I can confirm that GoSS rolls coefficients and that Pestilence resets the GoSS counter, if secondary targets are hit. However in a true AE situation (like Anub) there won't be a lot of runes available for SS since you also DnD. The only encounter that springs to my mind where you permanently have a secondary target, but don't want to DnD is Twins.

10 men Arhas has a 2nd target very frequently.

I made some simple calculations to check if it's worth to DnD on just two targets, or just rely on diseases+WP.

Choice for 2nd part of rotation is SS SS DC vs. DnD BS. With numbers from my last ICC log that about evens out.

With or without GoDnD?

I just need confirmation for my math.

Regarding future hardmodes with lot of movement, where reaching my target faster or escaping damage can be critical. I was thinking about dropping 2 points in dark conviction and picking up improved unholy presence.

I lose 2% crit which equals approx. 44 critrating. 44 critrating are around 88 Statweights at my ilvl.
88 AP are ~ 58 DPS.

So i lose around 58 DPS on fights where i don't have to move.
But i reach every Mob i have to switch an run to 16% faster. That would be for Lady Deathwhisper, Rotface, Prof. Putricide, Blood Princes, Queen, Valithria (maybe even marrowgar in hardmodes).

I took the statconversions from this thread for ~ilvl 245-250.

At lvl 80 1% crit = 45.91 crit rating. so you would be giving up 91.82 crit rating worth of stats.

In that level of gear 1 crit rating is worth 2.16 AP so that would be an effective loss of 198.3 AP. With 1 AP being equal to 0.93 dps that is a DPS loss of 184.4 DPS.

So lets assume, in that gear you are doing 8k DPS. That would mean you lose 2.3% of your DPS. To make it back you would have to have 2.3% more time DPSing on the boss thanks to the run speed than you would without it. Since the run speed is 15% increased that means you would have to be spending 2.3 / 0.15 = 15% of the fight running between adds doing no damage to make back the DPS you lose when you get there. In short, even on highly mobile fights it probably isnt worth it. Of course if you don't currently have a DPS enchant on your feet you can make back about half the stat loss, but then you would be giving up a run speed enchant so the gain would also be halved making it pretty much the same numbers.

1 AP is .63 DPS at that ilvl, not .93. So it's a ~124.9 DPS loss, ~1.56% in your scenario.

As a wise man once said, There is no right and wrong answer as to whether or not one should spec into IUP.

Last week, for experimental purposes, I moved 2 points from Dark Conviction to 2 in Improved Unholy Presence in order to see the differences. For normal modes, the result was rather underwhelming. The fights that need a lot of movements are not difficult ones so far in Icecrown Citadel. Perhaps when hard modes or achievements factors come in. Such as Full House and Putricide's.

In comparison, the 2 points in Morbidity seems to be a much greater investment than Dark Conviction (or Improved Unholy Presence). It has a huge usage return in investment for Valithria, although that fight isn't too difficult, it is also useful for Sindragosa's tombs, and Lich King. For guilds who still do Anub'arak 25 hard mode, it goes without saying that it is priceless there.

I was wondering when to use ERW the most effectively for a Reaping spec. At the moment I use it like this for a single target situation (Most of the time at the start of the fight with as many procs running as possible);

IT, PS, BSx2, SS, Garg, HoW, SS, DC, SSx2, ERW, SSx2, BSx2 (Or Pest depending on situation), DCx2

Currently using that method my diseases fall off just before or after the 1st Blood Strike. So Im wondering is this the most effective way of doing it (I.e. Is it possible to use ERW and all abilities afterwards be under the effect of diseases)?

For AoE I follow this rotation;

IT, PS, Pest, DnD, ERW, SSx2, BB/BS, BB/BS, DCx2

Im pretty sure for AoE that is the best use of ERW?

As a side note (Appologise if this has been asked/answered before), being a tank quite often in both 10 & 25man I always apply IT first for FF. Is there a special reason to use PS first for dps (I assume it is because PS is melee based and IT is spell based, therefore perhaps proccing the melee based procs for the following IT)?

I was wondering about the optimum glyphs for The Lich King encounter, I initially started with full AOE gylphs, GoD, DnD, and IT. More recently I've been rethinking using the Death and Decay glyph as it just seems to be padding my numbers unnecessarily on phase 1, the trash ghouls die without difficultly and I could put back in GotG (which usually stays full time on the Lich King) Death and Decay is also of limited usage during the following phases. GoD is very useful and seems worth keeping due to the multiple target swaps and the high level of movement during the fight. Any thoughts on this?

For single-target boss encounters, generally use the IT-PS(PS-IT, whatever the encounter requires as far as starting the encounter) BSx2-SS-Gargoyle-ERW...setup. The ERW here re-aligns your runes so you won't have to adjust the rotation around the gargoyle. Usually seems to work best, using it almost right away, especially if the fight is long enough where you can use it a 2nd time.

It is usually used on the run in anyway due to you have to physically get there first, but in situations where you are in melee range first you can PS first to apply the spell dmg debuff and buff not only the IT you will do but the whol raids initial magic dmg.

Starting with the last first. Basically using PS first is best because you get Rage of Rivendare going straight away. However if you start at range (Marrowgar / Festergut / Rotface / BQL / etc) you best start with icy touch.
Then again for dps this can mess up your disease timers a bit, but I generally time IT to land just before i can put up PS.

As for ERW.

I have recently been experimenting with the disease juggling that Potlol (and a few others) were mentioning a few posts back: http://elitistjerks.com/f72/t72364-u...7/#post1544510

And i have to say im positively surprised by how effective this is. Not only do you get an extra disease tick every 20 seconds. You also pretty much eliminate the bad timing the normal rotation has. In a normal rotation you reapply diseases 0-1 second before it runs out, meaning that you have 5-6 seconds without a single disease tick.
It seems that juggling diseases this way results in a pretty noticeable advantage. Assuming your diseases do about 12% of your total dps, and this technique gives you 2 extra ticks every rotation. That means a 16.67% increase in disease damage or a 2% dps increase.

The juggling either requires you to adjust your rotation, or use the ERW methode that Potlol described. I tried the ERW method since I always found I personally wasn't getting the max out of ERW, and this could be a good way to solve that.

Basically my rotation becomes:
IT>PS>SS>BS>BS> Gargoyle > ERW
SS>SS>DC>SS>DC

After this the runes for IT and PS come up at the exact same time. I'll refresh PS when the timer dips below 3 seconds, and then IT right after that (should have just run out). And the next i'll do it the other way around.

For AoE I tend to save ERW for when it really packs a punch, or when it's really needed. And i think i do it pretty much the same way you do, only i try to use it this way after ERW: BS>SS>BB>SS
That way when the runes come back up the ones for DnD are paired up, and a blood rune comes up first so i can pestilence first (just inside the disease timer).

One thing that I noticed right off that bat is that you have 2 Blood strikes at the very end of your rotation.
You should be dumping your excess rp, then refreshing your diseases, then using the blood strikes to refresh desolation and your death runes.

I disagree with starting your initial rotation with an Icy Touch as this means you have your first application not affected by RoR. In a situation where melee starts out with some runtime to get to the boss, I'll use a DC while I am running. I have yet to see a boss where there is time for 2 GCD's before you can get into position.

First of all, thank you!
You people have built an astounding thread here and I come and read on regular basis.
Please keep up the good work.

Ok. Now to something completely different...my inquire has to do with Deathbringer Saurfang.

Normally when the Blood Beasts spawn I cast Pestilence (both 10 and 25) in order to spread the disease and thus enable the casters to bring down the beasts more quickly.
However, I was asked not to do it since it "attracts" the Blood Beasts to the Melee camp (!?).
Is this true? Does Pestilence generate a high amount of threat?

I hope somebody can help me decide the right course of action for this encounter regarding Pestilence (any other advice would be greatly appreciated).

Note: its not that we havent killed Deathbringer Saurfang...I am just curious about the right course of action.

Thank you in advance for the zillions of answers .

13% More damage for your casters is really a no brainer, and it should never get you agro over the ranged. Within reasonable situations pestilence is a personal and raid dps increase.

E; my phone horribly fails at qouting.

Resistant Skin
The skin of this creature is highly resistant. Damage from area of effect attacks is reduced by 95% and damage from Diseases is reduced by 70%.

Resistant skin + Subversion = there is no way you could pull aggro if someone else is shooting at it.

Does anybody know if Necrotic plague damage on Shamblings/ghouls is affected by Ebon Plague ? I couldn't figure it out in the few attempts we did on 10 man as of now.

Thanks for the answers...and as the story goes, answers yield more questions.

If I read all of the above and "combine"...does this mean (due to the resistance of diseases) that the "actual" benefit from the Ebon Plague ends up being "only" 3.9% (70% resistance from 13%) on the Blood Beasts? Or have I just exposed my ignorance?
Why is this important?
I suppose in the Normal version it can be set aside, but with the upcoming Hard Modes I assume every bit of dmg counts.
If its "only" 3,9% on the Blood Beasts wouldnt be better to go Blood (speaking of 10 Raid) and thus give AM to the Raid (25 of course 2 DKs (at least) Blood & Unholy).

I have a question again regarding the reaping/non reaping. When I had initially done the Sims I had messed something up and was getting skewed results. Someone was kind enough to help me with it and reaping showed to be a bit behind non reaping at the time. After quite a few upgrades and gaining 4pc I ran the sim earlier and it showed reaping to be almost 250 dps behind non reaping. Now I'm going to chalk this up to be being inept in running the sim again unless it's really possible even at 4pc with a bunch of 264 offsets that reaping still hasn't surpassed non reaping. Basically I'm just wondering if can even be possible for reaping to still not be ahead of non reaping.

It's 70% resistance to the damage, not the actual effect. So to answer your question, no, it's still 13%.

Assuming a reaping build-

If for some reason your desolation drops right before you were about to scourge strike with your death runes, I find that using BS to refresh it then a blood tap/SS is a dps increase. You gain BS + desolation-increased SS, and lose a GCD.

It definitely is. I've confirmed this in combat logs -- 13% more damage when infected by Ebon Plague.