You don't need to reach experties or hit cap. Where have you heard this?
And you can reach the ArP cap with one of the two ArP trinkets - have a look at my Cat DPS Guide please...
If you worry with the hit/exp caps, you won't maximize your dps regardless. You should honestly be more concerned with hitting the soft cap for ArP, then working on crit, and getting that to around 60%. That would be a much better dps increase then going hit/expertise. I'm not saying you cannot gem hit/exp, it won't lower your dps per say, it just will not increase it as much as other stats.
You don't need to reach experties or hit cap. Where have you heard this?
And you can reach the ArP cap with one of the two ArP trinkets - have a look at my Cat DPS Guide please...
I've read your dps guide (got a lot of info out of it, thank you for that) but atm my cat gear sucks, I hope my guild is gonna boost me a bit in naxx 25 so I can get the trinket easily but I'm not sure about that.
Reaching hit and expertise cap it's possible but not necessary. Actually the BiS Ulduar gear (without Hard Modes or 10 mens) will push you at expertise, hit and Arpen cap, so yes it's possible.
Arpen Soft Cap
619 with Grim Toll
566 with Rune Stone
and 1231 is the hard cap.
Last edited by nightcrowler : 06/19/09 at 2:38 PM.
Have you set up a gemming template in Rawr that includes ArP gems?
I have set up the gemming options to show ArP gems, and they consistently come in a little below Delicates, even though I am at 208 ArP rating. This has bothered me a long time about Rawr, in that everything I read here says I should be stacking ArP gems in place of all my agi gems now, yet Rawr contradicts this. Other than this one topic, Rawr has been fantastic as a guide for gearing out my kitty set, so I am reluctant to disregard it on this topic as well, yet every post I read here says abandon my agi gems now.
I am really confused and would appreciate your feedback. Do I swap out all my agi gems now for Arp? or just stick with what I have. I am really quite pleased with my current dps numbers, having hit 7200 on Thaddius the other night, but if stacking Arp gems will increase it even more, I would do that.
I have set up the gemming options to show ArP gems, and they consistently come in a little below Delicates, even though I am at 208 ArP rating. This has bothered me a long time about Rawr, in that everything I read here says I should be stacking ArP gems in place of all my agi gems now, yet Rawr contradicts this. Other than this one topic, Rawr has been fantastic as a guide for gearing out my kitty set, so I am reluctant to disregard it on this topic as well, yet every post I read here says abandon my agi gems now.
I am really confused and would appreciate your feedback. Do I swap out all my agi gems now for Arp? or just stick with what I have. I am really quite pleased with my current dps numbers, having hit 7200 on Thaddius the other night, but if stacking Arp gems will increase it even more, I would do that.
Thanks in advance for your help.
How you play and gear your character is not a choice we make for you.
Rawr is a model, FBN is a simulation so there will be differences. Both of them give similar results and gemming either way will make less difference than how well you play on any specific fight.
I just loaded up my current gear in Rawr twice, in the second instance I changed all of the gems from agility to armor penetration, total gain of 33dps from nine red gems or 3.67dps per gem. Now these values will change based on how much you are starting with but given that both programs base the DPS around a stationary fight, which is far from what most fights are, do you really think you will notice the difference? Being out of range because you ran a different way from the tank to avoid some AoE will cost more DPS than gemming a different way.
Whatever you choose the choice is yours to make not ours.
Okay so heres my question. HOW THE HELL DOES CRIT CHANCE % work?!
All of this is UNBUFFED.
Here's my armory: The World of Warcraft Armory
My AGI is 1327
My Crit Rating is 669
My Crit Chance in caster form is 22.85%
This is my friend's armory: The World of Warcraft Armory
His AGI is 1294
His Crit Rating is 603
His Crit Chance in caster form: 36.14%
If my AGI and Crit Rating is higher than his, why does he have 13-14% Crit Chance over me? We're using the same spec, this is caster form, and again, all unbuffed. Rawr also gives very odd stats for this as well.
My RAWR, the only buffs I have enabled is Leader of the Pack:
My AGI is 1423 ....loaded straight from armory btw, newest version of RAWR (2.2.7)
My Crit Rating 681 (12 more than what armory says I have)
My Crit Chance 49.58673%, however in-game i'm @ 52.07% (cat form, leader of the pack, master shapeshifter)
Assuming Rawr DOESN'T add my Master Shapeshifter talent, I'll add it here: 49.58+4% = 53.58% crit chance, which is 1.51% more than what I have in-game.
My friend in RAWR, same buffs enabled etc.
His AGI is 1403 (again loaded straight from Armory)
His Crit Rating 603
His Crit Chance 50.69%
All RAWR modules were used loading STRAIGHT from armory, all buffs STRIPPED besides LotP. Same exact 0/55/16 spec. Does ANYONE have a clue as to
1) Why is Armory vs Rawr showing different stat scores, especially when im loading the Rawr profile from armory
2) Why is his Crit Chance that much higher when I outrank him in AGI and Crit Rating, however when put into Rawr the difference is minimal, and seemingly incorrect. It's bugging me so badly.
I also went ahead and stripped my gear. I'm a NE with 94 base agility, this provides 8.60% Crit Hit Chance. I equipped Infection Repulser (because it has no agility or crit rating) and my Crit Chance is 6.16%.... 2.44% less crit than what AGI says I should have. I appreciate your knowledge and replies as I cannot find it anywhere, and perhaps I've just overlooked it
It's because your friend logged off in catform and you did in casterform.
Concerning RAWR:
I just uploaded your char and RAWR shows 669 Crit Rating (I cant see the strange +12 Crit Rating you mention).
Your Agi in RAWR is higher because RAWR averages the DarkmoonCard: Greatness procc.
Your ingame crit chance shown by your char menu might be 52.07%. However, bosses are lvl83 and you suffer from some crit depression here. That's why RAWR shows 49.53%. If you set your target to lvl80 (in the options), RAWR shows 54.33%
Of course RAWR adds your master shapeshifter.
Again, your RAWR Crit Chance is higher, because RAWR averages the DarkmoonCard: Greatness procc.
Was testing dps on a dummy today, applied FF etc. After a while a friend of mine (moonking) applied imp FF, and both FF's stayed on the dummy. Does this mean that they stack? So you get 2 times 5% armor reduction?
Lol it would end up being something that stupid. Just recently got Black Ice, and totally forgot Druids never had Polearms before the recent patch. That is probably exactly the reason the stats are showing different comparisons..no more staff atm . I appreciate the help and apologize for the seeming stupidity.
I just wanted to say, we don't need to level our weapon skill.
But Duiliath is right - in caster form our weapon skill of course matters. If your's is too low, your crit chance is much lower as well in caster form.
I can see that you don't have any weapon skill of 400 (looking at your achievements), your friend does have them...
@Tcon: No they don't stack. I never paid attention, but I guess this is blizzards solution to the problem when we can't apply feral faerie fire, when imp. FF is up.
Again, my staves are maxed, but just upgraded to a pole-arm and never leveled the skill. Something so simple and gets overlooked, <sigh> i feel like an idiot now. Thanks for the help guys.
I have set up the gemming options to show ArP gems, and they consistently come in a little below Delicates, even though I am at 208 ArP rating. This has bothered me a long time about Rawr, in that everything I read here says I should be stacking ArP gems in place of all my agi gems now, yet Rawr contradicts this. Other than this one topic, Rawr has been fantastic as a guide for gearing out my kitty set, so I am reluctant to disregard it on this topic as well, yet every post I read here says abandon my agi gems now.
I am really confused and would appreciate your feedback. Do I swap out all my agi gems now for Arp? or just stick with what I have. I am really quite pleased with my current dps numbers, having hit 7200 on Thaddius the other night, but if stacking Arp gems will increase it even more, I would do that.
Thanks in advance for your help.
If you decide to gem for ArP, its generally agreed that you should be able to eclipse a static value of ArP--Otherwise, it's better to gem for agility.
Doing a copy-paste from nightcrowlers excellent thread: "At about 350 ArPen with RIP idol and 200 ArPen with Shred idol, ArPen becames a better stats than agility"
However.
Mirroring what Cluey said, rawr and FBN are simulators that assume a "stand and shred" rotation and more often than not, this isn't the case. It really boils down to the external factors of how your guild does a particular fight; what you notice works best for you is how you should gem. Personally, I have an ArP set where I can hit the hardcap with a trinket proc, and an Agility set where I do more than button-mash shred, or where I'm stuck out of range of a boss avoiding an AoE with my Rip/Rake dot's still ticking.
I have tanked for quiet some time with occasional cat dps if it required. And i never had many problems or concerns (due to this sites help)
But yesterday i tanked / dps-ed the first time with an arms warrior by my side since 3.1. And my mangle timer kept being cancelled. At first i thought the add on was failing, but my dps dropped so something was up.
Now i found out that the spell Trauma cancels out our Mangle since patch 3.1.
Does anyone know how serious this can be in terms for dps in cat?
And if there are any disadvantages linked to this for bear form (i assume not, but you never know).
I have tanked for quiet some time with occasional cat dps if it required. And i never had many problems or concerns (due to this sites help)
But yesterday i tanked / dps-ed the first time with an arms warrior by my side since 3.1. And my mangle timer kept being cancelled. At first i thought the add on was failing, but my dps dropped so something was up.
Now i found out that the spell Trauma cancels out our Mangle since patch 3.1.
Does anyone know how serious this can be in terms for dps in cat?
And if there are any disadvantages linked to this for bear form (i assume not, but you never know).
You say your dps dropped. That should not be related to the warrior putting up Trauma. It creates the same bleed debuff our mangle does, so no drop in dps should be the result, unless you're wasting your energy constantly trying to reaplly mangle over and over, thereby not shredding as much as you would normally if you were not trying to reapply mangle. Guaranteed, if you just let the warrior apply trauma, you'll be fine, with an increase in dps.
As for bear form, somewhat the same thing, you don't have to keep up mangle, saving your rage for other attacks.
I have tanked for quiet some time with occasional cat dps if it required. And i never had many problems or concerns (due to this sites help)
But yesterday i tanked / dps-ed the first time with an arms warrior by my side since 3.1. And my mangle timer kept being cancelled. At first i thought the add on was failing, but my dps dropped so something was up.
Now i found out that the spell Trauma cancels out our Mangle since patch 3.1.
Does anyone know how serious this can be in terms for dps in cat?
And if there are any disadvantages linked to this for bear form (i assume not, but you never know).
To elaborate slightly on the above poster, Trauma and Mangle give the same effect of equal magnitude and therefor will overwrite each other . The only difference is that the Arms Warrior applies Trauma passively simply by attacking a target, while we need to use Mangle to apply the Mangle debuff. In the presence of an Arms Warrior (or a Feral tank on your target) you should omit Mangle from your rotation completely - is does less damage per point of energy then Shred and applying the debuff is unnecessary in this situation. An Arms Warrior to apply trauma means a fairly significant increase in damage output for us.
NI Increases your spell power, iLotP doesn't scale with spell power. Aside from that, it specifically says it only increases the healing done to you, not by you, so A.
First :
Nurturing Instinct,doesn't increase your spell power ,
Nurturing Instinct (Rank 1)
Increases your healing spells by up to 35% of your Agility.
there is nothing about spell power.
Second :
And About Improved Leader of the Pack(Rank 1)
Your Leader of the Pack ability also causes affected targets to heal themselves for 2% of their total health.
So the healing from iLotP is based on your total health.
Actualy, Nurturing Instincts DOES increase your spell power, but only for healing spells. You can even see your spell power gained from agility in character sheet.
"Actualy, Nurturing Instincts DOES increase your spell power, but only for healing spells"
But i think you mean NI increase your Bonus healing based on your agility ,becouse spell power include dmg + heal.
But i think you mean NI increase your Bonus healing based on your agility ,becouse spell power include dmg + heal.
Nope, I really meant spell power and not bonus healing - the bonus to healing spells you get is calculated based on this spell power and is higher than 70% of agility. However, the spell power you get from this talent is only used for healing spells. You can test it yourself.
Searched this forum for a few hours but didn't find a better solution than what I figured out myself for XT hardmode first heart phase (we have some people in raid pulling about 4k dps and our raid comps are rarely optimal with regards to specs/debuffs, so I'm trying to make up for it):
1. do good dps before the first heart phase to help us beat the enrage timer (best yet was wipe at .8% a while into the enrage) but still make sure to have 5cp and full energy bar right before first heart
2. get FFF up asap unless there's boomkin in raid
3. Mangle unless it or Trauma is up already
4. Berserk
5. Speed Potion
6. Normal rotation, i.e. keep Rake/Rip up and get some FB's in (I use FaceMauler to help me with this part, though I'm unsure of the exact settings I should have)
7. if heart phase is about to end and dots might get you into hard mode anyway ...AND you have > 2(?) CP's up that are about to go to waste, FB?
8. anyone care to argue that even with a raid that's just barely getting the encounter into hard mode (we're talking "No, we didn't kill the heart in time - Oh wait no the dots took care of it") - that I should NOT Berserk during the Heroism that's obviously going to be popped on the Heart phase? I - along with most people I've seen on here describe feral dps algorithms on hard mode Heart phase - still think that the loss of efficiency that is Berserk+Heroism is outweighed by the imperative to get max burst in during a very small time-window. My theory would be that once a raidgroup is comfortably killing the heart every time Berserk would be better held for non-Heroism time, i.e. popped as normal asap, then whenever CD is up.
Anyone care to point me to a post from someone more knowledgeable than myself?
06/19/09, 1:32 PM
,becouse spell power include dmg + heal.
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