I have just noticed that the tooltip of [Burning Shadowspirit Diamond] changed, from "critical damage" to "critical effect". I'm wondering if it affects heals now... It would clearly be the best meta for us if it does: it gives intellect over the spirit of revitalising, and has negligible requirements!

Trying to test that right now...


EDIT:
Ok I've bought one, and tested that. I have first tested with nourrish then realized it was stupid since rejuv gives constant ticks. I've done that without spec, with feral gear to get some crit rating and enable the metagem bonus.

With [Burning Shadowspirit Diamond] :
- rejuv ticks for 1338
- rejuv crits for 2756 (i.e. : x2.03 multiplier)

With [Ember Shadowspirit Diamond], to keep the exact same amount of intellect :
- rejuv ticks for 1338
- rejuv crits fo 2676 (i.e. : x2 multiplier)

Looks like it works, let's swap our gems dudes!

I am assuming that there has been some math done on the Resto 4 piece set bonus. Can someone please post a link to it here? There are comments that it's bad, but it would be relevant to this thread to lay it out here so that it can be properly considered when making gear choices. Obviously at heroic levels there isn't much in the way of competition (there's actually nothing other than taking moonkin gear), but prior to that it adds an interesting dynamic-- particularly given the mana intensity of some of the fights and the mp5 value of 2t12. I see that TreeCalcs gives it a value of 1184.88 hps, but is that under optimal (no overheal)/routine/sub-optimal conditions (mostly overheal)? Of course it's important to remember that t13 gives 3 sockets to chest/legs and t12 gloves were rather poorly itemized.

Regardless of the debate on the value of the 4pc T13 bonus (which I'm also curious to see some hard data on) I think we've concluded that any BiS list will include 2pc T13 and give us the inneravte bonus. Has anyone with the bonus got a Jaws of Defeat to pair with it? Is the Reduction from Jaws being applied before or after the inneravte bonus?

My thinking being applying a buff like Bottle of wishes on inneravte cast and using Jaws while within the 2pc Bonus window is likely to result in rather effective combination if used appropriately.

Most of the discussion on 4T13 was back in the other thread when it appeared on PTR. For rough math though, just assume a 10% raw buff to your Rejuv output (this is basically what TreeCalcs does).

TreeCalcs is just looking at a raw healing situation (no overheal). This can cut both ways since in reality the bonus overheals, but so does all your other healing (which is your basis for comparison). For example the 4pc ICC bonus was equal to or slightly more valuable than its TC value, since you got a smart-target instant Rejuv that on average was probably slightly less likely to overheal than your normal blanketing Rejuvs. In this case though, the healing added by the set bonus is likely to have a much lower effectiveness % than your usual healing, since it's being tacked onto a worse-than-average target--someone who just had a Rejuv on them for 12s.

Or to put it differently--which is usually going to be worse for overhealing: the first 12s of a 24s Rejuv, or the second 12s? Probably the first, which is why the contribution from 4T13 is going to be weaker than its raw value suggests.

My guild 3healed 10man hc zonozz, and first kill had some mana issues (had around 2200spirit that time).

HC Ultraxion i had no mana issues, also i used red crystal, and paladin started with green and switched into blue when it spawned. My (druid) 51k hps & pally had 52k.

Had some tries yesterday on gunship hc with me & pally healing (p1), had no mana issues there with 2300spirit.

I'm really kind of underwhelmed by the Maw of the Dragonlord mace that drops off of Madness.

After doing some quickie testing outside of Stormwind, I found out the following things:

-Cleansing Flames hits for a variable amount between ~4.5k-7k. There are outlier values, with some hitting for 2k and others for up to and a bit above 8k. It seems to hit most often for around 6-7k in a raid setting from skimming through my logs for tonight.
-It can crit. Based on my own logs, it's between 20-25% (small sample size is small).
-It has an ICD of around 15 seconds, but usually procs every 20-23 seconds.
-It does proc off of HoT ticks. It seems to proc off of direct heals and HoT ticks at the same rate. It proc'd much less often when spamming Nourish and Healing Touch (every 30-50s) than when I had only Lifebloom rolling (the aforementioned 20-23).
-It does not scale with spell power in any conceivable way. It also does not scale with Harmony (was a long shot anyway).
-It has a very underwhelming 9 yard range.
-It has a very wide area of effect. It's something like 150 degrees in front of the caster.

It will be great on Yor'sahj, Ultraxion, Spine and Madness, or any fight where the raid will be stacked up and stationary. I suppose that's half the fights, but for the rest, where there's a lot more movement and constant repositioning, it will possibly be worth it to switch to a different main hand if it's of higher ilvl. My logs seem to reflect this, but I wasn't aware of the range limit on the mace until just now and so wasn't really positioning myself to gain more benefit out of it.

It's still very much so the Trauma of t13, but it's a lot less impressive than early parses I saw seemed to make it out to be. I was especially surprised at its short range.

EDIT
Healing values are based off of the Normal Mode mace.

You cluster on Morchok, Warlord, Yor'sahj, Ultraxion, the hard part of Gunship, Spine and Madness. It would be easier to say that the mace is only of low value on Hagara because it only provides real benefits if you are in the middle during the frost phase which does not happen that often.

For me (in 25/heroic) it boiled down to:
Morchok 5.4%
Warlord - 5%
Yor'sahj - 6.9%
Ultraxion - 10%
Warmaster - 5.6%
Spine(H progress) - 7%~


For 10 mans it probably is slightly weaker despite the scaling of the heal depending on the amount of targets it hits but for this tier of content it is incredibly strong to the point it could be the most powerful proc of all the Deathwing weapons. The only bad thing about it is that you have to watch your positioning somewhat more thoughtfully which is something I still forgot to bother with more than I should. I honestly cannot say that even at 5% that I find the proc underwhelming for us especially when you note our struggles with raid wide AoE healing which this mace wonderfully provides for us.

I do raid 10m, but there's a gargantuan disparity between the numbers you guys are getting and mine. I'll try to position myself more thoughtfully next week with the mace and see how it goes.

It is certainly weaker for 10 man raids. Which does not at all make it a bad weapon, I'd just gladly switch it for a better choice on certain fights as I couldn't get more than like 2% out of it for Heroic Zon'Ozz due to our tactic. Doesn't seem to be especially useful for Heroic Hagara, either. While you have to position yourself carefully, it helps out nicely on SoD, MoD, Ultraxion (should be the same for heroic) and, at times, Morchok. I find it hard to comment on Yor'sahj, because I am yet to kill him on Heroic and didn't actually try to make the best of it on Normal so my numbers for the mace were pretty subpar. As the angle in which it hits targets in front of you is, as commented above, fairly wide, it should in theory work nicely on Yor'sahj, too.
Don't expect to go above 5-6% even on good fights though without really having an eye on your positioning all the time - which I found difficult because some heroics are rather stressful to heal through. Anyway, this will probably get better as I kill them more often.

Haven't seen it mentioned anywhere so far as it is inconsistent with usual itemisation and can be easily overlooked - while moonkin legs have better stats then resto on the first glimpse, they actually have 20 int less on every difficulty level. Combined with the fact that moonkin gloves have red socket as opposed to resto which got blue, moonkin gloves as an offpiece seem a preferable choice.

Let's just go over the heroic tier comparisons, excluding the VP gear since there is no 410 equivalent.

Helm - Differences are a small margin in the secondary stat 29 haste (boomer) vs 41 spi (resto)

Shoulders - Differences are in one secondary stat, crit (boomer) vs mastery (resto)

Gloves - Assuming an epic red gem (because the socket bonus is small), the result is 10 int, 276 haste (boomer) vs 8 mastery, 268 spi (resto).

Legs - Biggest difference between tiers here, 381 haste (boomer) vs 20 int, 366 spi, 21 mastery (resto)

Chest - Secondary stat difference, 337 mastery (boomer) vs 16 spi, 325 haste (resto)

Drawn conclusion, you can safely exclude the helm and shoulders from this comparison. Since most of the 410 pieces already have mastery as a secondary stat, reforging for said stat can be excluded when comparing the legs and gloves for offpiece and becomes a question if you need haste to help reforge stats off of other pieces not evaluated to meet your haste break point. Assuming haste is not an issue due to other pieces, I would view the chest piece to be strong because of the extra mastery.