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Old 08/31/10, 3:58 PM   #1021
Disargeria
Piston Honda
 
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Human Death Knight
 
Boulderfist
It would be totally awesome if you could add Scarlet Fever and Blade Barrier to the priority for Blood.

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Old 09/01/10, 6:01 PM   #1022
zaalin
Glass Joe
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Duskwood
Hello, I'm a fan of your simulator, however, I want to know if there's any way to sim whether pre-potting using wild magic is more beneficial than pre-potting using a haste pot given the fact that bloodlust is used about 2 seconds into the encounter.

I realize that this question is a bit...out there, but I want to know so I can better min/max for 25M HM LK

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Old 09/01/10, 9:26 PM   #1023
Afabar
Don Flamenco
 
Draenei Death Knight
 
Chants Eternels (EU)
Originally Posted by zaalin View Post
Hello, I'm a fan of your simulator, however, I want to know if there's any way to sim whether pre-potting using wild magic is more beneficial than pre-potting using a haste pot given the fact that bloodlust is used about 2 seconds into the encounter.

I realize that this question is a bit...out there, but I want to know so I can better min/max for 25M HM LK
Wild magic potion are not included, however I don't see how 200 crit for 15 second could be better than 500 haste for the same time.


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Old 09/01/10, 11:30 PM   #1024
zaalin
Glass Joe
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Duskwood
with a haste pot and bloodlust I am put over the gcd cap of 1 second, which greatly deteriorates the value of haste. As a result I'm not sure if wild magic or speed would be better for pre-potting in this situation

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Old 09/02/10, 2:39 AM   #1025
Spuddelkopf
Von Kaiser
 
Night Elf Death Knight
 
Thrall (EU)
The main use of haste is the increased auto attack speed, as far as I know. For that it is even more beneficial to use speed pot and Bloodlust together than after each other as their haste bonus is multiplied not added together (haste from haste rating is multiplied with %-haste buffs and multiple %-haste buffs are also multplied by each other).
As the only GCDs that are reduced by haste are spell GCDs and our special attack output is still restricted by runes/runic power which don't come in faster with more haste (yet) and haste is such a good stat regardless (which is because of its increase in auto attack damage), I don't see how 200 crit could possibly be better than 500 haste just because with the haste you would be reaching the GCD cap for the few spells we use.

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Old 09/09/10, 7:37 AM   #1026
Herrfugbaum
Glass Joe
 
Undead Death Knight
 
Ambossar (EU)
Hi, I have a problem. The live versions of Kahorie's don't work on my computer for some reason (and yes i have Silverlight), the hard client works, but the Armory function doesn't work correctly and if I try to enter my items i get an exception every time. I can click continue though and this way I could generate my stat weights.

I now would very much appreciate if someone with time on their hands can recalculate my EP Values so I can check if in spite of the errors i get, the stat weights I calculated are valid.

Armorylink: The World of Warcraft Armory - Ømgãkzëñtê @ Ambossar - Profile
Character is: Ømgãkzëñtê
on: EU-Ambossar

This is what I got so far
EP AttackPower | 1 (0,86 DPS/per AP)
EP Strength | 2,74
EP CritRating | 1,93
EP HasteEstimated | 1,7
EP HasteRating1 | 1,86
EP ArmorPenetrationRating | 2,37
EP WeaponDPS | 6,63
EP 2T10 | 307,32
EP 4T10 | 352,44
EP DeathbringersWill | 386,9
EP WhisperingFangedSkull | 377,38


I hope this doesn't count as handholding.

p.s.: I read I should gem Haste/Strength in Yellowsockets provided they have +Strength bonus, if my stat weights are indeed correct, is that not wrong, and I should and have gemmed correctly Crit/Strength?

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Old 10/05/10, 9:53 PM   #1027
Cayseth
Glass Joe
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Blackmoore (EU)
The online client isn't working for me as well, but only on Firefox (tried with deactivated Advertise Blocker too). It seems to be full functionable with GC or IE.


@Herrfugbaum

The easiest way to enter the correct stats is to import your armory via chardev.org, reset talents and add flask&bufffood (because it isn't implemented yet). You can identify the green AP value via RangedAP-Agility.

This is what I get for your gear:

SpellHit | 3
CritRating | 1,97
Haste | 1,78

Therefore you should go for Str/Hit, though I'm not sure if the Sim is right in here, to confirm it just try two different gear setups: one with crit ametrines, one with hit ametrines, and choose the more powerful DPS.

P.S.: Everytime you change gear, the EP values change. Because of this, normally one can't determine universal EP values. Especially with Frost I recommend to generate the EP values on your own.

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Old 10/14/10, 12:12 AM   #1028
Azhe
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Stonemaul
The Cata simulator is giving me wildly inaccurate results for Unholy DPS (I have not tested frost yet).

Here is my character.
The World of Warcraft Armory - Elretardo @ Stonemaul - Profile

I'm using more or less the standard unholy spec, only difference is I dropped the 1 point in butchery so I could have my beloved chain death grip in PvP.

On the target dummy, self buffed only, my DPS ranges from 9100 to 9500, yet the sim predicts only ~5500:


Ability Damage done    hits   Crits   Misses  Glances  TPS Uptime
 Total % # Avg # % Avg # % Avg # Avg # Avg % %
ScourgeStrike767578150191756774369125359339868503186790279738500000
MainHand667331709162834863151125413191642863523832291573857172113412400
Ghoul56016910714553956133026067283347160395165829001328895822400
DeathCoil46461110111124841372291061293073337805856270000000
ScourgeStrike+ScourgeStrikeMagical2983938747175677169817567716981000000000000
BloodPlague29401356572401711224175278965736489319252700000099
FrostFever293409729723987312231751809647364693192627000000100
Ghoul: Claw22666099861860471218132267104071537801658290000000
BloodStrike216654812568003318648050246567199534923283790500000
PlagueStrike9196595022446637591736529106771015836281381500000
IcyTouch7584481622448030981773824287267424863280000000
Gargoyle6574432522201929862201929861000000000000
UnholyBlight46483428112484137212484101000000000000
Army of the Dead415564911491040854664668595245748050000000
DPS 5597(+/- 814)
Total Damage 4110.42m
RunicPower Total runic power used: 2876202 (2 wasted)
Threat Per Second 3786
Generated in 37.13 s
Template uh80
Priority Unholy
Presence Unholy
Sigil
RuneEnchant
Pet Calculation True


Today I did a 25N Saurfang as a benchmark for raid DPS. In this raid there was no windfury, no bloodlust, and my pet was dead for the last several seconds. But my DPS was about 15000. However, the sim predicts only about 11k, even with full raid buffs and debuffs (and yes, with the ICC buff set at 30):

WoL Parse: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Fully buffed simulator results for fight of equal duration:


Ability Damage done    hits   Crits   Misses  Glances  TPS Uptime
 Total % # Avg # % Avg # % Avg # Avg # Avg % %
MainHand15301150541936044756841192723168311499076337392040359126822182400
ScourgeStrike136757063717179661761210976454825869897109563710153500000
Ghoul1334724404177056972490258326143637277729285839678016964210022400
DeathCoil79950177810134150596084562435262495888702362398200000
ScourgeStrike+ScourgeStrikeMagical5476664507179661304817966130481000000000000
BloodPlague500886045624032220841515351523638878730423700000099
FrostFever5001005136240256208215164015226388616303937000000100
Ghoul: Claw4123450185185884221811294917996172935286839172000000
BloodStrike380949200569178550741539393857276397864383942500000
Gargoyle1901675722472124028424533659884759732210851200000
PlagueStrike16041330522445665591491947135895379448371409500000
IcyTouch1240539572244805068152333676619247736037432200000
UnholyBlight79927138113415059613415001000000000000
Army of the Dead607859641792968777136697690792998610760000000
DPS 10879(+/- 3331)
Total Damage 7989.21m
RunicPower Total runic power used: 2928590 (8 wasted)
Threat Per Second 7012
Generated in 37.24 s
Template uh80
Priority Unholy
Presence Unholy
Sigil
RuneEnchant
Pet Calculation True

I have the simulator configured to use unholy presence, the default Unholy.xml priority, NoIntro, and the default Scenario.xml.

Are other people seeing better closure between the sim and target dummy and raid parses?? Are these results due to a bug on my side or is this kind of behavior reproducible. Since people are already using this sim to produce tentative statweights and draw conclusions about different specs, I assume someone somewhere has some reasonable validation data...



Also, the ranges on the simulation results, especially the +/- 3000 in the fully buffed case, seem absurd. I suppose it is possible that one simulation trial maybe got 20 dodges in a row or something ridiculous like that, causing a low DPS number, and maybe another trial got runic corruption procs on every DC and/or a long crit streak...but if this is the case then the RNG range of the reported DPS really ought to be expressed as a standard deviation or variance statistic (or better yet, a histogram), rather than a simple min/max range. The way things presently are, it is impossible to get a meaningful idea of what kind of DPS variations can be expected in practice, which makes it impossible to determine whether or not a DPS delta is statistically significant (e.g. when evaluating stat/gear/spec changes)

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Old 10/14/10, 12:24 AM   #1029
Consider
King Hippo
 
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Draenei Death Knight
 
Dragonblight
If you're getting a 3k damage range, I can only assume you're doing something wrong. I can't find a way to get a gap that big, with any level of gear or with any spec. Generally speaking, the range is +- 10%, which is perfectly logical for RNG variance.

At any rate, the simulator does appear to be currently calculating the magical aspect of SS improperly... but after some testing, I can't find any rhyme or reason to it. Most of the time, it the magical portion hits for 40% of the physical portion. That's nothing more than .36 * 1.3 * 1.08, and that's what the sim assumes. Sometimes, however, it hits for seemingly random amounts like 63% - and it's not some odd anomaly, as it happens fairly often. Analyzing combat logs, I can't seem to link it to any sort of specific buff or what have you.

I'm at a loss as to what's going on there. Something strange.

Ghoul damage is absurdly off the mark; way too low. Likely something to do with how SI/DT are applied, but who knows. It should be over 50% higher than it is.

Aside from that, some small issues; ghoul scales with crit when it still doesn't (likely a bug), FF crits for 2x when it actually does 1.5x (likely a bug), and death coil's damage is too low (beats me why).

I'm sure the kinks will be worked out by Kahorie soon enough, and I can all but guarantee even once this is all fixed the order of stats won't actually change, anyways. How Unholy appears to perform compared to Frost may be currently misrepresented because of all this, but with the current Obliterate bug, that hardly even matters!

Last edited by Consider : 10/14/10 at 12:59 AM.

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Old 10/14/10, 3:19 PM   #1030
Azhe
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Stonemaul
I remembered that with the 3.3 version of the sim, I had a similar problem with huge damage ranges (as much as +/- 9k!!) using the silverlight client, but not the hardclient.

Thinking this might have something to do with Silverlight, I tried repeating the raid buffed simulation in my last post on a different computer. All the conditions are the same, but this time I get 13.7kdps...I've tried multiple times and double checked all the settings are the same on both machines, but I consistently get very different results. The damage ranges are still very high, though.

Also, if you look at the simulator output in my last post, it looks like the sim never cast FeS! So that probably explains the very low DPS. I have no idea what could be causing this. I never modified the priority, and in any case the priority is identical between both machines. Does anyone have any idea what could possibly be causing this behavior.

Ability Damage done    hits   Crits   Misses  Glances  TPS Uptime
 Total % # Avg # % Avg # % Avg # Avg # Avg % %
ScourgeStrike189674915619240538788514727156845893267113623713500500000
MainHand173192467617372660464821981632965615284465923921009500000
Ghoul1612359788167290862212444713159761284373317239717000000
DeathCoil981599501101594066158101104451062583029015362768200000
ScourgeStrike+ScourgeStrikeMagical7804453888240538324524053832451000000000000
FesteringStrike62881466065955110559364397610582311215208373439600000
Gargoyle52960356851280534136115192375888128617521102185200000
BloodPlague5190949765241599214915278715736388812313937000000103
FrostFever5139323485240471213715245915666388012312737000000102
Ghoul: Claw4882133355185864262711372822666172136319539191000000
UnholyBlight98114285115940661615940601000000000000
PlagueStrike85095253112658672377734848584885970537701500000
Army of the Dead677022031911208748192387390919708810904000000
IcyTouch64079066112423515878883782624535755236222200000
BloodStrike5615499519906566959454055573961809138593600000
DPS 13690(+/- 4033)
Total Damage 10053.88m
RunicPower Total runic power used: 4034026 (1174 wasted)
Threat Per Second 8595
Generated in 24.31 s
Template uh
Priority Unholy
Presence Unholy
Sigil
RuneEnchant
Pet Calculation True

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Old 10/14/10, 6:51 PM   #1031
Afabar
Don Flamenco
 
Draenei Death Knight
 
Chants Eternels (EU)
Thanks for pointing errors. It's easier for me to look into the thousand code lines where there could be a problem.

I don't have time to make a hot fix cause it's late here, but I have found that the coef of DC is 0.15xAP in the sim instead of 0.3. I don't see anything wrong with SS except that the overall damage is low. And it's maybe the default priority that make Festering Strike not cast enough. Maybe putting it higher in the prio would make the trick as it won't use a death rune, just pure blood/frost.

I have also to check in game if the AP/Str coef are correct for the ghoul. Your WWS claw is making 1/2 of your ghoul damage where mine is 1/3.
If someone can check what the AP to STR coef, base AP/Str of the ghoul, I could correct that tomorrow or it will wait until this weekend.

Last edited by Afabar : 10/14/10 at 7:06 PM.


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Old 10/14/10, 7:06 PM   #1032
Consider
King Hippo
 
Consider's Avatar
 
Draenei Death Knight
 
Dragonblight
It gets 2 AP per 1 Strength, still, and gets 1.4x of our strength with the glyph. A simple means of testing is Horn of Winter; it adds 506 AP which, based on the fact that it gives us 155*1.15=178.25 str, almost perfectly fits the simple formula of 1.4str * 2.

Claw deals exactly 1.25 times the average auto-attack (and 1.5 times when under the effects of Dark Transformation, of course). Looking at the above sims, the average Claw is way, way below what it should be based on the average (non-glancing) auto-attack. Not sure how it's being calculated, but something's up there.

Last edited by Consider : 10/14/10 at 7:11 PM.

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Old 10/14/10, 7:07 PM   #1033
Afabar
Don Flamenco
 
Draenei Death Knight
 
Chants Eternels (EU)
Pure speculation regarding scourge strike: The 62% SS magical is 40% expected x 1.5, which would indicate a sort of undocumented crit or mastery based random bonus. One option would be the Glyph of Scourge Strike - Spell - World of Warcraft. In the effect part of the spell there is a damage modifier and "Unknown Effect (Effect #0) Value: 9" where the Glyph of Obliterate - Spell - World of Warcraft just have the damage modifier.


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Old 10/15/10, 11:24 PM   #1034
aggixx
Von Kaiser
 
aggixx's Avatar
 
Tauren Druid
 
Hyjal
Engineering tinkers now stack with normal enchants (just like how BS sockets stack with wrist and glove enchants), if you could add that to the next build it would be much appreciated.

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Old 10/16/10, 7:33 PM   #1035
Midnightlynx
Glass Joe
 
Undead Warlock
 
Stonemaul
A quick sim of my character showed the following:
EP AttackPower 1 (0.75 DPS/per AP)
EP Strength 2.88
EP Agility 0.72
EP CritRating 1.2
EP MasteryRating 1.68
EP HasteRating 1.68
EP ExpertiseRating 1.30
Personal Expertise value 0.48
Before Melee Hit Cap 1.19
EP SpellHitRating 1.35
EP WeaponDPS 5.07
EP WeaponSpeed 266.67
EP AfterSpellHitRating 1.13
pawn Non hit caped Pawn: v1: "Non hit caped": MasteryRating=1.68, HitRating=1.19, CritRating=1.2, Dps=5.07, Strength=2.88, Armor=0.028, Agility=0.72, HasteRating=0, Speed=266.67, ExpertiseRating=1.30, Ap=1, GemQualityLevel=82 )
pawn hit caped Pawn: v1: "Hit caped": MasteryRating=1.68, HitRating=1.35, CritRating=1.2, Dps=5.07, Strength=2.88, Armor=0.028, Agility=0.72, HasteRating=0, Speed=266.67, ExpertiseRating=1.30, Ap=1, GemQualityLevel=82 )
Generated in 529.80 s
I notice a few things that don't fit what I know about DKs here.
1) Hit Rating is given a higher value on the 'Hit Capped' scale than the non-capped scale.
2) Haste rating has 0 value. (Edit: whoops, make that no haste value in the scale-format output. The long-form feedback clearly lists one. I've been staring at numbers too long.)
3) Hit and Expertise are worth considerably less than Strength.


I hope this can help get things tuned in accuracy-wise. And if it's off because of some option I missed, feel free to let me know.
Character - Seraphel, Stonemaul US (I know my gear's shabby, I just started this DPS set.)
(Edit: Wow, I don't know what's up with Armory's version of me. Here's a Wowhead profile.
Profiler - Wowhead)

Last edited by Midnightlynx : 10/17/10 at 12:08 AM. Reason: Solved first problem, discovered a different one.

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