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Old 06/03/08, 12:00 PM   #1546
 Adoriele
Happy October 19th!
 
Adoriele's Avatar
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Dragonblight
Originally Posted by Traek View Post
On your spreadsheet, Adoriele, I'm confused about something. I'm probably just reading the spreadsheet wrong, but it is saying that at 1139 spell damage, hit cap with 0 haste, a lionseye is equal to a crimson spinel. I was under the impression the spreadsheet would say that at 1392 spell damage. Should I be reading that number as how much 1 haste is worth in spell damage? Again, I assume I'm just reading it wrong, and I should be looking for the "equivalent # of crimson spinels" to say 1.2?
Hah! Thank you for catching this. There's an error, in that the calculation for the DPS benefit from the Lionseye is taking into account raid boss debuffs, but the Spinel is not. I'll edit in a fixed copy ASAP.

[edit] Clarification

[edit2]

Alright, new version is up. Fixed the issue with boss debuffs being applied inconsistently when calculating gem benefits. This includes not being applied at all when looking at the benefits for Wrath. Numbers should match up to what people expect. Also added in Stormstrike uptime while I was in there, since it ended up making more sense to do it now.
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File Type: xls Stat equivalence.xls (70.5 KB, 171 views)

Last edited by Adoriele : 06/03/08 at 12:42 PM.

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Old 06/03/08, 12:47 PM   #1547
Rillumarei
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Druid
 
Stormreaver (EU)
Spi. I only have one thing to say: wow. Those kind of 2k+ wws-reports seem so unreal. In fact, those kind of numbers would be a dream come true for me. I still have one question. You casted 42 starfires and 9 moonfires. At first I thought you are using MF+5xSF-cycle but then I did some counting and noticed 3 missing starfires. So do you use a different rotation or did the boss just bite the dust before you could land those three starfires or.. are you using a totally different type of cycle?
Sorry, this might seem a bit stupid question but I kinda need to know :E

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Old 06/03/08, 12:48 PM   #1548
JonnyProphet
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Maelstrom
First off I would like to thank all of you here. This has become a bible of sorts for me and I really wanted to express my gratitude.

Currently my guild and I are progressing through the last of the T5 content and making small forays into T6. I use the spreadsheet frequently when an upgrade presents itself.

I am at a bit of an impasse though as what I should do to improve next. I will post a WWS when we have a new one. I nearly always find myself within the top 3 DPSers in our raids.

In my current gear configuration I have lower hit due to running with an elemental shaman. I am only buffed with mark and sitting at 1281 spell damage.

Normally I rotate with moonfire and insect swarm up constantly as to not clip and to make certain I receive the benefit from my 4pc T5 bonus.

I may have just overlooked something simple on the spreadsheet, but I don't see a way to currently increase my dps from where it is.

My thanks in advance for any assistance and please keep all this good information coming.

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Old 06/03/08, 3:17 PM   #1549
spi
Von Kaiser
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Akama
Originally Posted by Rillumarei View Post
Spi. I only have one thing to say: wow. Those kind of 2k+ wws-reports seem so unreal. In fact, those kind of numbers would be a dream come true for me. I still have one question. You casted 42 starfires and 9 moonfires. At first I thought you are using MF+5xSF-cycle but then I did some counting and noticed 3 missing starfires. So do you use a different rotation or did the boss just bite the dust before you could land those three starfires or.. are you using a totally different type of cycle?
Sorry, this might seem a bit stupid question but I kinda need to know :E
I just make sure I don't clip my moonfires. So, it can be MF + SF x5 or MF + SFx6. Also, I try to time my last starfire+moonfire right before boss dies for that little extra damage. It is likely that my last spell casted on the boss is a moonfire, not a starfire. Because of different procs (NG/heroism/drums) my starfire cast time is pretty dynamic, so I'd like to keep my rotation dynamic as well. When I used Lherin's simulator, not clipping moonfire gave the highest dps numbers, so I decided to never clip my moonfire ticks. I'm not so sure whether that's dps maximizing rotation to be honest, but it is the most mana efficient MF/SF rotation.

Also, keep in mind that Teron does quite a bit of spell pushbacks during the encounter. Missing starfires may have come from there.

P.S. Teron gorefiend is a short fight, so this is a fight where cooldowns really count. With 2 heroisms I have about 30% uptime on heroism and that's the only reason why my dps is 2200+. On fights like brutallus, it'd be a struggle to break 2.1k+ with my current gear.

Last edited by spi : 06/03/08 at 3:24 PM.

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Old 06/03/08, 9:14 PM   #1550
ariyana
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Kel'Thuzad
Originally Posted by spi View Post
You can't be running oom with a spriest and only casting that many spells.

My theories are that you probably
1. have over 1000ms latency that you can't even take advantage of the spell queue system
2. are not spamming your buttons to take advantage of spell queue system
3. have a really screwed up idol switching macro/moves.
4. take too long to battle res(i dont think you did battle res though)
5. have a tea party at your house while raiding.
Thanks for the help on this Spi....

I am gimping myself somewhere, I run FiOS, so my average latency is about 30ms, that isn't an issue...my spriest did ghost in the encounter, so I did use one innervate (which has a weapon swap to max the mana gained) but I didn't oom, and my macros are not that complex -- I have druidswap-addon for the trinket swap, and I have a /use for my icon in my starfire macro with ignore errors. Pretty sure I wasn't having a tea party, lol...

I think the fault is in me not spamming buttons for the spell queue system... I'm used to basing my single button presses off of quartz meters (from /stopcasting in previous patches).... I'll have to try button mashing. I think we're going to be hitting gorfiend tonight, lets see how this goes.

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Old 06/03/08, 9:30 PM   #1551
Traek
Von Kaiser
 
Orc Death Knight
 
Mannoroth
What works for me is to still use Quartz so I can see how long my cast is anyway, but spam the button as it's nearing the red. Not doing so may as well be like not using stopcasting before the spell queue system.

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Old 06/04/08, 12:52 AM   #1552
maub
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Druid
 
Laughing Skull
Originally Posted by vaultene View Post
Can anyone tell me what the hit rating cap is or should be for a balance druid? I'm getting some nice gear with high hit rating and now its up to 17%. I would like to know if I can dump some of it and put in some spell damage gems instead of the hit rating ones i have. Spell damage bonus is almost 2000 . thanks so much. Vaultene
Just thought you should know, you have a melee hit rating gem in your chest piece.

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Old 06/04/08, 7:36 AM   #1553
spi
Von Kaiser
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Akama
Originally Posted by ariyana View Post
Thanks for the help on this Spi....

I am gimping myself somewhere, I run FiOS, so my average latency is about 30ms, that isn't an issue...my spriest did ghost in the encounter, so I did use one innervate (which has a weapon swap to max the mana gained) but I didn't oom, and my macros are not that complex -- I have druidswap-addon for the trinket swap, and I have a /use for my icon in my starfire macro with ignore errors. Pretty sure I wasn't having a tea party, lol...

I think the fault is in me not spamming buttons for the spell queue system... I'm used to basing my single button presses off of quartz meters (from /stopcasting in previous patches).... I'll have to try button mashing. I think we're going to be hitting gorfiend tonight, lets see how this goes.
There's an addon called LagInfo in Cursegaming.com that you can check to see how much time you have between your casts. However, do not blindly trust this addon since it's been giving me some fishy numbers. In another words, use it at your own risk!

Check AHK (Autohotkey) discussion from earlier. The program basically mashes the button for you to optimize the spam time. If you aren't spamming it's like having -90 haste on your gear. You should really get used to spamming the button if you don't want to rely on a program or a logitec gaming keyboard. However, there's a terrible side effect of losing your wrist overtime.

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Old 06/04/08, 8:28 AM   #1554
Ranghar
Von Kaiser
 
Ranghar's Avatar
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Shadowsong (EU)
Originally Posted by spi View Post
Check AHK (Autohotkey) discussion from earlier. The program basically mashes the button for you to optimize the spam time.
I would rather discourage using AutoHotKey. This program is considered "illegal" by Blizzard, as it automates key pressing, and thus may lead you in trouble. I've never seen anyone being banned by using it, but it's better to play safe.

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Old 06/04/08, 12:19 PM   #1555
Rillumarei
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Druid
 
Stormreaver (EU)
Originally Posted by spi View Post
On fights like brutallus, it'd be a struggle to break 2.1k+ with my current gear.
This kinda brought up another question. Have you, or any of you EJ-guys noticed a particularily high amount of partial resists in comparison with other boss-encounters or.. is it just me again? Somehow it feels like this boss has a high amount of resistances and boy, it shows. 791 Starfire crits are always a huge confidence-boost. I might be talking out of my.. rear-end, but shouldn't Spell Penetration decrease the amount of partial resists and if it does, perhaps it might be wise to enchant / gem it?

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Old 06/04/08, 12:31 PM   #1556
maub
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Druid
 
Laughing Skull
Have a bit of questions as I am currently in the process of leveling a druid primarily for PvE Moonkin...

First, upon hitting 70 and gearing for such things as entry level raids like Karazhan, etc. is it best to go in the route as a Destruction warlock would and try to hit the +hit cap (which I believe I read is about 152 or so)?

Second, gearing for entry level, is it worth it to wear such cloth items as Spellstrike while saving up badges for some nicer stuff before I can grab something from a T5+ level raid?

Finally, I've been reading of 1:1 ratio in terms of +damage to +haste but at entry level is it better to use +hit instead? I really see the only haste coming from Isle of Quel'danas badge items unless you get something like a Heart of Darkness to use in a craft.

I'm sure most of this has been covered already, but 63 pages is iffy to look through and unless I am blind there is no real Moonkin compendium on here.

Thanks.

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Old 06/04/08, 1:59 PM   #1557
Faerdael
Piston Honda
 
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Night Elf Hunter
 
Gilneas
Originally Posted by maub View Post
Have a bit of questions as I am currently in the process of leveling a druid primarily for PvE Moonkin...

First, upon hitting 70 and gearing for such things as entry level raids like Karazhan, etc. is it best to go in the route as a Destruction warlock would and try to hit the +hit cap (which I believe I read is about 152 or so)?

Second, gearing for entry level, is it worth it to wear such cloth items as Spellstrike while saving up badges for some nicer stuff before I can grab something from a T5+ level raid?

Finally, I've been reading of 1:1 ratio in terms of +damage to +haste but at entry level is it better to use +hit instead? I really see the only haste coming from Isle of Quel'danas badge items unless you get something like a Heart of Darkness to use in a craft.

I'm sure most of this has been covered already, but 63 pages is iffy to look through and unless I am blind there is no real Moonkin compendium on here.

Thanks.
Spell strike is quite good walking into Kara.

You may want to look at Druid:Balance for a good starting overview.

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Old 06/04/08, 2:21 PM   #1558
spi
Von Kaiser
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Akama
Originally Posted by Ranghar View Post
I would rather discourage using AutoHotKey. This program is considered "illegal" by Blizzard, as it automates key pressing, and thus may lead you in trouble. I've never seen anyone being banned by using it, but it's better to play safe.
This statement, like many people have discussed and confirmed with GM, is false. If you do not automate game play and you actually have to hold down a key, it is considered legal. Check One-stop elemental stop in EJ thread for a blue confirmation. Code posted posted by Ef is completely legal. It is the same thing as having a G15 logitec keyboard in turbo mode, and it is not considered illegal by blizzard.

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Old 06/04/08, 2:25 PM   #1559
spi
Von Kaiser
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Akama
Originally Posted by maub View Post
Have a bit of questions as I am currently in the process of leveling a druid primarily for PvE Moonkin...

First, upon hitting 70 and gearing for such things as entry level raids like Karazhan, etc. is it best to go in the route as a Destruction warlock would and try to hit the +hit cap (which I believe I read is about 152 or so)?

Second, gearing for entry level, is it worth it to wear such cloth items as Spellstrike while saving up badges for some nicer stuff before I can grab something from a T5+ level raid?

Finally, I've been reading of 1:1 ratio in terms of +damage to +haste but at entry level is it better to use +hit instead? I really see the only haste coming from Isle of Quel'danas badge items unless you get something like a Heart of Darkness to use in a craft.

I'm sure most of this has been covered already, but 63 pages is iffy to look through and unless I am blind there is no real Moonkin compendium on here.

Thanks.
You should really use the spreadsheet on this page to figure out your itemization. Spell damage might even be better than Hit depending on how "entry-level" you are. Every stat is interdependent on each other, and it's all about figuring out how much of a stat optimizes your raid DPS compared to certain amount of another stat.

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Old 06/04/08, 10:33 PM   #1560
ariyana
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Kel'Thuzad
Wow Web Stats

Okay, this last week I bit it in the fight (98% presence, 4m33s out of 4m55s), so not too much lost time, but I got off 68 starfires and 18 starfires and averaged 1272 dmg. This does seem to line up similar to what was in RAWR for my equipment at the time, so I guess I am doing alright. I did do a bit of button mashing. Any simple way to turn off the stupid warning click sounds? I use ui_clear_error, but it doesn't seem to stop it....I also gained about 100dps on Najentus, up to about 1050 from 950. I did break 1300 when I was downing destro potions, but I also didn't have my uber-enhancement shaman then, he came late (the kill round) and at that point I had run out of destro pots. :-/

I've just bought in some new badge gear and swapped some gem's around, soon as I get it all set, I should be 30-40 haste higher (RAWR puts me at 1203dps, which is ~35-40 higher then I had before this switch). I've had [Botanist's Gloves of Growth] on me for my healing gear for a bit without noticing that without T6-4pc, these seem to be one of the best DPS gloves until Sunwell from their haste, so I dual +12dmg gem'd them and am going to use them instead of my [Nordrassil Gauntlets] or [Enslaved Doomguard Soulgrips]...

I did lose almost 40 spirit with this itemization though, I'll have to see how that impacts things.

Last edited by ariyana : 06/04/08 at 10:40 PM.

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