 damage per tick.

The buff, Dark Essence in my case, reduces your damage done to the other color Val'kyr by 50% (and it's always worked that way), and judging from my Patchwerk parse (World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis) my average tick was just under 1800, so that fits. The bonus damage against your primary target is 50%, which also fits within slight variation with the above (ie 2877 vs 2700, small sample size, etc.).

It is still working now as it was a few weeks ago.

Edit: Those numbers are accurate, I did not change colors on vortex and I did not gain Empowered Darkness as a dps buff, that is strictly me vs valks.

Silarn · 01/12/10, 10:29 PM

Well then it's too bad I said Faction Champions and not Twin Val'kyr.

Obviously diseases will do full damage on a normal fight. They are mitigated against Blood Beasts and, as of last week, on Faction Champions.

I remember checking recount and seeing a minimum tick of ~175 on diseases. For some reason this is not showing up on the WoL parse, but both DKs in the group did drastically less damage than previous kills.

Bllets · 01/12/10, 10:54 PM

FC: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Blood Plague:

	Tick Crits
#	Avg	Total
121	3142.0	380186

There was no reduction for me this monday on the EU realms

Silarn · 01/12/10, 11:15 PM

Okay, it may have been a fluke. Perhaps we separated them much more than usual, and pestilence simply didn't spread to the number of targets it usually does. There was a very small minimum tick in my recount, but that could have been a resist/shield/anything.

There was a major red flag for me merely because we did not obliterate all other DPS that week, our overall disease damage was decreased by at least 20%, and the other DK, who uses the Unholy AoE spec and generally tops the meters by far was 10th that week. (And no, he didn't die.)

To illustrate: Week Before Last; Last Week

Asphyxialol · 01/13/10, 4:23 AM

Originally Posted by Silarn

Well then it's too bad I said Faction Champions and not Twin Val'kyr.

Obviously diseases will do full damage on a normal fight. They are mitigated against Blood Beasts and, as of last week, on Faction Champions.

I remember checking recount and seeing a minimum tick of ~175 on diseases. For some reason this is not showing up on the WoL parse, but both DKs in the group did drastically less damage than previous kills.

I'm not sure what I was thinking when I read your post then, sorry about that (may have been chatting in IRC about valks and it just popped into my head for the reply).

This week (not this reset, last reset) my average FF tick was 1572.1, where 2 weeks ago my average FF tick was 1631.63, so it doesn't appear there has been any major nerfs, and RNG can easily decide that small of a difference, or enemies stacking, group debuffs, etc.

If you look at the damage breakdown the diseases weren't up on as many targets as the previous week, which is a cause for a major dps loss. Also, if you look at his buffs cast (speaking about Karashoté atm) he applied diseases a total of 249 times on the first parse and only 80 times on the second parse (Ebon Plague was 376 vs 114 as well, to show the drastic change). The other DK seems to have a fairly similar parse between both weeks, with just standard deviation from the norm, so I wouldn't worry much about it.

Twinkielock · 01/13/10, 5:14 AM

I was wondering if haste is worth stacking all of a sudden?

Tonight during Saurfang I was soundly beaten by another DK by 1500 DPS. He does outgear me by a bit, but he did get off 105 melee swings to my 94. Am I screwing up my rotation that badly, or is haste worth stacking all of a sudden? I always thought haste was something that was nice to have, but something that you shouldn't go out of your way to obtain.

Log

edit he has 346 haste and I have 52

Afabar · 01/13/10, 5:59 AM

Just by looking at the report, Haste has nothing to do with your poor performance. Your glyphs choice(D&d, God) is not good for this fight. You have GoD but you use PS/IT 7 time in the fight, you must be doing something wrong. Due to your mistakes in your cycle you are making less SS than expected resulting a dps loss.

Tianshaan · 01/13/10, 11:46 AM

Down anyone know of a good thread of Acclimation and where it is useful in ICC?

Twinkielock · 01/13/10, 2:34 PM

Originally Posted by Afabar

Just by looking at the report, Haste has nothing to do with your poor performance. Your glyphs choice(D&d, God) is not good for this fight. You have GoD but you use PS/IT 7 time in the fight, you must be doing something wrong. Due to your mistakes in your cycle you are making less SS than expected resulting a dps loss.

I'm trying to ween myself off of using pestilence to refresh diseases. I know that is an issue. My main concern is melee damage. Isn't that simply auto attack? We were both using dual-blade at the time, but yet the other DK got 11 more melee swings in then me.

That's why I was wondering about the extreme haste difference.

berniemac20 · 01/13/10, 2:52 PM

DK's do not stack haste. Its just something you don't go out of your way to obtain. If you get some then great. In my opinion, what DK's should be stacking is both strength and armor penetration. I have noticed my dps go way up as I stack more and more armor pen.

Xzanecho · 01/14/10, 2:54 AM

What's the value of the 4 piece T9 for blood? I picked up a couple trophies figuring the 4 piece might up my dps some, but didn't take into consideration the loss of ArP on the Faceplate of Thunderous Rampage, and going way over the expertise cap.

With 4p T9 I'm at 37 expertise (ew) 196 ArP, with Thunderous Rampage I'm at 28 expertise 20% ArP. I imagine I'll put out higher numbers with the extra ArP but I don't know the value of the 4pc T9.

I figure my trinket is my biggest problem ( Vengeance of the Forsaken ) Once I replace that I can switch to 9.5 and sit at 27 expertise. But that is neither here, nor there.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Agent K · 01/14/10, 9:42 AM

When do I want to renew IT and PS? I have to do it when its about to expire (ie at 1 sec left on diseases) or right after it is ended? (no Glyph of Disease or Glyph of Scourge Strike in use)