Moonkin Raiding - Page 52

timmytomma · 05/18/09, 11:04 AM

16 int is so minimal to your mana that it wouldnt make a difference anyway. Also, you shouldnt be having mana issues and tbh the mp5 enchants and gems wouldnt really help that much. Use a mana pot if you have to, dont sac your dps for minimal things like 16 int or some mp5.

phoebelia · 05/18/09, 4:25 PM

I just picked [Icecore Staff] and was wondering about the gemming of it in regards to the change to spirit>sp conversion. Epically since this item is getting a major buff next patch.

Basically i have 3 options for gemming this staff:

1. [Design: Purified Twilight Opal] [Item not found!] and getting the socket bonus this option provides 35(19+9+7) spellpower + 2.64 ((8*1.1[kings])*.3) (not sure if spellpower would be rounded up here or not i would love to get some clarification on this if anyone knows for sure or not)

2. 2* [Item not found!] which would be 38 spell power

and since i'm a jc
3. 1 [Item not found!] and 1 [Item not found!]

In all honesty i'm leaning away from option 3 as that would free up a dragon's eye for another blue socket bonus like t8 gloves where i feel the gem would b more valuable

Edit: I noticed the [Sash of Ancient Power] has the same socket bonus so boiling it down to a simple question is a socket bonus of 7 sp enough to warrant using a [Design: Purified Twilight Opal] to get the bonus if the other socket is red?

klüger · 05/18/09, 4:56 PM

Originally Posted by phoebelia

I just picked [Icecore Staff] and was wondering about the gemming of it in regards to the change to spirit>sp conversion. Epically since this item is getting a major buff next patch.

Basically i have 3 options for gemming this staff:

1. [Design: Purified Twilight Opal] [Item not found!] and getting the socket bonus this option provides 35(19+9+7) spellpower + 2.64 ((8*1.1[kings])*.3) (not sure if spellpower would be rounded up here or not i would love to get some clarification on this if anyone knows for sure or not)

2. 2* [Item not found!] which would be 38 spell power

and since i'm a jc
3. 1 [Item not found!] and 1 [Item not found!]

In all honesty i'm leaning away from option 3 as that would free up a dragon's eye for another blue socket bonus like t8 gloves where i feel the gem would b more valuable

A quick almost-answer here:

I'm personally trying to push my Rde's on slots with the most valuable socket-bonii. +7sp would be one of these.

Humbaba · 05/18/09, 5:07 PM

Originally Posted by phoebelia

I just picked [Icecore Staff] and was wondering about the gemming of it in regards to the change to spirit>sp conversion. Epically since this item is getting a major buff next patch.

Basically i have 3 options for gemming this staff:

1. [Design: Purified Twilight Opal] [Item not found!] and getting the socket bonus this option provides 35(19+9+7) spellpower + 2.64 ((8*1.1[kings])*.3) (not sure if spellpower would be rounded up here or not i would love to get some clarification on this if anyone knows for sure or not)

2. 2* [Item not found!] which would be 38 spell power

and since i'm a jc
3. 1 [Item not found!] and 1 [Item not found!]

In all honesty i'm leaning away from option 3 as that would free up a dragon's eye for another blue socket bonus like t8 gloves where i feel the gem would b more valuable

Edit: I noticed the [Sash of Ancient Power] has the same socket bonus so boiling it down to a simple question is a socket bonus of 7 sp enough to warrant using a [Design: Purified Twilight Opal] to get the bonus if the other socket is red?

Really, you need to ask this? If you're a JC you use your prismatics wherever you get the best socket bonus. 7 sp is as good as it gets.

Selini · 05/18/09, 5:34 PM

Hodir hard mode seems to have me confused gear wise.

I'm in 2 minds whether to go for all out crit and dribble in moonbeams and dps it down but some say use normal gear and hug fires and wait for the storm cloud buff.

Any advice from moonkins that have done it on 25 man?

spiritryu · 05/18/09, 5:39 PM

Originally Posted by Selini

Hodir hard mode seems to have me confused gear wise.

I'm in 2 minds whether to go for all out crit and dribble in moonbeams and dps it down but some say use normal gear and hug fires and wait for the storm cloud buff.

Any advice from moonkins that have done it on 25 man?

For Hodir Hard mode, you really should take what you can get(in terms of buffs), with your priority being near the fires. If there's a moonbeam near the fire, get in it. If there's someone with a storm cloud nearby, hug them real quick and then continue dpsing. From what I've tried, I've just stayed in normal gear(mostly because I don't have enough crit gear to use) and have done fine with that. Also if you're chugging consumeables, consider Potion of Wild Magic when you get the storm cloud buff. It's mostly about getting lucky with what buffs you get.

Poromu · 05/18/09, 5:42 PM

It's pretty easy to hit 10-15k dps on Hodir using any gear set, the dps you output on Hodir is affected by the encounter moreso than gear setup. I use my normal gear set and just try to stack buffs.

If I see a fire noone's on I go near it to stack the debuff on Hodir, if I have the Storm Cloud buff I spread it to others, if I have just gotten it spread to me, I find a moonbeam and spam SF.

Will Crit/SP stacking yeild the most if you have all the buffs from the encounter, yes, probably. If you're unfortunate to not get all the buffs, will you limit yourself by stacking crit, yes. I think it's best just to wear your normal gear and make some sort of attempt to stack the buffs.

Lord BEEF · 05/18/09, 5:57 PM

I haven't run the math but crit is huge for Hodir obviously, and if you have too much haste your starfires will go under 1 sec cast time under the moonlight and you'll be clipping the GCD. If you can swap enough haste for crit to get just above 1 second I would think that would be ideal.

DecideYa · 05/18/09, 6:32 PM

Originally Posted by Poromu

It's pretty easy to hit 10-15k dps on Hodir using any gear set [...]

My dps got pushed down by the amount of movement time caused by our tactic. Please PM me about your guild's.

Selini · 05/18/09, 6:34 PM

Do you make it a point to hug the moonbeams though or just stay near a fire and hope for storm cloud? Thats the main issue I can't figure out, I know the haste would be godly for the starfire spamming but I know that if you were to move way too much chasing them you're wasting alot of dps time.

DecideYa · 05/18/09, 6:36 PM

Originally Posted by Arawethion

Let's say you want a DPS gain of 3% for 3 talent points (pretty typical rule of thumb for DPS talents). With a 10% buff, that means you need 30% uptime to be viable. With a 10 second duration, even ignoring overlaps, you'd need 3 procs every 100 seconds. At a 15% chance to proc, you need to be hit every 5 seconds for this to work. Pretty much no boss encounter has unavoidable things hitting you that frequently.

Do you think 3/3 Owlkin Frenzy is worth 2 points in ImpIS?

Bolverick · 05/18/09, 8:55 PM

so far by switching to briiliant spellthread, dropping dreamstate. Then putting those points in improved insect swarm as well as the insect swarm glyph. Then trying out different main hand off hand combos I've been able to up my dps to the point my guildies were in shock at the amount of increase. hopefully with some more gear and tweaks I will continue to shock em.

• Hamlet · 05/18/09, 9:45 PM

Originally Posted by Bolverick

so far by switchinmg to briiliant spellthread. dropping dreamstate and putting those points in improved insect swarm as well as the insect swarm glyph and trying out different main hand off hand combos I've been able to up mu dps to the point my guildies were in shock at the amount of increase. hopefully with some more gear and tweaks I will continue to shock em

Not bad. Those were the major issues. For a few further tweaks to your setup:
--Move 2 points into Celestial Focus. It's a better DPS increase than IIS. Take from any of IIS, Gale Winds, or Intensity, depending on your AoE/mana needs.
--Replace 28 spellpower on gloves with Hyperspeed Accelerators (best glove enchant, though engineering is still a subpar profession for DPS).
--Replace MP5/HP5 on boots with some variety of runspeed.
--Replace 30sp/8MP5 on hat with 30sp/20crit.
--Replace 24sp/6MP5 on shoulders with 24sp/15crit.
--Replace 9sp/3MP5 gem in pants with 9sp/8spi. (19sp would be best since you don't need the socket bonus, bit you have no other way of meeting your meta right now).
--Replace 50sp on weapon with 63sp if you're willing to spend the money.

Though none of these are losing huge chunks of DPS, it sometimes feels nice to have your setup totally optimized. From there, you can focus on your rotation. Make sure to read the Beginner Guide post: http://elitistjerks.com/f73/t59457-m...dated_3_1_2_a/ .

• Hamlet · 05/19/09, 12:13 AM

Does Idol of the Crying Wind add to base damage or spellpower? Or, can some who has it test quick? Toss IS on a target dummy naked (only the idol), out of form, and post how much it does. Assuming you have Glyph of IS, Earth&Moon, and Lunar Guidance, it should do either 375 or 392 (292 without the idol).

(I know the tooltip says spellpower, but so does the Starfire one, and that adds to base damage)

Starfox · 05/19/09, 3:25 AM

Originally Posted by Arawethion

Does Idol of the Crying Wind add to base damage or spellpower? Or, can some who has it test quick? Toss IS on a target dummy naked (only the idol), out of form, and post how much it does. Assuming you have Glyph of IS, Earth&Moon, and Lunar Guidance, it should do either 375 or 392 (292 without the idol).

(I know the tooltip says spellpower, but so does the Starfire one, and that adds to base damage)

292-293 w/o, naked
392-393 only idol, rest naked

Takkenboom · 05/19/09, 3:28 AM

Nightsong Garb 4-Piece Set Bonus: Chance for Insect Swarm to trigger an instant Starfire changed to 15%.

That is what is says in the patch notes from MMO. Do i dare to belive they fixed it?

Lilija · 05/19/09, 3:32 AM

Originally Posted by Takkenboom

That is what is says in the patch notes from MMO. Do i dare to belive they fixed it?

On PTR it's still as it was

• Hamlet · 05/19/09, 4:07 AM

Originally Posted by Starfox

292-293 w/o, naked
392-393 only idol, rest naked

Thanks.

Originally Posted by Takkenboom

That is what is says in the patch notes from MMO. Do i dare to belive they fixed it?

There's still the larger problem of the proc being useless if it procs mid-Starfire cast.

Takkenboom · 05/19/09, 9:37 AM

Mmm, i am slightly confused now. I don't know any other bug than that. That if it procs while casting a SF, the proc gets consumed at the end of the cast.

So if they mention the set bonus in the patch notes but not fixing the problem above. What did they fix then? Was the proc chance lower before?

Selini · 05/19/09, 9:42 AM

Proc chance was 5%

• Hamlet · 05/19/09, 6:15 PM

Ok, I've put in a whole bunch of time modeling Eclipse/DoT rotations over the past few days. Current findings are basically contained in my modified version of WrathCalcs, posted here: WrathCalcs - Moonkin DPS Spreadsheet .

Most importantly, I seem to be finding that constant DoT refreshing, regardless of the Eclipse cycle, provides better DPS than the currently accepted DoT behavior of only refreshing during the Eclipse ICD. I have a hunch that better yet still would be refreshing at all times except during the final X seconds of Eclipse, but this is tricky to model well.

In any case, I think we may have been somewhat underemphasizing high DoT uptime in lieu of complete Eclipse maximization. Tinker with the sheet with your current setup and give any feedback. I'm going to work on trying to model the more detailed cycles soon.

spiritryu · 05/19/09, 11:01 PM

Oh joy!

Rest assured fellow moonkin! The issue has been acknowledge on the euro forums:

Q u o t e:
There is a known issue with Elune's Wrath which is being actively worked on for correction in a forthcoming update, however thanks a lot for letting us know!

World of Warcraft (en) Forums ->

Apparently I'm months behind and this was posted about a month ago....

Shinagami091 · 05/20/09, 12:28 AM

They did indeed increase the proc chance of 4t8. It would make sense that while they did that they fixed the bug rendering this 4pc useless. Can anyone confirm? I dont have 4pc yet so I can't find out for myself.

spiritryu · 05/20/09, 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by Shinagami091

They did indeed increase the proc chance of 4t8. It would make sense that while they did that they fixed the bug rendering this 4pc useless. Can anyone confirm? I dont have 4pc yet so I can't find out for myself.

They definitely have not fixed it yet.

Gudder · 05/20/09, 5:04 AM

What exactly would you guys say is BiS right now pre-hard modes??

And is it worth to keep 2pc T7.5 anymore?