Here are some results from me. Even on a dummy below 35% your numbers seem pretty good considering I have the better weapon. My dummy was above 35% though. No Cooldowns used, selfbuffed HoW.

UP: 2965 DPS/approx. 3 minutes


BP: 3117 DPS/approx. 3 minutes


edit: spelling

Nerub my gear is quite comparable to yours and I was able to reproduce your numbers - but on below 35% dummy. I used OB, IT and FS glyphs, HoW, no cooldowns and your rotation (IT-BS-FS-OB-FS-OB-FS). One thing is correct for me: UP lowered my dps.

Did your tried other city dummies (Silvermoon is closest one)? Also can you try longer duration fight like 5min+?

EDIT:
Here is another test, this time ebon dummy below 35%:


3350 dps, 17/0/54, IT-BS-FS-OB-FS-OB-FS-(HB)

For above 35% target it should be 8,5% less so ~3065 dps. That is still 100-200 less than your report Nerub but that could be explained by RNG.

Also as we know damage of sub and over 35% the avg. dps for whole fight should be: 0,35*3350 + 0,65*3065 = 3165 dps which is quite damn high considering I didn't used any cooldowns and 17/0/54 with pets did 3100.

EDIT no.2:
I did another, this time longer, tests. Both were around 10min so thats quite a lot. Same spec and rotations as above, cooldowns used (not ghoul - forgot).


Blood Presence - 3290 dps


Unholy Presence - 3258 dps

Conclusions:
- spec (and possibly frost as whole) is quite RNG ride
- dps in both BP and UP is comparable with slight point on BP I would say (especially raid buffed)
- spec does around same dps unbuffed without ghoul as 17/0/54 with ghoul and garg, looking forward to see more WMO/WWS from raids

Which rotations/specs are those exactly?

Nevermind.

Spent some time with the Heroic dummie tuning rotations for 2 handed spec now that KM has been nerfed into oblivion for DW.. over 9-10 minutes I seemed to be holding between 3600-3650 with HoW as sole buff, no ghoul or gargoyle.. abit suprised at the result and since you remove dependance on pets I think I will put it to the test in Naxx later this week

ImageShack - Image Hosting :: wowscrnshot012409185812pz0.jpg

The damage dropped below 3.6k when I disengaged from the dummie

What spec and rotation you used? Also your armory link is broken.

Fuggah, assuming you have the IT sigil, can you please try out 21/50/0 and the OB-OB-BS-BS -> ITx6 rotation in UP and see what numbers you get? I haven't seen any parses done by someone with a betrayer using the ITx6 build/rotation.

(I just weave frost strike into the rotation whenever I get a KM proc or at the end of rune phases if procs haven't come up.)

Thanks.

My 1st time posting here. I wanted to share with you my rotation and spec. My gear is decent or at least I'd like to think so. Here's my armory link: The World of Warcraft Armory

Now this is only 10 man naxx but i was pretty proud of the results. I'm using a 21/50 Blood/Frost build with a rotation of:

IT, PS, BS, BS OB, FS Dump followed by IT, IT, IT, IT, PS, FS Dump with enough room for another OB before restarting. Is there anything I could do to maximize my DPS instead of using this rotation or better gear?

Thank you for the numbers Fuggah and Nerub.

One thing I'm finding when running UPr is that the FS crit rate is much easier to maintain, and the amount of overlapped KM procs is much less. The way I'm handling the rotation in UPr I will throw a FS at any point in the rotation, whenever KM has procced. I also do not dump full RP immediately, and normally will watch my swing timer to wait on the last FS of each set until my initial F rune has returned, to ensure that IT is never using KM whenever possible. My crit rate on FS is generally around 65% self-buffed when using this method.

I tried it earlier today shortly and my dps was lower than other frost rotations. It is very possible I did something wrong tho so I may try it again later today.


I just finished Naxx10 as 17/54/0 with IT-BS-FS-OB-FS-OB-FS-(HB) rotation. Nothing special there as only dps buff I had was BoK, I was OT on few fights and I probably screwed a lot since its new, but it is something: WMO, WWS.

As I had also WMO from Naxx10 previously where I was 17/0/54 I can do little comparison:
Boss // Unholy // Frost
Anub'Rekhan // 2984 // 3138
Gluth // 1526 // 1882 - tanking boss
Gothik // 1077 // 972 - tanking undead side
Grand Widow Faerlina // 4086 // 3873
Grobbulus // 3544 // 3663
Heigan // 3103 // 3073
Razuvious // 4097 // 3146
Kel'Thuzad // 3129 // 2769
Loatheb // 4331 // 4726
Maexxna // 4323 // 3739
Noth // 4649 // 3775
Patchwerk // 2203 // 2157 - tanking as MT
Sapphiron // 2805 // 2812
Thaddius // 2269 // 2514 - dps in tanking gear

Now problem is that some of unholy numbers are 2 weeks old or so that means pre-patch and most importantly w/o betrayer and sigil. I think I had better raid buffs there tho. Overall I think I would do more DPS with old 17/0/54 today.

I will have some more fun with dummies today and try different rotations for Frost.

I was looking at your armory and you appear to have mostly the best you can have, but mainly I was wondering which sigil you are using with that kind of rotation? Awareness or the IT sigil?

Got some quick Recount Screenies for y'all.

This is of 20/50/0 +1 with 3/3 Death Rune mastery.

IT PS BS BS OB dump -> IT PS IT IT IT IT dump
That was the rotation. With as many frost strikes as I had runic power for as the dumps.

Unholy Presence.
IT, FS and OB glyphs.
Sigil of the frozen conscience

Each test was carried out twice to ensure they weren't fluke crits.


IT PS BS BS OB dump -> IT PS IT IT IT IT dump - ~3100dps




I then tried the OB OB BS BS dump -> IT IT IT IT IT IT dump rotation mentioned above - ~~3100dps




Based on these tests I have a couple of questions for you guys:

IT PS BS BS OB -> IT PS IT IT IT IT
vs
IT PS BS BS OB -> IT PS IT IT OB

and indeed IT PS BS BS OB -> IT PS OB OB in that case.
I suspect the deeper issue here is IT sigil vs OB sigil as well as what weapon you're using.
Ish above pointed out to me in game that IT vs OB cannot properly be done on a target dummy as in a raid setting it'll have much less armor.

Edit - For comparison purposes you can view my DW tests here. They peaked out at 2992dps with the same gear as 0/44/27 & 0/32/38. (Widow's & Maexxna's Fumor)

And a random off-topic question.

I'm using a macro for Unbreakable armor:
/cast Blood tap
/cast Unbreakable armor

However, when I use it (usually just after i've used blood runes as death runes for Icy Touches) it seems to bring up the rune, use Unbreakable armor - and leave the rune active. It's confusing and sometimes messes up the rotation. Anyone else experiencing this?

All done on <35% dummy in ebon hold, no CD used.

21/50/0, BSx2-OBx2-ITx6, IT sigil, UP - 3300dps


21/50/0, IT-PS-OB-BSx2-IT-PS-OB-ITx2, IT sigil, UP - 3100dps


21/50/0, IT-PS-OB-BSx2-IT-PS-OBx2, naxx25 sigil, UP - 3200dps


21/50/0, IT-BS-OBx2, naxx25 sigil, UP - 3300dps


21/50/0, IT-BS-OBx2, naxx25 sigil, BP - 3200dps

From time to time I have recognized similar issues (sometimes it seems like, it doesn't bring any rune back but only consume the death rune).

Since round about one week im am using the IT-BS-FS-OB-FS-OB-FS rotation and overall I am very pleased with it. However there seems to be an delay in this rotation. After 18 seconds you should be able to strike the forth Obliterate. At this time we are missing one frost rune(the death rune we start with is used for the second obliterate and comes back as a blood rune instead). The necessary frost rune comes from cooldown 20.5 seconds after rotation start (it's the frost rune used for the second IT). So basically we delay the fourth obliterate by 2.5 seconds.

Any ideas how to optimize it further?

I can't understand how the IT-BS-FS-OB-FS-OB-FS rotation is maintainable. I tried it even with a blood tap for a death rune and found it impossible to keep running.

Is there something I'm doing wrong?

I think the two items that aren't displaying properly are his Greatness card and IT sigil.

I switched today from 32/39 Duel Wield to 2hander 23/48 [pushing some Tundra Stalker out for VOtTW].

My self buffed dps w/ Ghoul 32/39 on the boss dummy clocked in at ~2175dps.
My self buffed dps No Ghoul 23/48 on the boss dummy clocked in at ~2350dps.

I used Unholy Presence and 6 IT rotation. The feal of it is great, and I think I like it better than 2 Oblit rotation.

I am using Titansteel Destroyer and the IT sigil.

Just my initial opinion, I think the 6 IT looks superior to 2 Oblits if you lack the Sigil and lack a high item level epic 2hander. Also, I lack expertise and the 6 IT rotation w/ Unholy Presence is more forgiving.

I've tried to go through this post determining the parses between 3.0.8 and previously.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft<--- 0/44/27 build.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft <--- 21/50/0 ( I take it you use this build instead of getting into Unholy because one PS isn't much damage, and no Death Runes from OB)



Are both these builds trying to use Unholy Presence? And if so, is it just trying to maximize the KM procs of melee and use them for FS and wait for Rime procs for HB? That's kinda what I'm getting at, I just still thought 15% more damage was better than the 15% attk speed modifier especially on a crit dependent build.

UP also gets a 1.0 second gcd. Certain frost builds can actually use the extra gcds well enough to match the 15% damage from BP.

Match or go beyond? The way I've been reading it, you use it for the GCD for extra Frost Strike spam, which makes sense, but are you still trying to prioritize for KM on those or do you burn em anyways and just hope KM is there for it?

I'm doing a few tests with my shitty gear (Wierd thing is I'm doing ~2k damage on boss dummies with just ghoul, using 17/0./54

EDIT: I'm using 21/50/0 and with my gear (The World of Warcraft Armory) I did 2.6k on the boss dummy which is actually high for me considering I was 2k with 17/0/54

EDI: I tried 21/50/0 and did a boss dummy for

Not breakin' any records with it but its about 300~ dps more than 17/0/54 was doing on boss dummies.

Obviously gear plays the biggest factor, im 4 piece T7, TItansteel Destroyer, Sigil of Haunted Dreams (workin on IT one)

Rotation being used (actually gettin pretty solid on them)

start with PS-IT-BS-BS-OB- Rune dump (usually 2-3 Frost Strikes and if Rime procs I use that) then

I continue with PS - IT-IT-IT-IT-IT (sometimes I don't have 6 if I didnt notice a BS parry X.x)- IT - repeat.

How do I get this mysterious 3k number?

I was fooling around earlier with some different specs, and I was wondering if I could get any input, I wanted to try out some x/44/y 2h builds, just messing around you know and well.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Is the first one I tried, and I was incredibly surprised to find myself pushing about 2200 DPS self buffed ( horn ) on the boss dummy, before glyphing or upgrading my sigil.. with much of my gear being substandard. ( Blood presence, IT-PS-BS-BS-OB rotation, tried using both death runes as IT or as another oblit, OB seemed a little bit ahead, but again, no sigil... howling blast on rime procs, FS dump while runes were on cooldown )

armory: The World of Warcraft Armory





The other build I was going to test out was a 27/44/0 build: Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Any input on anyone else who's messed around with anything similar would be great, again, only reason I'm bringing it up is because I was surprised with how high my numbers were. Thanks!

Seems you and me are pretty close in DPS.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

That's a build I was looking at, I saw it thinking the tradeoff is Unbreakable Armor and a flat 10% for Abom's Might, reason I thought against it was because I can get that buff from our MM hunter. Loss of the expertise kinda hurts too. Also I still think taking Death Rune mastery is worth it because you spam OB and the Death Runes are nice for extra ITs (assuming you're using the sigil and glyph)

I still wanna try out a week of 0/44/27 because of the Necrosis and BCB procs, since you're a lil more haste dependent. It's intriguing to me.

Your numbers and mine are kinda close together though