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Old 11/15/07, 8:08 PM   #766
Arboleaus
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Black Dragonflight
Originally Posted by Bag View Post
From what I understand, the Everbloom Idol is worth 400-500ish ap on shreds. I don't see that getting replaced any time soon.
From my idol analysis thread on my guild website:

Everbloom Idol
- Equivalent to ~548 AP applied to Shred
X = base dmg with Everbloom
Z = what the base dmg would need to be to make up for the Idol
Y = the static value added onto Shred normally

2.25*X + Y + 88 = 2.25*Z + Y (eliminate Y on both sides and divide through by 2.25)
X + 39.1 = Z
39.1 = Z-X (convert Z and X to the base dmg formulas)
39.1 = (zAP - xAP)/14 (multiply 14 through)
547.7 = zAP - xAP

- Adds at least 22 DPS to the standard rotation
Assuming no crits, misses, dodges = 3x88 = 264 damage over ~12 second rotation

Idol of Terror
- 65 agility grants 71 AP & 2.66 crit over 10 seconds, 85% proc rate, 10 sec hidden cooldown
- scaled by the proc rate, that is 60 AP & 2.26% crit

Negating the 60 AP, Everbloom has a ~488 AP advantage vs 2.26 crit of Terror. You would have to be way over the AP/Crit balance line for Everbloom to not be the better idol.

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Old 11/15/07, 8:20 PM   #767
Allev
King Hippo
 
Allev's Avatar
 
Tauren Druid
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Astrylian View Post
A better (imo) version of this is:

#showtooltip
/cancelform [stance:1]
/use [nostance] Super Healing Potion
/use [nostance] Master Healthstone
/cast [nostance] Dire Bear Form
/stopmacro [nostance]
/cancelform [stance:3]
/use Super Healing Potion
/use Master Healthstone
/cast Cat Form

First, I fixed it, the /stopmacro line needs to have [nostance] not [stance: Cat form]. Second, I swapped the order, so that if you hit this in caster form, it goes to bear instead of cat.


The cool thing about potting in bear form that I haven't seen anyone mention lately, is that a bear potting actually gets more health than a warrior/pally potting. 4000-5000 for Super Pot + 2/2 Master Healthstone for a warrior, 5382-6727 for a bear.
More than 255 characters.

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Old 11/15/07, 9:00 PM   #768
Bag
Piston Honda
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Hyjal
Originally Posted by Arboleaus View Post
From my idol analysis thread on my guild website:

Everbloom Idol
- Equivalent to ~548 AP applied to Shred
X = base dmg with Everbloom
Z = what the base dmg would need to be to make up for the Idol
Y = the static value added onto Shred normally

2.25*X + Y + 88 = 2.25*Z + Y (eliminate Y on both sides and divide through by 2.25)
X + 39.1 = Z
39.1 = Z-X (convert Z and X to the base dmg formulas)
39.1 = (zAP - xAP)/14 (multiply 14 through)
547.7 = zAP - xAP

- Adds at least 22 DPS to the standard rotation
Assuming no crits, misses, dodges = 3x88 = 264 damage over ~12 second rotation

Idol of Terror
- 65 agility grants 71 AP & 2.66 crit over 10 seconds, 85% proc rate, 10 sec hidden cooldown
- scaled by the proc rate, that is 60 AP & 2.26% crit

Negating the 60 AP, Everbloom has a ~488 AP advantage vs 2.26 crit of Terror. You would have to be way over the AP/Crit balance line for Everbloom to not be the better idol.
Pretty much, except that the 60 ap and 2.26% crit applies to all attacks, including white attacks, effectively meaning that it is 488 ap applied to 35% of your damage vs. 60 ap/2.26% crit applied to 70% (considering rip/mangle generally equate to about 30% of your damage and the idol would not be applying to them in an ideal rotation). So, without further mathcraft, you can basically safely assume the Everbloom comes out on top. Someone feel free to prove me wrong, as I would rather do higher dps than be right here.

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Old 11/15/07, 9:52 PM   #769
Meddler
Piston Honda
 
Tauren Druid
 
Blackrock
Originally Posted by Allev View Post
More than 255 characters.
I believe you should be able to reduce the macro length by subbing in an item code instead of name?

For example:

#showtooltip
/cancelform [stance:1]
/use [nostance] (item:22829)
/use [nostance] Master Healthstone
/cast [nostance] Dire Bear Form
/stopmacro [nostance]
/cancelform [stance:3]
/use (item:22829)
/use Master Healthstone
/cast Cat Form

Won't be able to test this for a couple of days myself though so take this with a grain of salt.

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Old 11/15/07, 9:54 PM   #770
angral
Von Kaiser
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Proudmoore
Originally Posted by Allev View Post
More than 255 characters.
If you copied and pasted from the forum, the extra newline characters are taking up space in the macro page. Delete the blank space at the end of each line and that macro will work fine.

I use a different one, some others may like it, so I will post it here. It gives me complete control of which form I end up in and also uses ALL the pots I usually carry.

/cancelform
/use Master Healthstone
/use Volatile Healing Potion
/use Major Combat Healing Potion
/use Super Healing Potion
/use Crystal Healing Potion
/cast [modifier:shift]Dire Bear Form
/cast [modifier:ctrl]Cat Form
/cast [modifier:alt]Travel Form
I have another one that replaces 'healing' with 'mana' and I have a one stop mana macro as well.

p.s. Do not add Innervate to the mana list, it has gcd attached.

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Old 11/16/07, 1:00 AM   #771
Wara
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Druid
 
Archimonde
Whilst doing some spreadsheeting, I noticed that Thick Hide is getting applied twice, as far as I can tell, and I also didn't see any mention of it anywhere. It's not the biggest deal in the world, but I was going insane trying to figure out why my calculated value wasn't matching up with the in-game value.

Anyhow, I came up with:
Dire Bear Armor = (Gear Armor * 1.10 * 4.00) + (Gear Armor * 1.10) + Agility*2

I found this curious as Dire Bear tooltip is worded the same, but acts differently.

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Old 11/16/07, 1:15 AM   #772
Malazaar
Don Flamenco
 
Tauren Druid
 
Gul'dan (EU)
The normal multiplier is x5.0 (400% increase) so thick hide brings it to 5.0*1.1 = 5.5 (450% increase).

Same as you get effectively though it really is working as intended.

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Old 11/16/07, 3:05 AM   #773
Boevis
Bald Bull
 
Boevis's Avatar
 
Tauren Druid
 
Lightbringer
Originally Posted by Wara View Post
Whilst doing some spreadsheeting, I noticed that Thick Hide is getting applied twice, as far as I can tell, and I also didn't see any mention of it anywhere. It's not the biggest deal in the world, but I was going insane trying to figure out why my calculated value wasn't matching up with the in-game value.

Anyhow, I came up with:
Dire Bear Armor = (Gear Armor * 1.10 * 4.00) + (Gear Armor * 1.10) + Agility*2

I found this curious as Dire Bear tooltip is worded the same, but acts differently.
You do realize that just equals Gear Armor*1.1*5 + Agility*2

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Old 11/16/07, 4:40 AM   #774
Carlos
Piston Honda
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Eredar (EU)
Originally Posted by falkon2 View Post
From strictly an itemization standpoint, the food gives the exact same amount as all the others - 20 points. I guess it really depends on your gear, etc. but if your gear's gem slots gave you the choice, 20agi food and 4 5hit/5agi gems is exactly the same as 20hit food and 4 10agi gems. (Although being really really nitpicky, crimson spinels are a lot more in demand and 5hit/5agi allows you to nab yellow sockets)
Like you wrote it is very depended on your gear. Currently for myself, I must say I would not go for it because even with my T4 +3 Bosses in SSC/TK. I have 130 +Hit with the Def enchant on the head slot. After the start of Season 3 I will get into the problem of having to much hit and need to find a way to reduce hit by 4 points without having more than 2 +4hit/4agi gems...

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Old 11/16/07, 5:33 AM   #775
Vandermonde
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Priest
 
Perenolde
If i screw up and hit a potion/healthstone macro that does not include the cancelform line (just relying on the automatic deshift from /use master healthstone) while not in control of my actions, will i deshift and die? Or will it recognize that I cannot use items before it tries to deshift me and do nothing?

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Old 11/16/07, 6:25 AM   #776
Inaiwae
Piston Honda
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Sylvanas (EU)
Originally Posted by Vandermonde View Post
If i screw up and hit a potion/healthstone macro that does not include the cancelform line (just relying on the automatic deshift from /use master healthstone) while not in control of my actions, will i deshift and die? Or will it recognize that I cannot use items before it tries to deshift me and do nothing?
I was tanking Vashj yesterday, got shocked (stun for 5 secs) and while stunned i tried to re-shift to get out of Roots. I left bear form and spent the stun in human form.

So i guess you'll deshift and die.

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Old 11/16/07, 6:32 AM   #777
anathor
Piston Honda
 
anathor's Avatar
 
Tauren Druid
 
Karazhan (EU)
I'm not sure I understand the question, I was under the impression that if you are not in control of your actions, you can click all you want on whatever you want, nothing will happen because it's just not registered.

If you are in a shapeshift form and try to use an ability that may only be used in caster form, you will leave the form and use that ability. This means that you can shift from one form to another in one action. If you don’t have mana to shift form, you will get an error message and remain in your current form. This can be disabled with /console autoUnshift 0
You can always use the /console command above to be sure nothing will happen anyway, if you think this is a concern.

One of the changes I like the most so far is to simply be able, when in one form, to click on another form in our "form bar" and switch immediatly to that form. The part I don't like is that you can't do it from flight form unless you are "on the ground". I wish I could do that whenever I want, or at least get a /console command to force that behaviour. For example when a kaliri comes after me, I like to start shifting to cat when I'm not yet on the ground, to start getting energy ticks since I don't really care about the fall damage anyway (especially in cat form). And this also means a "rawr bomb" requires 2 clicks instead of 1 if not macroed.

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Old 11/16/07, 6:33 AM   #778
PekkaR
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Emerald Dream (EU)
Originally Posted by Vandermonde View Post
If i screw up and hit a potion/healthstone macro that does not include the cancelform line (just relying on the automatic deshift from /use master healthstone) while not in control of my actions, will i deshift and die? Or will it recognize that I cannot use items before it tries to deshift me and do nothing?
On PTR there was no automatic deshift for using items (it just gave an error message). I haven't tested on live or with a healthstone but you'll note that the item use macros posted previously have /cancelform in them.

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Old 11/16/07, 6:34 AM   #779
anathor
Piston Honda
 
anathor's Avatar
 
Tauren Druid
 
Karazhan (EU)
Originally Posted by Inaiwae View Post
I was tanking Vashj yesterday, got shocked (stun for 5 secs) and while stunned i tried to re-shift to get out of Roots. I left bear form and spent the stun in human form.

So i guess you'll deshift and die.
That's completely different - you can always deshift while stunned. I think what he means would be more like "if you're stunned in bear form and click rejuv, will the client deshift you even though you can't cast rejuv while stunned?"

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Old 11/16/07, 6:49 AM   #780
Vandermonde
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Priest
 
Perenolde
Originally Posted by anathor View Post
That's completely different - you can always deshift while stunned. I think what he means would be more like "if you're stunned in bear form and click rejuv, will the client deshift you even though you can't cast rejuv while stunned?"
Yeah, essentially I'm wondering if the auto-deshift is contingent on the move you click being castable when you click it. If it is, and the auto-deshift is reliable, it seems like putting cancelform in your macros is a downright bad idea as opposed to simply unnecessary.

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