I'm a bit confused by this statement, and wonder if I'm missing something. Once you have a LB on a target the refresher healing spell to LB is Nourish. You can still RJ, RG, WG, SM, and/or HT the LB'd target. The proposed T12 4pc gear setup will be making LB an even more powerful spell to use in a multi-tank or tank / MDPS healing situation. So unless I have read the notes wrong and am missing an upcoming change to our healing mechanics, there will still only be the one heal (Nourish) you wont be able to use for a LB stack to bloom, yes?

RG, Nourish and HT will all refresh the LB stack, assuming you have 2/2 Empowered Touch. Yes, technically your spells can still heal them during this period, but you have almost no ability to dump healing quickly into that target without delaying the bloom.

I'm of the opinion that 4T12 will simply need to be treated as a minor, nice-when-it-lines-up, incidental bonus. Probably worth breaking if it allows you to hit a significant haste breakpoint, but beyond that not worth trying to plan around or control. It will boost ToL throughput, and make the cooldown more interesting, reinforcing LB as the filler spell du jour without compromising its PvP efficacy.

I agree with people that the refreshing mechanic attached to our heals will make it clumsy outside of ToL, and even in ToL to some degree.

But I still like it.

And saying : "I'm of the opinion that 4T12 will simply need to be treated as a minor, nice-when-it-lines-up, incidental bonus. Probably worth breaking if it allows you to hit a significant haste breakpoint, but beyond that not worth trying to plan around or control."

Is kind of silly.... I already plan around and use ToL with "control" just like this, in its current state. The notion that it is only a minor bonus, or is not worth even caring about seems really off to me, considering it is a huge buff to that already awesome cd. Also, the idea of breaking the bonus for some secondary stats seems far fetched, 2005 haste is not an issue now, much less next tier and there are none that are really significant beyond it...

As for outside ToL, since a 3x lb stack will be much more forgiving to break without the tier 11 buff (withstanding being a tank focused role) I can see using it more than people let on. Often while healing the raid I will go back to the tank to refresh and see him and/or the melee needing some attention. This will be a great time to just let it fall off, as opposed to casting a direct heal to refresh or just LB. Again we only need 1x to get our new regen buff, and if your not a tank focused healer you should have the freedom to let them drop and not be as rushed applying a 3x without the bloom spirit buff next tier. And tbh I only consider this icing on the cake, the buff to ToL alone is enough for me.

We don't need more throughput, as has been repeated in this thread many times, we need more AOE burst healing. Well we get a buff in basically the only other AOE cd we have, and everyone seems to want some straight throughput buff instead.. lol

I dream of some mitigation bonus or ability, I do like everyone else, but next to that I really like this bonus and think it will make us more viable in the AOE onslaught that is sure to come in a place filled with fire. Take a look at other 4pc for healers if you doubt that. Having tranq and ToL available and really strong at 1.5 minute intervals will be fun to tailor to encounters.

It was in reference to the bonus. Of course ToL can be planned, but in the vast majority of situations, you can't plan for where players are going to be in 10-12 seconds' time, which is the window you've got between controlling (casting LB) and gaining the benefit (bloom). Sure, in heavy damage phases it's most likely (depending on range) going to be effective anyway, but it's largely incidental, and won't have a significant impact on the way in which you heal.

Spruce is right that most fights in this tier allow (indeed encourage) you to plan when to use ToL - but I think the point Mex is making is that the 4-set bonus isn't going to change that. You'll still use tree at the same times in a fight, and you'll still cast spells in Tree in the same manner - it'll just be a little more effective when you do.

This is the point I'm trying to make. You do this already, without the 4T12 bonus. Therefore the 4T12 bonus won't change the way in which you heal. It's incidental.

I think incidental bonuses are the best kind honestly. I haven't had a chance to sit down and look at these bonuses, but to me incidental bonuses are like passive trinkets. I don't want to change what I do. I want what I do to be better when I do it. Personally I think you heal strongest when you aren't thinking about what to do, but instead just letting muscle memory do its job. I realize I'm likely in the minority, but after you heal for like 6 years you subconsciously absorb mechanics and you respond without having to plan your way through it. I really hate when I'm forced to think and that's not just with respect to WoW. :P

I'd like to think of myself as part of that minority too, Carebare. I always find the fights where I feel I've been most successful in my healing are the fights where I haven't been thinking about it. It's like Snooker (or Pool, if you're from the US); if you over-think a shot, 80% of the time, you miss. Your brain's a lot better at things like that when you leave it to its own devices.

Sorry for misunderstanding you.

You are right, it will not be a very creative or interesting change to our healing in ToL, and possibly even less so for many who don't LB roll as much. Outside may be better, but I fear clunky, and will be hard to tell until we get to play with it.

I've been working on heroic nef 10 man for the last week and I'm having a lot of trouble handling Explosive Cinders. I've got myself and 2 others on my platform and if either of them get cinders I am totally fine. The problem is when I get cinders. I wait until there's about 3 sec left on the debuff and hop into the lava, blow up, and hightail it back, popping barkskin along the way, but I'm finding that I'm either losing myself or one of the players on my platform with all the movement and damage on myself. The problem seems even worse if I am the first person to get cinders as phase 2 is starting since you pretty much have to sit in the lava the whole time (there doesn't seem to be enough time to hop up onto the platform to drop your lava debuff before you have to jump right back in and get away for the explosion).

I spent a sleepless night thinking about how I could handle this

1) Pop barkskin AND the Baradin's Wardens trinket (which I won't have for 2 more days unfortunately so i couldn't try this last night).

2) Saving ToL for when I get cinders so that i can spam RG while moving. Only problem I see with this is that the 75-80% of the time that I don't get cinders I will just be sitting on ToL and since there's so much damage going out, it is an ideal time to be popping ToL anyway. I've actually been popping ToL early in phase 2 just to get people stabilized.

Option 1 seems like the best option to me but I'm wary that it won't be enough to save my life. Hoping for some input or suggestions as to how others are handling cinders.

Cheers.

Getting the first cinder is definitely the toughest one - especially if you have a bad string of RNGbarrages on your platform. In a situation like that, both you and your platform should do all you can to survive - even down to the little things. For example, we have a shadow priest throw out shields when things get hairy in that situation. Don't be afraid to use your CDs: they'll be up again in time for the times they matter in P3.

If I get cinders, I pop barkskin as I'm in the air jumping away from the platform and ensure that I have a rejuv and LBx3 on myself. I specced into Nature's Ward just for P2 and post-crackle stuff, but it's probably a little overkill. Sometimes in the situation where we've had a ton of barrages as I have cinders, I've popped Tranq as soon as I returned to the platform - but I have 4 people on my pillar, so it's a little more justifiable than 3. As soon as you see you have cinders, make sure you save your Swiftmend CD: use it on yourself right as you get back to the group, or someone who's low on the platform while you're in the lava. I did the fight without a Mirror, but if you're using it, consider popping it as well.

The only other thing I'd add is to have your pillar group stand stacked up on the far side of the platform, and then cinders targets run across the platform and jump into the lava. This reduces the distance you have to put between yourself and the group (literally 1 jump's distance off the platform, if that), which decreases the amount of time you spend (1) in lava (2) away from focusing on simply healing.