Balance Raiding in Cataclysm - Page 21

lissanna · 09/05/10, 11:03 PM

I'm pretty sure we're supposed to have dreamstate. Sometimes, things disappear in certain builds from time to time just to keep us on our toes.

Erdluf · 09/08/10, 12:49 PM

85 Moonkin, Direwulf posted a bunch of paper doll screen shots. I plug those values into Excel and I get some rating conversions:

Int 2913 -> 6.34% Crit = Conversion: 459.5
Spi 600 -> 541 MP5 = Conversion: 59.9
Haste 787 -> 6.15% = Conversion: 128.0
Hit 541 -> 5.28% = Conversion 102.5
Crit 1035 -> 16.11% = Conversion 64.2
Mastery 543 -> 3.03% = Conversion: 179.2

Spirit -> MP5 assumes the form stays the same MP5 = Spirit*Sqrt(Int)/59.9

I wouldn't be surprised if that 16.11% crit includes base crit and crit-from-int, in which case the conversion should be considerably higher than 64.2. Otherwise, we're looking at crit being only half as expensive as Haste, compared to LK where it is 50% more expensive.

Edit: Haste and Hit conversions are 3.9 times the LK values at 80. Mastery conversion is 3.9 times the LK value for Crit. Perhaps the actual conversion for crit equals the conversion for mastery.

Carnathagia · 09/08/10, 2:09 PM

Originally Posted by Erdluf

Int 2913 -> 6.34% Crit = Conversion: 459.5

Crit 1035 -> 16.11% = Conversion 64.2

I wouldn't be surprised if that 16.11% crit includes base crit and crit-from-int, in which case the conversion should be considerably higher than 64.2. Otherwise, we're looking at crit being only half as expensive as Haste, compared to LK where it is 50% more expensive.

The critical rating conversion is ~179.8. The tooltip value includes the critical from intellect, which is Intellect*.002016. Base spell critical is 0.

For regen, its Sqrt(Int)*Spirit*.016725+Base Regen. The base regen value changes with level. For an 85 Priest, its 1029 mp5. My Druid isn't 85 yet, but if the trend continues, it will be 931.

Starfox · 09/08/10, 2:21 PM

// Combat ratings for levels 1 - 85 wow build 12857 
static double __ptr_gt_combat_ratings[][85] = {
// Dodge rating multipliers
176.718994140625000
// Parry rating multipliers
176.718994140625000
// Block rating multipliers
88.359397888183594
// Melee hit rating multipliers
120.109001159667969
// Spell hit rating multipliers
102.445999145507812
// Melee crit rating multipliers
179.279998779296875
// Ranged crit rating multipliers
179.279998779296875
// Spell crit rating multipliers
179.279998779296875
// Melee haste rating multipliers
128.057006835937500
// Ranged haste rating multipliers
128.057006835937500
// Spell haste rating multipliers
128.057006835937500
// Expertise rating multipliers
30.027200698852539
// Mastery rating multipliers
179.279998779296875

Straight from the MPQ files (someone does this for Simulationcraft for us)

Erdluf · 09/08/10, 3:58 PM

Originally Posted by Carnathagia

For regen, its Sqrt(Int)*Spirit*.016725+Base Regen. The base regen value changes with level. For an 85 Priest, its 1029 mp5. My Druid isn't 85 yet, but if the trend continues, it will be 931.

The screenshot shows combat regen of 931. That is a nice surprise. I wasn't expecting in-combat base regen. It means that even if your mana is drained to zero, you can resume MF spam, (you'd need to melee for an Omen proc if Lunar Shower was down).

Ereshmilor · 09/08/10, 4:45 PM

// Spell crit rating multipliers
179.279998779296875
// Spell haste rating multipliers
128.057006835937500
// Mastery rating multipliers
179.279998779296875

We should ask for a autoreforging from Mastery to Haste rating.

Starfox · 09/08/10, 7:46 PM

Originally Posted by Ereshmilor

We should ask for a autoreforging from Mastery to Haste rating.

hehe yea, beta still has quite a few weeks to run and I hope blizzard gets aware of how much our mastery sucks as it is right now.

Ereshmilor · 09/09/10, 8:30 AM

First of, DoTs should not profit of Eclipse. I like MF to be on the run cast with LS up but not worth casting while standing. IS should be the rolling DoT.

My idea on Eclipse: Even if SF and Wrath do the same dps, there is no need to switch between solar and lunar. But what about stacking Eclipse? Something like "If your last Eclipse was not the same as this, this Eclipse is 50% more effectiv", This would force us to switch between Solar and Lunar.

Lucrece · 09/09/10, 4:37 PM

No, the DoT's need to stay in Eclipse along with possibly Wild Mushroom damage, otherwise damage under pressure in PvP takes a nosedive.

Don't make suggestions emphasizing hard casts at the cost of mobile damage since that will always have adverse effects in PvP, and even to some extent fights that might require duties that come with a lot of mobility.

Starfox · 09/09/10, 7:47 PM

# Item - Druid T11 Balance 2P Bonus - Increases the critical strike chance of your Insect Swarm and Moonfire spells by 5%. / Instant
# Item - Druid T11 Balance 4P Bonus - Whenever Eclipse triggers, your critical strike chance with spells is increased by 99% for 8 sec. Each critical strike you achieve reduces that bonus by 33%. / Instant

2p: +5% crit bonus probably a placeholder
4p: boils down to Crit,Crit,>60%crit? Could be nice if being able to time it with solar IS refresh, but on lunar you lose one charge to MF.
edit: last but not least MMO-C put up druid changes

    * Lunar Shower now increases the direct damage done by Moonfire by 15/30/45%. (Old - Increased all damage dealt by Moonfire)
    * Balance of Power no longer increases your chance to hit with spells, increases your nature and arcane spell damage by 1/2% instead.
    * Nature's Grace revamped - Increases your spell haste by 1/2/3%.

LS: I thought it was a tooltip error that it didn't specifically mentioned direct damage in last build
BoP: Seems like every caster got their +hit converted into +dmg on those kind of talents, just harde to get hitcapped in early tiers, reforging to hit/spirit.
NG: Probably due to all dots being able to scale with haste? Fuels my hope that in this build IS/MF actually scale with haste.

Erdluf · 09/10/10, 12:40 AM

4t11 should certainly encourage rapid Eclipse procs, although that 8s window seems short when nukes take 2-3s to cast (before haste), particularly with NG being scaled back.

Assuming Lunar procs when Wrath hits its target, then:
Wrath (to proc Eclipse) SF SS SF SF MF might let 5 DD spells land in the 8s window (if you are far from target, and have good haste) giving you a good chance to use those three crits on big spells (or one consolation prize).

If your haste isn't good enough for that, I guess you'd prefer to go SF (proc solar) Wr Wr SS Wr MF

BoP was probably giving way to much Hit for people running 5-man content, particularly with all that spirit on leather. However, raiders would almost certainly prefer 2% hit to 1% damage.

aceofsween · 09/10/10, 4:36 AM

I've noticed that the wording for Starsurge has changed from "whichever is greater" to "whichever is more beneficial to you" in regards to which energy type it gives you... What bothers me is that Euphoria, which suffers a similar problem, doesn't share that same wording.

Was Euphoria ever changed to give smart-energy or is it still functioning the same way?

Ereshmilor · 09/10/10, 5:00 AM