Whitemane

Boca is on tank healing, but why only one tank? This fight is particularly well suited to lifebloom, yet none of you are utilizing that. 4 people are taking damage, which gives you plenty of targets for lifebloom. I see Boca is mainly focusing on one person, but not really taking the opportunity to help out on others? That they put you on raid healing is absolutely ridiculous.

In this fight one druid, at least, should be a clear #1 on healing done.

And what about Shahraz? You're both mainly focusing on just one tank when there are 3 tanks that are taking damage. Granted, not as much as the maintank but you might as well be keeping up 3 stacks of lifebloom here as well. Should be easier for you as well since you have more regen than me.

 

malthrin

Do you really have enough mana on Shahraz to roll on all 3 tanks? Our first kill I tried doing Blooms on all 3 tanks + Rejuv on the MT and around 40% I was out of mana, pot on cooldown, Innervate used, completely empty. Maybe it was just bad luck on mana drains, I haven't done the fight enough to have a good baseline impression. Last week (our second kill) I just did LB+RJ + Swiftmends on the main tank and was pretty comfortable on mana. I'm not sure where the happy medium will end up.

 

• Playered

Not to mention OT healing on Mother is... well CoH and Chainheal more than cover it, heck even a single LB on them every now and then covers that amount of damage..
Rolling 3x LB is just not needed there because their damage is just like 5-8k every 10sec or something...

I used to try rolling on 3, or doing a duo of MT+OT x2 but in the end the pathetically dull slow chunks of damage the OTs take is more suited to something healing for 3-4k a hit than a gradual HoT.

 

Whitemane

Shahraz does saber lash approximately every 10 seconds ranging from 7.4k - 9.2k damage, some of them gets dodged and parried though. It's the 3 most consistent sources of damage taken and that's why I roll blooms on all three. If someone gets ported in range, I'll often HoT them up instead and let a bloom fall off an OT. They can survive without, but it eases the strain on other healers.

Yes, chain heal and CoH can cover it but why let it? I can keep those 3 blooms rolling just fine, but my regen is also better than yours it would seem malthrin. It means that other healers won't have to worry about the OT's at all and that's a plus for the raid.

 

• giansm

On Mother I 3xLB all tanks and rejuv the main tank, this is because our CoH priests and resto shaman have told me they prefer to be free to heal whomever they please in the raid. The priests hate to CoH the OTs since the group they're in is usually partially ranged and so they can't get all of it in the radius. I figure if I can help them out and cover the OTs then I might as well. As far as mana goes, I usually have enough unless I get really bad mana drains and also had to battle res someone, in which case I either drop the rejuvenation on the MT, drop the LBs on the OTs, get switched into a shadow priest group, or get an innervate from a feral (depending on the situation).

 

lairpie

yeah, i suspect most people that have mana issues while chaining lifeblooms are mostly refreshing lifebloom too often. For our first kill i was using a flask of chromatic wonder and 1 pc of green SR gear along with a couple epic SR peices to get to 365 trying to save hearts as we were a bit short on them, and still had enough mana to keep lb up on all 3 tank the whole fight, and rejuv up on the mt for probably 75% of the fight. I have literally as little regen as is physically possible while still having decent gear. Pure rubies/spinnels, healing meta, no mp5 enchants anywhere, battlemasters/eotm, no shadow priest ever, no mana tide but can still maintain 3 lifeblooms even in full SR. Maybe i got a bit lucky on mana drains, but i also screwed up and let about a minute pass on my pot timer at one point, so that prolly makes up for that.

One thing, to be an effective druid, your raid and particularly your other healers really have to learn to trust you. This is a good example. Stacking lifeblooms on all 3 tanks is great if other healers trust that you'll keep them there reliably enough that they don't have to heal those tanks. If other healers are constantly not sure if your hots are going to reliably be there, you're going to be doing vastly less to benefit the raid than you could be. Paladins are still always going to fol top off people with hots because they're trying so hard to find something useful to do, but beyond that, your raid really needs to learn to trust in hots. Having 2 druids instead of 1 really makes that a lot easier because it pushes hots from a buffer, to a major source of tank healing on as many tanks as you can get.

Brewmaster of WBC

 

lairpie

1. Download Caster weapon swap - This addon lets you setup so that while you're on the GCD anyway from casting, it will equip a second weapon with spell surge on it each time spell surge's hidden cooldown is over, and then swap back to your real weapon when spell surge procs. You lose a bit of healing for a couple spells a minute to get 100 extra mana per minute for your whole party. Probably a good trade. Also lets you set a high spirit weapon to automatically equip if you innervate, get a bluedragon or bangle proc, or whatever. Also, as opposed to the standard self innervate macro that also equips a spirit staff, this will swap if someone else innervates you too. Either way, 500 extra mana split between your party at the cost of ~100 healing for just a couple casts is probably worth it, though varies based on group setup.

2. Equip [Nightstaff of the Everliving] or [Ethereum Life-Staff] with a 20 spirit enchant when you innervate. The addon above will help with that. If you do ever get out of the FSR for a couple seconds during those last couple mobs of hyjal trash, or while running far away from fires on archimonde, or whatever, also pop that on. Using Caster Weapon Swapper also takes care of remembering to put good healing weapons back on.

3. If you have a prot paly or ret paly, they should really be keeping JoW up pretty much all the time. Its a huge mana boost for dps classes, especially hunters, sp, enh shaman. On any fight where there isn't some sort of stomp thing you can benefit from it quite a bit, especially if you have ooc with one of those like 15 points that there's nothing to really do that's terribly useful. Mother sharaz is a great example, which I didn't really think about till now, but you can get a bunch of swings in there in tree form and get quite a bit of mana back. Also, for any fight where you're mostly just healing one tank, spells that are free because of OOC don't count for keeping you inside the FSR. Its super hard to actually do it on purpose, but if you're just keeping hots up on 1 tank, a lot of the time a good OOC proc will let you drop outside the FSR for 4-5 seconds. Obviously there are a lot of fights where meleeing is a bad idea, but where its good, its great. On shahraz for instance, if you're keeping up lb on each tank and rejuv, you can probably get 2, maybe 3 melee swings in per 10 seconds. Thats a ton of extra mana for the cost of... nothing.

4. Farm [Dark Rune] or [Demonic Rune]. They use your healthstone timer, but are a great source of extra mana.

5. Figure out exactly how much mana your innervate gives you with your raid buffed spirit, and use it to the best use possible. In a short fight, i generally aim to use it 1/2 way through the fight, spaced between 2 pot timers. For a fight that's getting up to like 8-10 minutes, often you'd be better off using it earlier, then again, even if you waste a little bit of it. Consider your pot/rune timers carefully so they're spaced away from innervate, and mostly just put a bit of thought into it. Innervate really shouldn't be a "oh crap i'm oom now, time to innervate thing" it should be planned.

Brewmaster of WBC

 

lairpie

Problem 1: Potions
You don't use mana potions
Obviously, hyjal's not super hard for guilds clearing bt, but that's one of the problems for druids, we can't like downrank as stuff gets easier, we pretty much keep right on using the same amount of mana. As such, bt clearing druids are still popping tons of mana potions. In his links, Gian uses 1-2 per boss. Nekrataal used 12 the night he linked. I use probably 10-20 in a night. You're even an herbalist.

Problem 2: Gear
Because you don't use mana potions, your gear is woefully over focussed on mana regen, hurting your +healing a lot. Overall you have very comparable gear to mine, but I have just short of 2500 healing (buffed, without Wrath of air, though i sometimes have that too). My mana pot usage compared to yours covers the difference in mana regen that you have over me. Others have gone into how to make up that gap.

Problem 3: Spell selection
There's generally 2 different ways to play, though Ribeye is I think the only druid that I've seen that didn't seem completely retarded that really did things much differently than me. Both ways chug mana pots like crazy, but one is to use a balanced gear setup with the mana meta gem, mp5/healing gems, and making all the socket bonuses, vaguely similar to what you have minus the int gem, and be some sort of hybrid tank hotter / raid healer like Ribeye does. From what i can determine, this only works if one or more of your paladins prefers to mostly heal tanks. For this, you'd wear gear fairly similar to what you are wearing, but be using regrowth, rejuv, swiftmend quite a bit, therefore using all that mana, while also keeping your hots up on the tank as a buffer. If you're doing a good job keeping hots up on the tank, any healer that's competent will notice a big difference.

The other, more common way, is to basically get the absolute minimum amount of mana you can still not run out, and stack +healing as much as possible to increase the power of your hots. Then, you do basically nothing but keep stacks of lifeblooms, rejuvs on people, working in regrowth where needed because frankly there's no way to get little enough mana regen with remotely t6 level gear to not have mana to spare if you're just using lb and rejuv.
You seem to be caught in between. You're using gear with lots of mana regen, and but not using spells that use that much mana, hence why you don't need to use mana potions. If you do find yourself oom, really ever, there's a very very high chance that you either cast a bunch of heals that weren't actually needed (like where you have a bunch of people that you got 1 lifebloom tick then chain heal or CoH topped them off, or lots of regrowth hits but very few ticks.

I can't really speak to the first, but I'd recommend focusing on dropping some gear regen for +healing, using mana pots more, and focus on keeping stacks of hots on 3-4 people you know are going to be taking lots of damage. Its very important to communicate, and to get other healers to trust you. Your healing is going to be a lot worse if other healers don't trust you to do your job.

Problem 4: Raid makup.
Druids start to look better and better the fewer healers you have. We sometimes are down to just 1 healing paly, 1 shaman, 1 priest and 2 druids for trash, then our tanking paly healing too for bosses, but if you drop down to 5-6 healers, druid healing gets insane. Basically, I'm doing the same amount of healing no matter how many healers and no matter how much damage, it just doesn't ever tick if there's lots of healing from other people compared to damage taken. 2 good resto druids vastly lowers the number of healers things take. Recently we've started bringing more healers than we'd really like, mostly for lack of good damagers, and druid healing hasn't seemed as amazing as it did when we were doing 5-6 healers most of the time.

oh yeah, and i'm not big into the whole wws secrecy thing, so knock yourself out. Pretty much every fight has 2 resto druids: WBC Guild history Earlier kills are generally better to look at imo.

Brewmaster of WBC

 

Sheshonk

Some of you have expressed interest to me about the screen shot I posted about druid boot itemization. Yes, it is a gear itemization spreadsheet that I put together for my own use. The full file can be found here...

My Spreadsheet.


This spreadsheet was built for my own personal use, so it is a bit rough around the edges, but what it does do well is show itemization choices fairly well between slots. It consists of 4 tabs...

1. Base Gear: Place whichever item you wish to compare for a slot on the top line. All T5 and T6 gear is entered with a sprinkling of T4 gear. To run actual comparisons click the button at the top.
   
2. Theory Craft: This is where you select gem and talent choices. Also a place to choose % of time spent within the 5 second rule and determine if blessing of kings is up.
   
3. Actual Stats: Nothing really amazing here.
   
4. Comparisons: Real tab of interest, comparisons between items. Average regen is calculated by taking into account talents, spirit, mp5, and time spent within 5sec rule.

This is by no means perfect. Things on my wish list is to accommodate imp spirit, tree of life aura, and innervate. Unfortunately, with the 2.4 changes to regen I'm not really sure of a good way to compare regen thanks to the int modifier.

Feel free to do what you wish with the file, enjoy!

 

Ashley8185

I am fairly new to this whole Tree of Life Healing thing, i used to be a hybrid HT/Bal Druid which i loved but wasnt really effective in SSC/TK + raiding. I checked out EJ and pretty much copied the talents the first post suggested and threw in the rest. At the time, I wasnt so sure I would stay TOL. Its been about a month or so and I realize now that TOL is pretty much required for BT/MH.

So with that being said, i have spent some good time reading this thread and I have learned a lot...but I would like some help with suggestions and such. With 2.4 I have some changes in gear that i am going to be getting, like the Ethereum Life-Staff and dropping my Mace & OH. Also, for whatever reason, armory hasnt updated my boots enchated with vitality and my actual healing cloak.

Please feel free to pick apart my spec, my gear, enchants and gems with any helpful advice.

The World of Warcraft Armory

Thanks!

 

lairpie

Questions:

1. What group are you in, namely, are you in a tank group where you're tol aura actually is valuable? Do you reliably have a resto shaman in your group, and do you usually have a shadow priest in your group? These affect what your gear needs are quite a bit.

2. What is your normal healing role, ie, are you usually stacking lifeblooms, rejuvs on tanks, or doing something else.

3. What gear do you have access to? Like for instance, the cloth za chest off the bear boss is vastly better than yours, do you not have it because you're unlucky, does your guild not do za, or what? You have hyjal rep, so you're in hyjal, how far? How about BT?

Brewmaster of WBC

 

Kalaghan

My take on it, although I'm not really an expert. I wouldn't match the bracers for socket bonus. I'd rather have +5heal than the +4int, if you're stuck on regen (i.e. royal nightseye). Personally I'd just go with straight +18heal. Likewise on the shoulders, there's no reason to ever use 9heal/4int, especially if you're not matching a socket. Again I'd go with the +heal or if you like regen go with royal nightseye (wherever I say that, consider heal/spirit gems instead post 2.4). Ribbon of Sacrifice really isn't for a resto druid. You get nothing from the use effect and Lower City Prayer Book at 3 less plus heal provides more mana efficiency. Obviously though you should be going for Essence of the Martyr, and then Battlemaster if you're truly having no mana regen trouble. Likewise, you'd be a lot better off with a Bangle of Endless Blessings than Pendant of the Violet Eye for mana regen (particularly if you're using your innervate on yourself). There are other trinkets that are also better for regen, but the Bangle is worth grinding Bot for even if you're in BT (for the odd fight where mana regen is an issue). It will only get better in 2.4.

Personally wouldn't put the points in Empowered Touch/Tranquil Spirit if you aren't going to get Naturalist. Granted, your NS+HT benefits, but I would think going that far for a single cast every 3minutes is a bit extreme. It doesn't seem your build is using your 'spare' points for PvP, so why not take the points out of Natural Shapeshifter/Nature's Focus and put them in Naturalist (you shouldn't be changing forms very frequently in PvE anyway, since the primary advantage of tree form is mana efficiency and you will quickly negate that). That's a bit more subjective on my part though, because I don't put any points in the HT talents.

Edited because I said Living Spirit when I meant Tranquil Spirit. lol

 

lairpie

What? Not get living spirit in a purely pve healing build?

Emp touch i get if I know I'm going to spec back to a pvp spec soon and not want to farm at all, but other than that, yeah, bad talent.

I always get natural shape shifter because of:
archimonde
hyjal trash
tranquility
banshee curse
shifting back in after NS
stupid motw not castable in tol

I also always max imp regrowth because, eh, there's nothing else that good to get and I can kill things on my hunter if i want to kill things, don't need balance dps talents.

If you're trying to pvp and pve without respeccing I'd suggest speccing what I think I am right now, 8-11-42, no imp mark (I just make sure someone else will have it) and a couple points in imp regrowth are all i really miss in pve, and a couple scattered things I miss in pvp, that are pretty much made up for by a bit of extra regen from imp spirit.

@ Orblight: Your gems are bad. Like, really. Either max +healing with all reds and the healing meta, or get as much healing as possible while still making socket bonuses and use the mana meta. The healing meta is really, really bad compared to the mana meta and should only be used when you don't need mana regen from gems at all. Like compare:
normal socket: 22 healing vs 11 healing and 2 mp5 (or for blue gems 18 vs 9 and 2)
meta socket: 26 healing vs 12 int and ~12 mp5 (counted over the course of about 20 boss fights how many times it procced for me)

for the normal one you're giving up 11 healing to get 2 mp5, ie, its a 5.5 healing per mp5 trade. The meta you're giving up 26 healing to get 12 mp5, ie a ~2healing per mp5 trade, not even counting the intelect. So yeah, Bracing earth storm should be the very last thing you use in shifting from mana regen to raw +healing.

Brewmaster of WBC

 

Kalaghan

Haha...whoops. I definitely meant to say Emp touch and tranquil spirit. My bad, I fixed it. Thanks for the catch.

Archimonde I stay out of ToL the entire fight anyway (you pop out everytime you need to decurse/run?). Hyjal trash it would be nice I suppose, but I don't really feel it's a necessity (I've never run OOM on the trash as long as I drink pots). So basically as far as I'm concerned it saves 200 mana every 3min max (and I suppose if you have to rebuff mid-fight, but that doesn't happen too often and frankly MotW still isn't worth the mana imo at that point). And I'm not sure why you have tranquility in that list? It just doesn't seem worth it to me - 6ish mp5 and possibly save a couple pots on Hyjal trash.

 

lairpie

@ orblight:
on your gear. Obviously, gear doesn't grow on trees, (resisting the urge to make a bad pun) but assuming you're one of those people I hate where things you want drop, and guessing from your rep that you're something like a couple bosses into both bt and hyjal:

Replace your stuff with (all from first half of hyjal/bt or earlier):
[Helm of Natural Regeneration]
[Lord Sanguinar's Claim] or pvp neck
[Gnarled Ironwood Pauldrons] or t5
[Robes of Heavenly Purpose]
[Rejuvenating Bracers]
[Life-step Belt]
[Boots of the Divine Light]
[Ethereum Life-Staff] or s3 mace
[Idol of the Emerald Queen]
[Essence of the Martyr], [Battlemaster's Perseverance], [Lower City Prayerbook] any of those 2. i prefer the first 2 as i'm almost never short on mana, but if i was ever, lcpb would be the first thing to get in.

over all if you're mostly doing the whole lifebloom stack on tanks thing, you have probably too much mana regen, but could swap to use the good mana meta and drop a ton of mana regen everywhere else.


Spec's fine, though consider nature's grasp can get you out of a bind in hyjal sometimes as like, everything in hyjal is rootable.

Brewmaster of WBC

 

Ashley8185

I gemmed myself this way back when the meta required more RED and YELLOW gems than BLUE. I got the bracers from Winter tonight....why not [Enchanted Leather Sandals] though?

ill respond more in a bit. ty for the advice so far though!@

1. My group really depends on if there is another TOL druid or not. When I am the only TOL druid, I am usually with the tanks and then a lock. If I am not in the MT group, I am with a resto shammy and a shadowpriest.

2. Normal healing role is usually MT or OT healing. I usually stack LBx3 and rejuv...then i NS-Regrowth or NS-HT depending on the need and if i have time to switch back into Tree. Sometimes I heal raid or small groups. I am not much for the raid healing because our Resto Shaman is amazing and wtfpwns my healing.

3. We run ZA/Kara (you never know) on off days or during the day. I am usually at work/school. We just started Hyjal last week and are 3/5 already. I would think we will be 4/5 by the end of this week. BT is starting this week. So I have access to BT/MH and below. I hate PVPing though so I only do it if I -have- to.


Like I said before, in my earlier post, my gems are from when the meta i have in my helm required both yellow and red gems. Now that it doesnt, I havent really thought about redoing gems because hopefully I will be replacing my gear soon. I am pretty clueless when it comes to gems, I asked my boyfriend who plays a priest/hunter....lol. I just got the rejuv bracers from Winterchill tonight...so I have [Soothing Amethyst] in my bank but bf said to use [Purified Shadow Pearl]. I should say now I am not good with the whole WoW Stats math for like stats into mp5 healing. I have to read it like 15 times, think about it and come back before I begin to grasp it. I am thinking of keeping most of my gems to +healing & +spirit gems now with the 2.4 patch...but idk, any ideas for that?


As for specs, pretty much, I log on mostly to Raid...but there are times that I need to farm or PVP (against my natural will). I have always specced in balance but for some odd reason, i have a bagful of feral gear. I am thinking about respecing so i can utilize the gear that is sitting in my bags....how would this spec be: Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft ? Pretty much, I dropped tranquil spirit and empowered touch because I hardly use HT so it was kind of a waste. I went for the 5 points in balance for root and then 8 points in feral for farming/pvp. I am not sure if its worth while though. I have to keep Imp Paw because our ferals dont have it and there are some times that I am the only druid.

I really appreciate the help!


First off, I am working on getting the t5 shoulders and helm along with Sols Staff (which are free now in our guild). I got [Rejuvenating Bracers] tonight!!!! woot! And i think i have the badges to afford one of the trinkers. I have the prayerbook in my bank. Now i do have some questions about loot that I looked at from BT/MH that I thought I would go after for upgrades. I try to stay away from cloth because my guild has a team of priests to compete with...

Head- [Thunderheart Helmet]
Sholders - [Veil of Turning Leaves]
Back - [Shroud of Forgiveness]
Chest - [Don Rodrigo's Poncho] '
Hands - [Thunderheart Gloves]
Belt - [Belt of Primal Majesty]
Pants - [Thunderheart Legguards]
Feet - [Enchanted Leather Sandals]
Trinket - [Memento of Tyrande]

 

Currylaksa

I'm not sure if the shoulder and haste belt are significant upgrades. The badge/T5 shoulder and ZA belt make more sense to me, and you don't need to spend BT/MH DKP on those. Not everything has to come from BT, as ZA/badge loot can hold their own up to Illidan.

TBH, I would just take whatever that drops and is an upgrade over existing slot, rather than hold out for a wish-list item. The initial part of entering BT is when competition over T6 tokens can be expensive, so consider non-set alternatives. You can take for example [Guise of the Tidal Lurker] over T6 helm and [Kilt of Immortal Nature] over T6 pants, those are available for min bids from the easiest T6 bosses and are not too shabby themselves.

 

• giansm

[Kilt of Immortal Nature] is comparable to T6, and is much easier to get (it's from Akama and is leather instead of a set piece). For trinkets look into the badge ones ([Battlemaster's Perseverance] and [Essence of the Martyr]) as they are both better than yours and Memento will be really tough to get if you are worried about competing with other healers (like you say you are). For your belt, if you can't get the ZA one or the cloth belt from council, I would indeed pick up Primal Majesty for next patch but for now just keep wearing yours. [Veil of Turning Leaves] is really bad, it's worse than properly gemmed T4. Since they're dropped by Council and the shoulder token is from Mother, I assume you're concerned about competition for the shoulder token. In that case your best bet is to get the badge shoulders.

Also I would encourage you to check the loot rank listed in the first post if you don't feel comfortable doing the math yourself. It's generally a pretty good guide, especially if you look at the "score" column so you can tell how close two items (i.e. two items are pretty much comparable to each other if their scores are very close, regardless of how they are ordered, and at that point it becomes a personal decision).

 

fuzzynavel

So, I am a newb and leveled LW for the new chest, hoping to drop it and go back to herbalism once its crafted. Now they made it require LW. /sadface

 

• Playered

To be fair it was inevitable that best in slot items would end up being restricted like this, else it would be almost required to profession hop if you were a serious raider.

Atleast herbalism is easy to level on an alt, and well LW is still nice for raiding thanks to Drums.

 

fuzzynavel

thanks for making me feel better lol. I just didnt see this coming because none of the other BOP crafted items have a profession requiremnent. The ones that drop in raids I mean.

 

Ashley8185

DKP isnt so expensive because we use EPGP so going in we know who is in line first to get tokens and gear. Thanks for the insight though!

I am going to get one trinket tonight and get the other one this weekend. I looked at Loot Rank List and I will definately look at that. Thanks for the help in those areas. Tiered gear isnt that hard to get especially with the druid T6 tokens. I wanted to go for the 4 piece tier bonus but thought the shoulder was a lot better.

Any suggestions about the spec I posted or about gems?

Thanks!

 

Ribeye

This is a good example of what a well equipped and pissed off from wiping on farm content resto Druid can do when he decides he is going to personally win the fight all by himself.

Wow Web Stats

 

PowerBaton

Tbh 511 886 of healing done isn't any insane score at that fight, which is quite long, and "regen healers" (Priests, Druids) are quite best. And you used only 4 potions

 

Jalhar

They took 8 minutes to kill him, healing done doesn't mean anything if not put in relation to time spent. His HPS is 1190, which is on the high range of my bracket on this fight (I'm between 1000 and 1200 on council, depending on how many healers we take) and I would say a good proportion of the druids posting here do more or less the same HPS on council (rolling rejuv + bloom on 2 3 tanks and throwing random heals around).
He took 4 potions, but he had a shadow priest. I usually don't get one for council, and I take 1-2 potions and my 2 innervates (our kills being in the 9-11 minutes range depending on how many retards die in blizzard / flamestrike, first after 2 min, second after 8).

On the general gemming issue, I myself went for 11 heal / 2 mp5 , 2 or 3 11 healing / 5 int gems and the mana regen meta gem. I loose around 100 healing (still 2287 unbuffed...) vs full +22 gemming, but I win around 25 mp5 (not counting the meta). Even if I could probably handle the full +22 gemming now, mana wise, it wasn't the case when we were learning the encounters, and I remember myself chain potting on the first BB, mother, council kills and being totally oom at the end of the fights. And as everyone knows, an oom healer with +2500 to heals heal less than a healer with mana and +2400 to heals. I see how this may change with the 2.4 regen mecanics, but as far as I saw, Sunwell encounters are quite healing intensive, and with the haste buff we'll be able to cast 1-2 more spells / rotation, thus using even more mana. At the end, it's up to personal choice and spells uses, but the two strategies are definitly viable and I doubt it's a good idea to tell to any new tree that full red gemming is the best way to go.