[Resto] Gear Discussion 4.2 (Firelands) OLD - Page 7

csar · 07/28/11, 5:44 PM

here is a log with my 4pc

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

seems to do 3% of my healing for beth and lower for the other encounters

• Hamlet · 07/28/11, 5:48 PM

Only 7.1% overheal there. That's quite the opposite of what we saw above. The 8yd range really just makes this thing very sensitive to different fight situations--sometimes it won't find good targets. So it's fine on the fights where it works, but still, a longer range might make it more consistent. Right now it's a pretty awkward limitation.

Thedave · 07/29/11, 6:37 AM

Going back to an earlier discussion of projecting how we would reforge in the later stages of the tier:

I only have a single 391 thus far (we're 4/7H), and I'm already reforging a LOT of spirit off my gear. The only fight I really keep a lot of spirit for is H-Baleroc 10 man, though I'll have to see if I want to do the same for Beth. On H-Domo last week, I shed as much spirit as I could, RJ-blanketed, WGed on CD, and still felt perfectly fine for mana. And this was before 2pc.

In light of this, I'm going for the helm as my offset piece... though if I can get mastery/haste shoulders, those would win out once we have H-Rag down (so you know, tomorrow).

Daisil · 07/29/11, 11:44 AM

You need to find a solid balance with spirit for a lot of fights. I am basically reforged out of ALL of my spirit (save a few pieces here and there) at this point, and have practically no mana issues (while using shard of woe, 2pc, and heroic jaws). In full BiS i'll reforge out of every bit of spirit I have and then some, so it wouldn't surprise me if the trend will be to reforge fully out of spirit within this tier and into the next for more throughput purposes.

Cowking · 07/29/11, 7:49 PM

First time poster here.
In my 10 man raid i reforge to the moonkin hitcap cause i often have to change my spec in 2 healer fights and i found it to be quite a good value to have. We are only at 1/7 H yet but i never run oom and prefered reforging off spirit over dropping regen talents.
I think if you dont have as much Moonkin gear like me it may be wise to do this though if you have you could even try to drop more spirit than that.

ps: We didnt attempt H Baleroc yet so i dont know if that fight requires way more manaregen but with a pally and a priest as the other 2 healers in my raid i think i wont spec Heal at that fight in the near future.

rmq · 07/30/11, 2:45 AM

I reforge from spirit as well as use some pieces without spirit at all. I also have no jaws, no shard and no points in furor, heroic fall of mortality never dropped for our raid. I've only had mana problems during our first hc Bet'thilac kill. We tried hc Baleroc the last night and manged to get him to 15% within 5:30, at this point I had around 40% of my mana (no potions used). I heal torments almost all the time and switch to heal the tank thrice (twice during that 15% pull, the third one exists only in theory) while our pala stacks vital spark via shadow priest healing. I also spammed RG several times during this pull to a total of 60 casts.
So I suppose we should build our BiS list assuming we need quite a few spirit pieces and maybe even [Eye of Awareness] instead of [Jaws of Defeat].

Môurn · 07/30/11, 10:44 AM

People in this discussion need to be mindful (and post) on whether they are raiding 10 or 25 man raids. 25 man raids tend to need a lot more Rejuv spamming (since Wild Growth covers a higher percentage of players in 10 man for example), so mana might be a lot tighter in 25 man raids than in 10 man raids.

Obviously that results in being able to gear for less spirit regen in 10 mans. BiS lists and reforging should be heavily affected by that.

Cowking · 07/30/11, 12:10 PM

I disagree with mourne as in my 10 man raid i have to do a lot of spothealing resulting in way more regrowth as i would use in 25 man raid.

Also in 10 man raid when there is the need for a lot of raidhealing i sometimes keep up 6+ rejus though i dont raid 25 man i think the mana in 25 man raid is not as thin cause you also have more priests and shamans for manaregg.

The bigger difference is how you heal and depending on the encounter for example in Baleroc 10 man mana should be a bigger problem as you have to do a lot of direct heals and regrowth while in other encounters it might be the other way round cause in 25 man there should hardly ever be the need to cast a regrowth without a clearcasting proc.

But if im wrong please tell me cause i dont regularly raid 25.

Pleinair93 · 07/31/11, 2:40 AM

Originally Posted by Daisil

You need to find a solid balance with spirit for a lot of fights. I am basically reforged out of ALL of my spirit (save a few pieces here and there) at this point, and have practically no mana issues (while using shard of woe, 2pc, and heroic jaws). In full BiS i'll reforge out of every bit of spirit I have and then some, so it wouldn't surprise me if the trend will be to reforge fully out of spirit within this tier and into the next for more throughput purposes.

Can you still keep your mana up with 10/0/31 spec? Or are you using that spec currently?

Do you think we will be switching to this spec at the end of the tier, or earlier?

edit: On another note, I just traded out my alchemist haste trinket back to tsunami as it is the only other trinket I have, should I just reforge my alchemy trinket or go with tsunami for the regen? With tsunami I reforged a lot of my spirit to mastery and haste and gained quite a bit so Im hoping it was a good choice.

Shelendil · 07/31/11, 11:24 AM

I've found the best way to balance spirit is not to look at how much spirit, but how much combat regen. 2000 mp5 is good for me with Shard of Woe. I think I could even go lower with Jaws of Defeat now.

Playered · 07/31/11, 12:09 PM

The best way to work it out is to actually test it on your raids. During heroic progress I have downscaled my regen each week (gear and talents, over 3 resets) and pushed my output to a point where prior to having 2T12 I was ending all fights at near 0 mana. The addition of the 2 set to this means I have my margin of error as well as a feel for how much I can over-extend when required.

There is no magic universal number for regen like there is for haste and certain items (SoW) drastically change the amount needed too. The way you play and sync with your healing team provides a far better indicator if you truly want to know how much regen you are going to end up requiring for your playstyle - not some arbitrary figure on the forum.

Shelendil · 07/31/11, 3:15 PM

Originally Posted by Playered

The best way to work it out is to actually test it on your raids. During heroic progress I have downscaled my regen each week (gear and talents, over 3 resets) and pushed my output to a point where prior to having 2T12 I was ending all fights at near 0 mana. The addition of the 2 set to this means I have my margin of error as well as a feel for how much I can over-extend when required.

There is no magic universal number for regen like their is for haste and certain items (SoW) drastically change the amount needed too. The way you play and sync with your healing team provides a far better indicator if you truly want to know how much regen you are going to end up requiring for your playstyle - not some arbitrary figure on the forum.

Correct, but when evaluating it, it is more useful to look at how much combat regen the combined int and spirit gives, rather than trying to discuss the amount of spirit needed.

• Hamlet · 07/31/11, 5:35 PM

Even charsheet MP5 is hard to use, since a lot of important regen sources are invisible there (and all are Int-based). Also, regen that's caused by trinket procs or other Int procs doesn't show up, and varies a lot between players.

TreeCalcs is good for this; you can look your total gross regen on the "Basic Calcs" page for a good number to use. (i.e. the net regen on the main page takes spellcasting into account and makes all those assumptions, but you can look at your final total regen before spell usage as well).

Thedave · 08/01/11, 3:12 PM

Originally Posted by Pleinair93

Can you still keep your mana up with 10/0/31 spec? Or are you using that spec currently?

Do you think we will be switching to this spec at the end of the tier, or earlier?

From a 10 man (4/7H) perspective:

I've found the 10/0/31 spec to be more effective than the 8/2/31 spec for the Heroics we're close to having down now (H-Domo, H-Beth). For both, Efflo is a critical part of a resto druid's rotation, so the 4% buff to Swiftmend from Genesis outweighs the extra bit of mastery/crit I'd be able to forge onto the last few unforged pieces of my gear. I'm holding at around 2150 combat regen (unbuffed, character sheet) with 2pc T12 and H-FoM (no shard, no Jaws), and I didn't even have a mana tide this weekend.

On a heavy Efflo fight where you're pretty much hitting Swiftmend on CD (and Efflo is hitting a stacked group), you're probably going to find that the 10/0/31 spec is more effective - assuming your mana can hold up. With my gear setup, which is far from optimized, I'm finding that that caveat isn't an issue: mana is easily holding up.

Dummy · 08/01/11, 3:24 PM

the regen question completly depends on your style, i have shard and jaws plus i am usually taking every regen talent i can get my hands on