I'm still learning my new 51/0/20 tree so I hope I won't say something completely stupid : but I don't understand why points in Epidemic are considered as wasted ? If I'm lucky and I have a lot of Sudden Doom procs, Epidemic allows me to launch more DC and still have 6 HS in my rotation before diseases expire.
Critical DCs (SD procs) do more damage than average IT and PS damage if I read correctly my wwstats , and Epidemic allow me to increase the ratios number of DC/number of IT-PS in a whole fight. (the longer the diseases last, the less I have to launch IT/PS and the more I can launch DC and 6 HS).
The usefulness of epidemic depends on the rotation you are using. The no-disease rotation doesn't have a need for epidemic, due to not using diseases. The 6 x HS does, as it's impossible to fit 6 x HS into a rotation without the added disease time of epidemic.
I've never been able to pull the same DPS without diseases as I can with them, so I take epidemic for the extra leeway and throw in my SD procs when they pop. I get an extra 10-15k damage (from DC) vs. the other blood (when he actually goes blood) DK who doesn't (or didn't!) hit his SD procs as much.
Epidemic is also nice on AoE trash where there aren't enough mobs left to justify spamming pesitlence, but HS cleave away!
For some reason though, I get back to back SD procs alot, and it's annoying because I hit a second HS before (spam gooooo) before I see the buff applied from sudden doom. =(
@Ewokchili: First of all, i dont think this is a thread for exploits. There are many forums on the subject, but here is the "legal and official", normal way. And locking a rune by a bug from blood tap is, imo, exploit.
Second, deseaseless rotation is not just ob ob hs hs. Its 51 0 20, and usually it goes around this:
ob ob hs hs DC hs hs hs hs hs hs DC, for example. Depending on whether you get more dps from using 1 rune for HS or 2 runes for OB, you either put priority on OB or on HS.
I know IT has been ruled out for the Blood Strike Glyph but what about Thunder Clap?? Forgive me if it has been already stated, I dont remember any thing on it.
has anyone seen a change today on the runes not refreshing properly.
I am 51/0/20 and for my rotation its ps it hs hs ob ps it hs hs hs hs and then i'm waiting about 2sec or so to wait for the final ob, then i usually rp dump, but seems something isnt right.
I can be 100% sure i havent messed up the rotation, since i've been this spec since beta. Any info on this would be great!!
has anyone seen a change today on the runes not refreshing properly.
I am 51/0/20 and for my rotation its ps it hs hs ob ps it hs hs hs hs and then i'm waiting about 2sec or so to wait for the final ob, then i usually rp dump, but seems something isnt right.
I can be 100% sure i havent messed up the rotation, since i've been this spec since beta. Any info on this would be great!!
Yeah, I'm not sure exactly what it is that's doing it, but blood tap is messing it up pretty badly, sometimes it resets and sometimes it doesn't and it messes me up in my rotation. I've spec'd both frost and blood and I can confirm that this does definitely happen to death runes in both specs. I think empowered rune weapon might reset it though.
Has anyones' spreadsheet tried to correctly model stacking ar.pen with the 51/13/7 build?I have a theory that the build runs much as an raiding Arms Warrior spec pre 3.0.So in saying that before the patch it was quite beneficial for an Arms to stack ar.pen,so utilizing the "Grim Toll" trinket plus socketing the "Fractured Scarlet Ruby",wouldn't that almost achieve in some cases 53% attack effectiveness?
Atleast considering the fact that Blood dps is based on the armor content of said boss?Alright so at the current time I have nine sockets in which I can switch over 9*16= 145(rating) passive socketed to gear.Now add in your food buffs of 40 from food,and 45 from pot that shoots you up to 230 at which your sitting at 13.60% roughly pssive ar.pen,now depending on if you posess the trinket,which grants 612 on proc ar.pen that now sits you at 842 ar.pen(rating).Or 52.623 % increased strike effectiveness.
From what I can tell though the tooltip on ar.pen is misleading,with diminshing returns I believe the percentage instead of being 16 rating per 1% of ar.pen,in all reality its around 19 per 1% of rating.So maybe someone with a little more mathematical expertise could guide me along with this.
Has anyones' spreadsheet tried to correctly model stacking ar.pen with the 51/13/7 build?I have a theory that the build runs much as an raiding Arms Warrior spec pre 3.0.So in saying that before the patch it was quite beneficial for an Arms to stack ar.pen,so utilizing the "Grim Toll" trinket plus socketing the "Fractured Scarlet Ruby",wouldn't that almost achieve in some cases 53% attack effectiveness?
Atleast considering the fact that Blood dps is based on the armor content of said boss?Alright so at the current time I have nine sockets in which I can switch over 9*16= 145(rating) passive socketed to gear.Now add in your food buffs of 40 from food,and 45 from pot that shoots you up to 230 at which your sitting at 13.60% roughly pssive ar.pen,now depending on if you posess the trinket,which grants 612 on proc ar.pen that now sits you at 842 ar.pen(rating).Or 52.623 % increased strike effectiveness.
From what I can tell though the tooltip on ar.pen is misleading,with diminshing returns I believe the percentage instead of being 16 rating per 1% of ar.pen,in all reality its around 19 per 1% of rating.So maybe someone with a little more mathematical expertise could guide me along with this.
*EDIT*:for bone-headedness.
Rawr 2.1.9 is now correctly modeling armor penetration (or, at least, better than it used to), and for no gear set I've evaluated in blood spec does armor penetration come out better than strength, though it is definitely a strong stat for blood. It's not a stat worth socketing, food buffing, or elixiring, but it's leaps and bounds better than the other "throwaway" stat blizzard has itemized naxx with, haste.
Haste is great for Duel-Wielding Death Knights who use spells as their primary source of damage. You don't benefit from haste as much because you use a two-handed weapon and use weapon strikes that don't get their GCD reduced by haste. For example, a 0/20/51 values haste very highly because with enough haste, they can use 7 GCDs in 10 seconds in Blood Presence. The pets (ghoul and gargoyle) both benefit from the haste as well. The set was designed with stats that would benefit all builds. The haste benefits duel-wield but the set bonuses favor two-handed. Balanced.
When examining the stat values for any build, it is important to notice these things. The values for even a 51/13/7 are different from a 51/0/20. Some things you can take for granted. Strength, for example, is the best stat for all builds after hit capping for spells. Once you know your specific values, you can then judge your equipment accordingly.
Like an unchecked cancer, hate corrodes the personality and eats away its vital unity. Hate destroys a man's sense of values and his objectivity. It causes him to describe the beautiful as ugly and the ugly as beautiful, and to confuse the true with the false and the false with the true.
Martin Luther King Jr.
Haste is great for Duel-Wielding Death Knights who use spells as their primary source of damage. You don't benefit from haste as much because you use a two-handed weapon and use weapon strikes that don't get their GCD reduced by haste. For example, a 0/20/51 values haste very highly because with enough haste, they can use 7 GCDs in 10 seconds in Blood Presence. The pets (ghoul and gargoyle) both benefit from the haste as well. The set was designed with stats that would benefit all builds. The haste benefits duel-wield but the set bonuses favor two-handed. Balanced.
When examining the stat values for any build, it is important to notice these things. The values for even a 51/13/7 are different from a 51/0/20. Some things you can take for granted. Strength, for example, is the best stat for all builds after hit capping for spells. Once you know your specific values, you can then judge your equipment accordingly.
if you have best in slot and your hit capped and stacked strength as your main stat, i think the question that is floating around right now at least until blizzard gets things straight on all classes is what spec is superior 51/13/7 or 51/0/20.
And your saying the values for each spec is different, what is it you see that is different between those two that maybe one makes it better than the other.
Btw thanks for the information it helps, i'm just trying to figure out blod specs and which one will be or become superior.
if you have best in slot and your hit capped and stacked strength as your main stat, i think the question that is floating around right now at least until blizzard gets things straight on all classes is what spec is superior 51/13/7 or 51/0/20.
And your saying the values for each spec is different, what is it you see that is different between those two that maybe one makes it better than the other.
Btw thanks for the information it helps, i'm just trying to figure out blod specs and which one will be or become superior.
That exact statement is what gets me,from my napkin math(which has actually turned out to be two pages of statistics)The way that the unholy tree augments the base str. more-so than the already str and expertise heavy blood tree,stacking str. is the logical assumption,atleast in the 51/0/20 build.
Now,because of the way the 51/13/7 build works by mechanics alone,I'm actually parsing the ar.pen build running higher numbers,atleast in regards to a say four minute fight,tank and spank such as patchwerk.Because the amount of armor the boss has mitigates the damage done by the strikes of the 51/1x/0x build,the only logical assumption atleast initially is to stack ar.pen.
While its confirmed that the mage FFB debuff will allow the blood strike glyph to work on bosses, are there any other debuffs that cause this that will be up on a boss at all times? I'm not talking about people putting up Chains of Ice or other debuffs that don't actually fit in a normal rotation. After the last patch a lot of mages are switching to arcane so it will be hard to get use of this BS glyph if FFB is the only thing.
Hey guys, heres a WWS parse of my naxx25 tonight. I was 51/0/20 doing a no disease rotation 2x OB 2x HS. Pretty much all over all over the top of the DPS meters and I pulled 6800 DPS on patchwerk including AotD. (the 7400DPS warlock had a doomguard and a Tricks of the Trade rotation going on him lol) Anyways this was my first night as Diseaseless blood and I was fairly impressed. Anyone else pulling these kinds of numbers? Glyphs were Obliterate Blood Strike and Ghoul.
While its confirmed that the mage FFB debuff will allow the blood strike glyph to work on bosses, are there any other debuffs that cause this that will be up on a boss at all times? I'm not talking about people putting up Chains of Ice or other debuffs that don't actually fit in a normal rotation. After the last patch a lot of mages are switching to arcane so it will be hard to get use of this BS glyph if FFB is the only thing.
A dual wield DK usually has a few points in desecration and that counts as a snare. Not the same kind of uptime, but fairly decent.
I'm in the same boat. Bout to put my Mage CL hat on and make one of them go back to FFB. Maybe I'll make a fib about Torment of the Weak only working with REAL snares....I hope they don't read this.
Hey guys, heres a WWS parse of my naxx25 tonight. I was 51/0/20 doing a no disease rotation 2x OB 2x HS. Pretty much all over all over the top of the DPS meters and I pulled 6800 DPS on patchwerk including AotD. (the 7400DPS warlock had a doomguard and a Tricks of the Trade rotation going on him lol) Anyways this was my first night as Diseaseless blood and I was fairly impressed. Anyone else pulling these kinds of numbers? Glyphs were Obliterate Blood Strike and Ghoul.
What I dont get is that your armory shows 4257 AP. I went through every single item you have and compared it to mine and i found a difference of 280 AP between us. Mainly because of Bandits Insignia and Jewelcrafting. But somehow I only got 3888 AP, i just dont see where the missing 100AP come from.
I've been beating on the Highlord Nemesis Target dummy for a while, and it seems like OBx2 HS x2 DC spam gives me ~200 DPS more than OB x2 HSx2 DC spam HS x6. Is it because HSx6 scales better with buffs? I'm getting just shy of 2.5k completely unbuffed with the OBx2 HSx2, and barely scratching 2.3k with the HSx6 spam.
It could also be that I'm doing something wrong, but I'm not sure what it could be.
02/03/09, 12:06 PM
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