[Balance] Encounter Mechanics - T15 - Page 2

Sunshining · 03/15/13, 8:11 PM

Heroic Jin'rokh

Cloak+HotW+Tranq in lightning phase

Lazerdollarz · 03/16/13, 4:04 AM

Stampeding Roar should clear Entrapped and Ensnared from raid members standing in Quicksand on Council, but I haven't tested this. Should be able to do it this week.

Kuruk · 03/18/13, 8:19 AM

HotW indeed seems superior to NV on every fight other than Jin'rokh so far. And we have to remember that whilst NV might be strong on paper, you will never be able to line it up perfectly and there will be times you will forget that it is up so HotW is much more practical anyway.

What about Soul of the Forest versus Incarnation?

Wouldn't Soul of the Forest be potentially stronger on multi-target encounters like Horridon, Council of Elders and Tortos, giving you more Starfalls and moving you through the Eclipses faster?

Originally Posted by Plopeuh

I asked in balance thread but how do you manage eggs in jin kun encounter ? we will try it tonight and i am afraid to not be as effective as other caster doing it.

I am wondering about this myself. They don't live long enough to be worth DoT-ing so I guess it is either nuking the individual eggs/birds or using Astral Storm/Hurricane. I've been casting hard nukes unless I was in a Solar Eclipse at the time but maybe I'm doing it wrong.

♦ Tecton · 03/18/13, 8:29 AM

Soul of the Forest really doesn't give you any substantial reduction of casts between eclipse states, so the number of extra Starfalls you'd see in a fight would be small.

Kuruk · 03/18/13, 1:04 PM

One more thing, wouldn't taking NV make sense on Dark Animus so that you can use that once the boss is up, as that is the only time in that fight that you need to pump out as much dps as possible?

Lazerdollarz · 03/18/13, 5:53 PM

The DPS check on Dark Animus normal is so low it's not really even worth mentioning; you'll almost assuredly want to run HotW on heroic. For Ji-Kun, standard AoE rules apply: Eclipsed DoTs and then Hurricane. Updating OP now.

Zantaz · 03/18/13, 7:38 PM

Just got our first Animus kill tonight, clutch healing with HotW-Tranquility after Interrupting Jolt is more useful than NV, in my humble opinion.

Lilija · 03/20/13, 4:04 PM

Originally Posted by gannonjf

Horridon - Heroic

Typhoon, starfall and MF/SF(application, not the dot) all knock back the pink dinosaur from hell.

The problem with Typhoon, MF and SnF is that you need to have the target in front of you. FF comes really handy here. I'm using a handy macro for this:

/tar Direhorn Spirit
/cast Faerie Fire
/targetlasttarget

No need to worry about where the pink one is - just push it once in a few casts.

Melador · 03/20/13, 4:12 PM

Though MF/SF have the advantage of increasing SS procs.

Lazerdollarz · 03/20/13, 4:13 PM

Good find. I'd still recommend setting the spirit as your focus and using a focus macro instead of a target macro - I had issues with a /tar macro not working on our attempts last week.

Lilija · 03/21/13, 2:43 AM

Originally Posted by Melador

Though MF/SF have the advantage of increasing SS procs.

With so many targets dotted on the fight already I find this one additional target bit irrelevant - SS is already a machine gun. And the convinience of using a spell that you can cast with your back to the target is priceless. Besides, I even doubt the pink one procces SS since I don't see MF/SnF doing any dmg at all to it in the logs and without actual crits I don't think there can be an SS proc (did a fast check now - will look into it more when I'm back from work).

Gebuz · 03/21/13, 1:23 PM

Originally Posted by Lazerdollarz

(B) Using Symbiosis on a Death Knight is the only appreciable direct raid DPS increase, as it allows them to save on runes.

This only applies to dps dks, not tanks. Also, once they reach high amounts of haste they get gcd capped and it's value decreases a lot. Might be to a point were it is not even a dps increase. I prefer to give it to my dk tank for the extra tank cd whenever I want AMS.

Jin'rokh the Breaker
A new pools spawn every 90 seconds, which lines up perfectly with NV. The healing also double dips into the pool buff. On HC it is even more useful as you will be moving for most of the lightning storm phase, reducing damage during Nature's Vigil's downtime quite significantly.

Tortos
If assigned to kicking Turtles Displacer Beast is great for getting into position to kick them.

Durumu
HotW catform + feral wep is great for movement dps during the maze phase.

Iron Qon
AMS allows you to run through fire/lightning/frost on the ground without getting debuffs. Especially handy if you want to maximize dps during frost phase.

Twin Consorts
Make sure to dot the Day boss during the night phase when she appears. You can usually get a CA/INC dot up at the very end of CA when she appears for the first time. Timing Starfalls for when she is up is a dps increase aswell.

Lilija · 03/21/13, 2:43 PM

Originally Posted by Lazerdollarz

Good find. I'd still recommend setting the spirit as your focus and using a focus macro instead of a target macro - I had issues with a /tar macro not working on our attempts last week.

What was the nature of those issues?

As for the SS procs, I guess something might be on afterall. I checked out the log in details and I have noticed SS procs out of the blue sky when dino was up (when I was still using MF/SnF on it). I still would like to have FF in my macro tho. It would be perfect to have MF and FF in one macro so does FF is used if MF can't be, but simple /cast Moonfire /cast Faerie Fire doesn't work.

Lazerdollarz · 03/21/13, 8:36 PM

Originally Posted by Gebuz

This only applies to dps dks, not tanks. Also, once they reach high amounts of haste they get gcd capped and it's value decreases a lot. Might be to a point were it is not even a dps increase. I prefer to give it to my dk tank for the extra tank cd whenever I want AMS.

Jin'rokh the Breaker
A new pools spawn every 90 seconds, which lines up perfectly with NV. The healing also double dips into the pool buff. On HC it is even more useful as you will be moving for most of the lightning storm phase, reducing damage during Nature's Vigil's downtime quite significantly.

Tortos
If assigned to kicking Turtles Displacer Beast is great for getting into position to kick them.

Durumu
HotW catform + feral wep is great for movement dps during the maze phase.

Iron Qon
AMS allows you to run through fire/lightning/frost on the ground without getting debuffs. Especially handy if you want to maximize dps during frost phase.

Twin Consorts
Make sure to dot the Day boss during the night phase when she appears. You can usually get a CA/INC dot up at the very end of CA when she appears for the first time. Timing Starfalls for when she is up is a dps increase aswell.

In current gear, WM: P is still a DPS increase for DKs, and no other class gets anything in the way of DPS from Symbiosis, so I'm going to leave that there.

The math is currently showing that NV is not appreciably better than HotW on any encounter at this point (logs prove this, even for Jin'rokh), so default to HotW and pick NV if the healing is better suited to the encounter.

As far as Symb on Iron Qon goes, I'm still pretty convinced that Unending Resolve is the way to go. The only time you're ever in danger of dying if you play well (at least in normal mode) is Fist Smash in the final phase.

Originally Posted by Lilija

What was the nature of those issues?

As for the SS procs, I guess something might be on afterall. I checked out the log in details and I have noticed SS procs out of the blue sky when dino was up (when I was still using MF/SnF on it). I still would like to have FF in my macro tho. It would be perfect to have MF and FF in one macro so does FF is used if MF can't be, but simple /cast Moonfire /cast Faerie Fire doesn't work.

I was using /cast [target=Direhorn Spirit] blah blah blah; which doesn't work. /tar Direhorn Spirit; /cast Moonfire will work, but the reason why I like having the focus is because I can always see if it's in range or not. The macro I use is:
#showtooltip
/use [@focus, nomod] Moonfire;
/use [@focus, mod:shift] Sunfire;
/use [@focus, mod:alt] Faerie Fire

Kuruk · 03/21/13, 11:15 PM

Originally Posted by Gebuz

Durumu
HotW catform + feral wep is great for movement dps during the maze phase.

Is it still worth it even if you don't have a feral weapon?