76% (24% from glancing) if you are hit/exp capped.
or anything between:
61.5%-76% depending on your exp and hit.
Also remember that we have a -4.8% crit suppression on bosses so the effective sheet value is between 66.3% and 80.8%.
I am intrigued. What's the formula for that? Basically how do I find out where I land, if I am short of the exp or hit cap? (I'm not, I'm just wondering.. I can't seem to get rid of enough hit to not overcap)
I am intrigued. What's the formula for that? Basically how do I find out where I land, if I am short of the exp or hit cap? (I'm not, I'm just wondering.. I can't seem to get rid of enough hit to not overcap)
Maybe I'm not understanding your question properly, but here's what I think Nightcrowler was saying:
* 24% chance for glancing blow
* 8% chance for miss
* 6.5% chance to be dodged
(assuming that you can't be parried or blocked because you are attacking from the back).
This gives you a 61.5% chance for a hit. So the "crit cap" in this case is 61.5% (will show on your paper doll as 66.3% chance to crit). Now, you can remove all 8% of the chance to miss (by hit capping) and all 6.5% of the chance to be dodged (by expertise capping), which will leave you with 76% chance to hit. So the crit cap in that case would be 76% (80.8% on the paper doll). As far as the incremental values between 61.5% and 76% -- just apply the normal hit and expertise formulas.
Many threads never updated the correct ArP value in the main post, it's 12.31623993 = 1% currently, with a potential change to 13.99572719 as of 3.2.2 (based on the current PTR). The 15.39~ is the old value
As usual, please let me know if you notice any mistakes - I must have mucked up the editing here with the previous 25% ArPen increase as the versions I keep at Allakhazam and Emmeralds both had the change included.
I'm trying to make a simple spreadsheet to calculate how much buffed HP I have:
Formula Looks something like
TOTAL_HP = (total_stamina)*1.1(HotW)*1.06(SotF)*1.02(IMotW)*1.1(Kings)*1.25(Bear)*10(HP/sta) + (HP_modifiers)
Total Stamina includes:
IMotW = 52
IFort = 214
Gear+base = 2560 (from character tab unbuffed in human form)
HP Modifiers include:
Commanding shout or Blood Pack
Flask
My numbers come out to be about 3K less then what I've actually seen. I am putting in 2826 for total_stamina and 0 for HP_modifiers getting 46214 HP, I believe unflasked I've seen 51K+.
Am I completely wrong at my approach? Am I forgetting something stupid like a buff or base HP naked is not included in character sheet?
night Elf
8277 HP naked human
8677 HP naked in bear
Assuming there is 2 components to my health points, x= some health that is not affected by dire bear form (an offset), and y= some health that gets 1.375 bonus from bear+HotW (1.1*1.25)
x+y = 8277
x+y*1.375 = 8677
y = 1066.667
wowwiki suggests first 20 stamina yeilds 20 HP
in that case
20+(z-20)*1.06*1.02*10 = 1067
z=97 base stamina
but if wowwiki is wrong
z*10*1.06*1.02=1067
z=99 base stamina
Looking at the character sheet
I have 104 stamina in human form, which is close enough to 97*1.06*1.02 for me to believe wowwiki is right.
I have 131+13 stamina in bear form (note 104*1.25 is 130, and +13 from HotW talent active in bear form only)
That means I have 7210 health offset that is modified by nothing?
Calculating a final HP in human form then should look like 7210 + 20 + (stamina-20)*1.06*1.02*10
Calculating a final HP in bear form then should look like 7210 + 20 + (stamina-20)*1.06*1.02*1.1*1.25*10
My stamina in a high stamina set is 2560
HP_human = 32837 <--> calculated = 34692
HP_bear = 42447 <--> calculated = 44990
Any help finding my logical error is greatly appreciated!
Nothing I have seen so far has implied that any of our numbers are changing. If people hear otherwise, can they post details here in case I miss anything.
Could it be that there is no more 50% bonus on Beer-Swipe? Or is my Theorycrafting-Fu so weak that I got hysterical and lost some basic and massive changes to the threat generation system?
Interesting. And no, there's nothing there that is wrong. Swipe scales precisely by damage and nothing else, and it's 2.07*1.5 (or it was).
That would explain some fairly weak findings. I'd go ahead and report it. I'll try and test it too and see if I can repro.
ETA: I went and tested it in my bear and cat specs, using Omen as the threat analysis. I didn't find what you found. My average swipe damage was around 650, and my average threat was spot on the expected value of ~2k at that level of damage. Crits didn't seem to change this either. Nor did multiple enemies.
Either Omen's wrong or the way you got the information is wrong.
I am trying to make a spreadsheet for druid tanks, which can calculate raid buffed stats from the armory information (basically unbuffed and in human-form). I am struggeling to get numbers to match the character sheet however, by several percent.
Armor from extra armor (armor above the base armor value of a slot) is not multiplied by anything, nor is armor from agility (to find base armor, just look at the armor on caster gear in the same slot with the same ilevel). The various armor bonuses (bear form, thick hide, metagem) are multiplicative. You might try getting the armor right for caster form first, just to remove one factor (the bear form multiplier,) and you can not use the metagem to remove another.
The character sheet dodge is post-dr.
If you want accurate base stats (that is, without talents), you might need to retrain to get a good snapshot. The affects of talents are added right in.
Simple math and the character sheet. Try different agi, check the dodge, and see if it scales linearly or not. Pre-dr, it's linear, post-dr, it's not (that's what dr was put in to do). Three data points is all you need (following in caster form with no def or dodge rating):
Taking the first two, we get 54.81 agi per 1% dodge. The second two, 72.44 agi per 1% dodge. It's not linear, so it's post-dr. (And as an added check, it's increasing in amount of per % dodge the more agi you get.)
About testing [Item not found!] - I would like to suggest following method:
Install Recount and/or World of Logs, any further suggestions for measurement?
Unequip any item that offers you a proc. Being Hit-capped helps as well, stacking as much Expertise as possible helps against RNG well? Equipping less of Agi or Crit helps against RNG as well. Furthermore the less AP you stack, the bigger visible impact both enchants have on your total DPS. So it might be best to play nude + a weapon. A more expensive variation would be to socket moonkin/restoration equipment with +hit and +expertise gems.
Find an undead mob that has mass HP but does not hit for too much - I STILL TAKE SUGGESTIONS ON THIS ONE - bring one or two good healers.
Enchant a Feral weapon with [Item not found!]. Adding Predatory Strikes - Spell - World of Warcraft to Massacre results into 132 AP. Socketing one 8 AP in a non weapon socket will even out the difference completely. Both enchant-setups will offer 140 AP IF Scourgebane does not scale with Predatory Strikes. If it does there should be a difference of (140 * 1.2) - 140 = 28 AP that results into different DPS.
Hit that given mob for a few thousand white hits. Maybe do that at midnights where there are no enemies interrupting and there is less chance of server lag.
Enchant the same a Feral weapon with [Item not found!]. Replace the 8 AP gem with a stamina variant.
Extract gathered data.
Hit that given mob for the same amount of white hits again.
Extract gathered data - and compare.
I have not done empirical testing yet. Anything missing, anything wrong? I think Massacre and Scourgebane are both not too expensive to try and find out on some random weapon I have on my bank. How many autohits do you think are required to get a most likely true data representation? One hour of testing would result into around 3600+ autohits.
Edit: Thinking more about this: crit, hit and exp make no difference as we can treat those differently, e.g. ignore those completely. That means without any equipment or healing equipment with more HP (to be healed easier) will give best results, as the little AP of those enchants has a bigger relative impact on a nude character, than on one equipped. Probably easier to do with a healer and a tank though.
If you're going to do this, I suggest you test with rake - it does a fixed amount of damage for a given amount of ap. And, given that, you probably shouldn't need to mess with equipment much - remove any on-proc gear, and test it with and without the weapon equipped.
If you're going to do this, I suggest you test with rake - it does a fixed amount of damage for a given amount of ap. And, given that, you probably shouldn't need to mess with equipment much - remove any on-proc gear, and test it with and without the weapon equipped.
Why would you empirically test the effect of attack power on DPS? Attack power scaling for all attacks is well known from previous theorycrafting and unlike stats like crit and haste, there are no rotation-altering effects or non-linearities to model.
The only thing left to test is, since it's technically a static bonus, whether Pred. Strikes applies to it or not.
Yes. And this is a relevant question as it would give Scourgebane a significant edge over Massacre, which it wouldn't have if Pred. Strikes doesn't affect Scourgebane.
If Pred. Strikes affects Scourgebane, the AP bonus from the enchant will be 168 (184.8) instead of 140 (154). (Values in brackets include Heart of the Wild). With a Rake-coefficient of 0.06 per tick, we have Scourgebane giving 11 (12) more damage if Pred. Strikes affects it and 9 (10) more damage per Rake tick if Pred. Strikes does not affect it. (All values include HotW, numbers in brackets also include Naturalist, Master Shapeshifter not included)
One can enchant a weapon (any weapon) with Scourgebane, Rake an undead mob, note the damage done by the DoT tick, then Rake any non-undead mob and again check Rake-DoT damage. If the difference is 12 (or 13, with MSS), then Predatory Strikes affects Scourgebane.
If both affect Rake ticks, then the resulting Rake DMG per tick difference Undead vs non-Undead mob: 30.8 * 0.18 * 1.1 * 1.04 = 6.342336 DMG.
p.s. Wowhead says the DoT scaling of Rake is AP * 0.18. The AP scaling works against the whole spell not each tick? (3 ticks each 0.06 AP)? If that is the case, with my numbers the difference is rather 30.8 * 0.06 * 1.1 * 1.04 = 2.114112 DMG
Edit 2: NVM now it fits with your calcuations. (if Naturalist doesn't scale Rake ticks, its 30.8 * 0.06 * 1.04 = 1.92192)
08/31/09, 6:50 PM
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