Alatar

I'm sure you didn't include any Rune Dumps on purpose. My question is, though,

after PS>IT>BS>BS>SS do you UB and DC or just UB? I tend to find that even with a tight rotation I have enough time to do both given enough RP, although the next SS may be put off by a second or so.

So what I tend to do is:

PS>IT>BS>BS>SS>UB>DC
SS>SS>SS>DC until my RP is empty

 

chopipi

i can't find any reply about wandering plaque. i did a few tests in raid, and i found it has very low damage from the skill list in recount. Is it worth putting 3 points in?

 

Buanna

Find the math that was done prior to 3.0.8. Double what Necrosis used to be.

Boni and Bonii are not words.
Bonuses is.

 

Alatar

Your only other viable options are three points in desecration or virulence. As between these, I would rather have the +100% to all my diseases.

 

Stoical

#1 - Should use RP if you're above 70 if you have 4-piece, as you'll be going over cap at that point from a single SS.
#3 - Refreshing anytime the diseases drop under 5 seconds will waste a lot of SS refresh opportunities. I just keep an eye on my runes when the timer is starting to get close, and will refresh a couple of seconds early if, and only if, I just used all my runes save 1U/1F and didn't get a SS refresh. Otherwise I'll still have the runes to refresh right as they drop off.
#5 and #4 should be switched. Someone pointed this common misconception here awhile ago; using BS first means you're delaying your good hit by 3s in order to, the next rotation, get your good hit 3s earlier. There's typically no logical reason to do that, so as far as priorities go, there's no reason to use BS/BS before SS.

 

Foxx2405

Euu i didnt include it because in the comparison I just included it under the nominator RP.

I personally dont hold to such a rotation, i just use my RP for UB if it runs out and DC if it is still up. Its one of the reasons I like unholy, its one of the few specs which can do a priority rotaion which keeps things from turning into a drag.
I got a big UB timer along with my other diseases which i just keep an eye out for.

Agreed, however its long to put that in a simple list.

The reason people often name the 5 seconds is because thats a good point to have a look at your runes and anticipate when best to refresh (If needed) those diseases.
Also for me personally my disease timers turn from a yellow counter into a red counter at the 5 second mark I think.

But yea, might be good to mention that at 5 seconds you don't need to refresh like a mad men. It's just that at that point you have to anticipate on your next SS not refreshing diseases and when you're gonna adjust your rotation.

As an example, say the bolded part in the rotation is where my diseases are starting to say "5 seconds left", then the underlined SS is which I plan to replace with PS>IT (of course not when i get a lucky proc)

SS>BS>BS>SS
---
SS>SS>SS

However say for example there is an incoming phase in the fight where i have to move away, i use the first available UF runes to refresh diseases.

Thats personally why I like the 5 second mark; my UI notes it and it gives me plenty of time to anticipate

 

Veneilas

well to reclarify. My guild friend Dk got 5k dps using the idiot lolol 51 0 20 spec (no diseases). He is going again as 51/13/7. He got 6.6kdps prepatch on patch25 and well, with post patch those numbers only go up. I gotta see it with my own eyes but hes one not to lie bout it.

He does have prob the best gear sides the Deadly Foe cape. also has 3 profession perks. So basically he is probably the most geared Dk.

the itemization in each spec seems pretty different for the most part (for top notch end game gear etc)

 

Marloc

if e does 6.6k its an extremely fast kill an absolutely nothing special.

No spec in game can peak as high as blood can and fast kills favor blood the most, it plummits extremely fsat after the 30seconds of yelling Im the king of the world bitches!

 

Sylari

Been reading the OP ( not sure how up to date it is ) and I'm wondering if IT glyph is really that great? given that I'm using it once every 18 seconds or less....

My tests haven't been 100% yet, but it appears that FFB does trigger the blood strike glyph, I'm wondering if anyone else has any more information on this and if it's a viable alternative ( hard to test raid bosses like this, and I don't trust the boss dummy, although it works on him )

 

Fugazor

Back then DnD glyph was doing something else. Then they nerf... errr fixed DnD and lowered its damage by 30% and changed glyph to 20% damage increase.

Thing is you always use IT and you rarely use DnD (on bosses) therefore in min-maxing IT is better overall. Now if you do loads of heroics, wanna shine on trash, working on Sarth3D, OT often etc. you may want DnD instead.

TLDR: Both choices are viable.

 

zagor

There is the possiblity of using Blood Strike Glyph.

But I haven't seen anywhere a proof that it works on raid boss (with for exapmle Frostfire or Infected Wounds debuff) (proven to work on raid boss dummy).

 

Dragonaut

I am a bit uneasy when I see these crazy DPS numbers posted for unholy DK's. I am currently averaging about 3k dps on naxx 10bosss and 2.5k on the boss training dummy with naxx 10 gear. I am using the PS>IT>BS>BS>SS RD SS>SS>SS RD rotation then from there refreshing diseases only when i have 5 seconds left on them and random death coils in between global cooldown's(if any). So my question is that is my dps reasonable for my level of gear and the fact I'm only doing 10 man naxx? I know my gems are horrid but I still think I should be dishing out a bit more.

Also, would the Sigil of Haunted Dreams, be better then the Sigil of Arthritic binding until the upgrade in 25 man naxx?

 

zagor

That's a question for Q&A thread, but here: you need crit meta gem, all str gems except for meta requirement, all enchants.
This is wrong. Refresh diseases when they have just fallen off or are about to fall off. Using Glyph of Scourge Strike I always SS, even if diseases will fall off in next 1-2 seconds. I only don't SS if the only runes left will be two Blood runes and diseases would have fallen off. That's all explained in the first post of this thread.
Also there should be plenty of gcds for Deathcoils, and keeping UB always up.

Sigil of Haunted Dreams is epic but it still sucks, and Sigil of Arthritic Binding is good.

 

Foxx2405

No. The former only has a 15% proc chance.

 

level12wizard

Blood Strike glyph almost certainly works. Things like Frostfire Bolt, Infected Wounds, etc...will all mesh with it. There's been a lot of discussion/testing about it in the blood thread and many other places.

Glyph of Icy Touch beating Glyph of Blood Strike largely depends on the type of fight, and the number of Glyph of Scourge Strike procs you get. Getting several Death Coils worth of RP free is often more total damage than a flat 20% blood strike buff.

Glyph of Death and Decay is great, but I find that trash and Sartharion blazes/whelps die really fast anyway. If you're wiping on Sarth+3, I doubt it has anything to do with how much AoE DPS you're pushing out. It is an option though.

 

Azurewrath

Isn’t it more optimal to just use SS instead when the runes are up, since DC really doesn’t do as much and only acts as a filler in between rune cooldowns? In other words, using a DC when runes are up takes up a global cooldown which could have been used for SS. Secondly, should we be refreshing UB whenever it's down even when runes aren't on cooldown? Thanks.

 

Lavery

To answer your first question, RP gain is predictable--you can use your RP at such a time that you don't often face decisions between GCD with runes up vs. RP waste. When you do face this decision, though, the consensus seems to be that using the RP is worth it.

So your owl is tied to a bunch of balloons:

 

Foxx2405

Not really.

Runes are pretty flexible. If you use the runes when they come up they go on a 10 second cooldown, however there is some flexibility in it of up to 2 (or was it 3 ?) seconds. So that if you're runes are unused for say 1.5 seconds (because you had to dump RP), they wont refresh in 10 seconds but rather in 8.5 seconds.

There for you can do something like: SS>SS>DC>SS, without having to wait for runes 10 seconds later.

Also i think Lavery is right, a good death knight isn't thinking about what he is doing at that exact second, a good death knight thinks ahead 10-20 seconds (even more depending on certain situations). You have to predict when your diseases fall off, when RP is getting high, when to refresh UB, etc.

However to answer your question correctly. Due to rune flexibliity, its more than ok to weave an RP ability in between rune attacks. However in most situations you should be able to manage your RP so that you don't have to do that very often. Not that you can prevent it really. 3x SS with 4T7 generates 90 RP, so you're bound to overcap RP in those cases.

 

Sylari

even assuming NO scourge strike procs, it only ends up being about .55 RP / second.. doesn't seem like that big of a deal at all...

I have a naxx 25 in about half an hour, I'll check BS glyph out.

 

Bender222

I picked up the anvil of titans trinket and unfortunately it does not stack with mirror of truth it just refreshes it . At the moment mirror of truth is my best trinket, all I have to go with it is fezzicks pocketwatch ( haste + 400+ ap on use ) Would it be worth it to equip both the anvil and the mirror trinket so that I get greater uptime on the reflection of torment??

 

Archetype

I was a Blood spec advocate, it looks great on paper but when I put it to the test raiding, it falls behind for over all damage done on both aoe and single target fights. I've tested 51/13/7, 51/0/20, and after comparing WMO reports my 17/0/54 spec has consistently done more damage in any senario (single target, aoe, 5, 10, and 25 man). Like someone said in a previous post.... as blood you're king of the world for 30 seconds, and that's about it. I believe in the end.. it's more important to compare overall damage done than what DPS you're at when you finish your fight.

 

Griefknight

You would need to test it and find out how much more often the buff is active to decide if it is truly worth it. Procodile - Addons - Curse is a good add on to use with procs. I'd like to add that this probably wouldn't be the most optimal choice in trinkets even if the up time shows to be worthy, compared to other trinket setups.

 

Foxx2405

I think this is a pretty interesting topic to discuss about.

Glyph of the Ghoul and Glyph of Scourge Strike are given major glyphs, but the 3th is a bit of a tossup.

Glyph of Icy Touch seemed like a no brainer to me at first, but did some frost dpsing and now im speccing back. But i was just going over how little i use Icy Touch as unholy.

Curious to know what the BS glyph results will show. Maybe ill do a test as well.

I do however see one problem, I personally don't have a feral druid, and most of the mages are respeccing to arcane, which leaves the question if we'll be seeing enough working slowing effects on bosses.

 

zagor

Looking at our last Patchwerk, and it was a long fight 4min42sec.

I used 9x IT and 30x BS.

9x IT with Glyph of Icy Touch gave 90RP. That's 2.25 Deathcoils. Average DC was 3778. 2.25*3778=8500 damage.

Total BS damage was 66883. Total BS damage if I was using BS glyph would be 80259. Bonus BS damage = 13376 damage.

Results probably wary a lot with different encounters.

 

parvindk

I personnaly like Icy Touch because it makes you feel useful on fights like Malygos (Vortex) / Heigan (Phase2) where you cannot do anything else than IT-IT-DC.

I guess that both glyphes are subpar anyway and it's just up to whatever you like the most.

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