Balance Glyphs - Page 2

Eilt · 11/24/08, 3:55 PM

I am trying outthe following glyphs:
Major
1. Insect Swarm
2. Moonfire
3, Starfire

If IS glyph does not work out I will replace it with the innervate glyph

Minor
1. Undurdened Rebirth
2. Reduced mana on GotW (sometimes we don't have a tree)
3. Reduced CD on dash, I actually use dash a lot if we have to run back some place or to catch up to the raid after skinning

Kaubel · 11/24/08, 5:16 PM

If all you guys are going to do is post what glyphs you plan on taking without any sort of explanation or discussion, I'm going to close the thread.

Believe · 11/24/08, 8:51 PM

Considering that most of our gear now favours spirit over intellect , I believe that Innervate glyph > IS glyph in terms of raid support.On my current level of gear which is mainly 25man I still have mana issues on some fights with 3/3intensity 0 in dreamstate.I have around 1200 mp5 while not casting raidbuffed so I pretty much get around ~14k mana everytime i Innervate a healer.This is enough reason for me to choose the Innervate glyph over IS.
I also find the hit reduce from IS useful on some fights (for example Patchwerk soft enrage;4HM tanking,Malygos spark etc) when combined with Hurricane(50% slower attack speed from hurricane and 3% miss from Insect Swarm).

skeldi · 11/25/08, 2:56 PM

As of currently, mana is not a big issue (with a stacked raid), and I really find the -5% hit from IS to be valuable, what other glyph would provide the most useful raid benefit along with moonfire and starfire glyph?

Alerian · 11/25/08, 3:03 PM

I would use the Innervate glyph. You'll then feel more comfortable with throwing Innervate on someone that was recently Rebirthed or a Mage/Priest that is low on mana. If you're already not having mana issues and you're already casting Innervate on someone else on most boss fights, you can drop some points out of mana talents (first out of Moonglow, then Dreamstate, followed by Intensity and Omen of Clarity - Armory not functional right now, so don't know what you have).

skeldi · 11/25/08, 3:09 PM

Perhaps if mana isn't an issue, I should stack more haste then grab the innervate glyph?

Covale · 11/25/08, 6:32 PM

Is there any opinion on the use of [Glyph of Lifebloom]? Personally, I am a LB whore, and this glyph gave me a wood! However, I'd like to know if anyone has run some numbers using this.

I also don't see a downside from using [Glyph of Innervate] whether soloing or while grouping. Glyphs in general seem to mostly benefit the player. This one has the versatility of being both self and group friendly. Being that glyphs are destroyed when removed, its not likely that we will be swapping them out between PVP, soloing, and raiding.

Ashaera · 11/25/08, 6:47 PM

Originally Posted by Covale

Is there any opinion on the use of [Glyph of Lifebloom]?

You are gonna spend 99% of your time in moonkin form, a huge part of your raid viability comes from your buffs & debuffs - In most fights switching out to heal is a matter of poor strategy & / or bad execution by your healers.
Should you feel the need to shift out, then it's going to be for badly needed emergency healing - Not really a situation lifebloom is fantastic for.

If for some strange reason you dont want [Glyph of Innervate] or [Glyph of Insect Swarm] then theres 3 other semi-decent options :
[Glyph of Wrath] - Lets you take 2/2 imp. Gift of the Wild.
[Glyph of Starfall] - Very low impact on single target dps.
[Glyph of Rebirth] - Very situational.

tarrek · 11/26/08, 8:13 AM

Does anyone know if glyph of insect swarm stacks additively or multiplicatively (sp?) with the two-piece T7 bonus?

Spink · 12/01/08, 1:05 AM

Sorta busy atm but some quick numbers, 2pc (wearing no gloves) 612 per tick, 1 pc (wearing no pants/gloves) 547 per tick. Pants are T7.10 with equivalent of 126.42 spellpower via 65 int(=6.42 spellpower), 85 spellpower and 35 spellpower enchant (casts done in caster form so spirit irrelevant)

Comparitively, taking off wrists which have equivalent of 129.2 spellpower takes per tick to 589.

547*1.1 = 601.7

you do the rest.

edit: oh and I'm using glyph.

edit2:
2pc + glyph tooltip = 2107 nature damage over 14 seconds.
glyph and no 2pc tooltip = 1953-1960 nature damage over 14 seconds.

Erdluf · 12/01/08, 8:34 AM

Originally Posted by Spink

edit2:
2pc + glyph tooltip = 2107 nature damage over 14 seconds.
glyph and no 2pc tooltip = 1953-1960 nature damage over 14 seconds.

That says the 2pc is additive.

mmo says untalented IS is 1290.

Splendor adds a tick: 1290*7/6 = 1505
Glyph adds 30%: 1505*1.3 = 1956.5
Additive 2pc gives: 1505*(1+.3+.1) = 2107

Creepy_inc · 12/14/08, 2:11 PM

Originally Posted by khel

I am using the Starfire, Moonfire, and Innervate glyphs, and I think that these are the best choices for a 25man raid considering the limited debuff slots that we have. IS is not worth a debuff slot imo unless it is applying the -3% hit debuff.

There is no debuff limit anymore, even if the UI can't show it they are still there.

khel · 12/15/08, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by Creepy_inc

There is no debuff limit anymore, even if the UI can't show it they are still there.

I posted that before Blizzard announced the debuff changes, but yes you are correct. With the most challenging encounter in game currently being Sartharion with 3 drakes up, and for the most part dps on the drakes being more important than a -3% physical hit debuff on them or Sartharion, I am changing my 3rd glyph from Innervate to Insect Swarm.

For all other encounters currently, keeping the tank alive through physical damage is trivial, so I feel that I can justify using it for now and also have a bit more fun with the peen-meters as an added bonus.

AlinaSedai · 12/15/08, 1:44 PM

Originally Posted by thedopefishlives

I've heard several Moonkin question whether Glyph of Moonfire is worth it. They see 75% increase and 90% decrease and think, "Doesn't that mean I'm losing more damage than I'm gaining?" The thing with Moonfire is, the DoT is _more damage_ than the initial blast. Overall, it is a net increase in Moonfire damage, even when not boosted by the Starfire glyph.

To be honets, it really depends on your cycle, and how you use moonfire. If you are one that uses MF in your cycle, and if you have the starfire glyph and your cycle is dependent on SF then its an amazing glyph. If you are like me, and you rarely use moonfire besides an initial blow, or a finishing blow, then its pretty useless.
Also the fact that you cannot switch glyphs with ease, having this glyph and pvping causes a lot of difficulties. How often do you actually use Moonfire as a DoT in pvp? rarly, but its used to finish off a running healer pretty often!

So yes its an amazing glyph for a starfire based cycle, but for a wrath based cycle its not so amazing.

Erdluf · 12/15/08, 3:05 PM

The value of the MF glyph depends on how many ticks you get. On a Boss you should be getting at least five, but on trash (and in PvP), you might average considerably less.

At 50% MF crit (with CSD), fully talented, this shows the extra damage/cast you get from the Glyph, as a function of the number of DoT ticks. Third column assumes target has 10% resil (22% less crit damage, 10% less DoT damage).

Extra damage/cast from MF Glyph

Ticks	Glyph	10% Resil
0	-1247	-1149
1	-830	-749
2	-412	-350
3	6	50
4	423	449
5	841	848
6	1258	1248
7	1676	1647
8	2094	2047

At lower gear levels (say 1500 +spell), you need to average slightly more than three ticks for the Glyph to come out ahead.