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03/30/09, 12:39 PM
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#781
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Druid
Frostmane
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Originally Posted by taric1
I'm currently running moonkin form but am struggling to get above 1.6k dps on a rotation of f.fire, insect swarm, moonfire, wrath till eclipse proc then starfire. Where am i going wrong? I'm running this spec
World of Warcraft Europe -> Talents
and gemmed up with hit gems so my hit rating is 276 and my crit is 22.1% buffed with gift of the wild
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For starters, a lot of your gear appears to be unenchanted. Just enchanting your gear can make a difference.
What glyphs are you running?
Are you taking advantage of the on-use spell power increase of your Hit trinket? This will increase your dps.
Are you using Starfall/Trees? These will increase your dps.
Your haste is also rather low. I'd consider trading some crit for haste if possible.
Are you also casting Starfire as your filler until Eclipse is ready again?
Casting Faerie Fire? If you have a Shadow Priest and Feral Druid in your raid, you don't need to cast this. You'll get the +hit from the Priest, melee will get the armor reduction from the Feral, and you'll still get the crit from the Feral's FFF.
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03/30/09, 1:54 PM
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#782
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Druid
Bronze Dragonflight (EU)
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Hi all. Firstly i would like to thank all of you massively knowledgable people here at Elitistjerks, simple from reading what you lot have said has helped me increase my dps alot. Iv Changed my Rotation, Spec, and made sure i have 4/5 T7 for the set bonus, all the major things i need. Despite all this i cannot break 4.1k dps on patchwerk. 4.1k was my highest DPS, Yet i seem to average around the 3.9k mark. I see people on here getting well over 5k dps, and was wondering if there was something wrong with my spec or gear. I hate posting to ask for help and stuff, because im sure if i read over these threads again i could find the answers, but im afraid i am asking if anyone could help me out? Any tweak in gear, spec, rotation Glyphs...anything. Im tired of coming 2nd dps to a warlock.
Im currently using Moonfire, IS, Wrath til eclipse, SF til end eclipse, MF, IS, SF til eclipse CD.
And my glyphs are Moonfire, Starfire and Insect Swarm.
Please help.
Also, id like to give an individual Thank you to Adorielle for Squawk and Awe, its the best addon iv used ever.
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03/30/09, 3:56 PM
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#783
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Piston Honda
Night Elf Druid
Ravencrest (EU)
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Originally Posted by Orthon
Hi all. Firstly i would like to thank all of you massively knowledgable people here at Elitistjerks, simple from reading what you lot have said has helped me increase my dps alot. Iv Changed my Rotation, Spec, and made sure i have 4/5 T7 for the set bonus, all the major things i need. Despite all this i cannot break 4.1k dps on patchwerk. 4.1k was my highest DPS, Yet i seem to average around the 3.9k mark. I see people on here getting well over 5k dps, and was wondering if there was something wrong with my spec or gear. I hate posting to ask for help and stuff, because im sure if i read over these threads again i could find the answers, but im afraid i am asking if anyone could help me out? Any tweak in gear, spec, rotation Glyphs...anything. Im tired of coming 2nd dps to a warlock.
Im currently using Moonfire, IS, Wrath til eclipse, SF til end eclipse, MF, IS, SF til eclipse CD.
And my glyphs are Moonfire, Starfire and Insect Swarm.
Please help.
Also, id like to give an individual Thank you to Adorielle for Squawk and Awe, its the best addon iv used ever.
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Get CF, drop dreamstate first, then for spare points drop intens. get natures splendor. Starfall is nice too, but not worth very much on patch.
Get your hit rating up
other then that just get more gear and be nazi on your rotation. IS-MF-W->eclipse-SF till 4-5secs left on icd-refresh dots-W->eclipse.
I do it like that atleast. Use potion of speed during eclipse+hero.
Treants just before hero
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03/30/09, 6:57 PM
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#784
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Druid
Bloodhoof (EU)
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Originally Posted by Latas
....Another problem i see is, if you are going to put points into a talent for mana regen, the order has been established of OoC>Intensity>Dreamstate>Moonglow.
....Also the 2 points in Genesis would be better spent in Imp Moonfire. ...
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Originally Posted by Lord BEEF
That's the correct order for the power of the mana regeneration talents, but not really for the order you should spec in them.
Omen is a given in any build in my opinion. From there, moonglow is the next best option because improved moonfire is only worth about half a percent of your damage per talent point.
Basically giving up improved moonfire for moonglow is a better tradeoff than giving up improved insect swarm or celestial focus or whatever for intensity.
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I do not fully agree with the view that it is a better choice to put talent points into moonglow instead of imp MF or to circumvent genesis talent. I however believe that there is no need to have a single point in Moonglow.
Rationale:
I have in raid situations (i.e. naxx25) mana excess (might change in 3.1) with having 1/1 OOC and 1/3 intensity. I think this is true for many PVE moonkins.
Consequence:
Any further TP in mana regen decreases relatively your DPS.
I therefore transferred 1 TP from Moonglow to Genesis (necessary to meet the requirement to reach the next talent tier)
I have 2/2 in ImpMF.
I also put only 1 TP in Natures Reach because I have no threat problems (thx to our tanks!  ) and freed in this way another TP that I put in Gale wind.
Here is my spec for reference:
WorldofWarcraft.com -> Info -> Classes -> Druid -> Talent Calculator
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03/30/09, 7:30 PM
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#785
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Piston Honda
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If you're fine with 1 pt in intensity you'd also be fine with the 3 points in moonglow and no intensity. So the question is whether you'd prefer to have imp MF and the point in genesis or one point anywhere in the tree. Someone else may go off about the nature's reach point for the extra range, but for my part I'd just take typhoon if you really don't want the range. It's not trivial to use on a lot of movement fights, but I bet it comes out superior to iMF and genesis and has the added boost of being a smaller scale ae that you can blow once on something like maexxna spiders where rolling up a hurricane is not effective.
For my part, I have the nature's reach point. I tried raiding with 1 quite a while back and got in trouble from time to time, my tanks threat has gone up a lot more than my dps since then though, I'm just not sure about giving up the range.
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03/30/09, 7:42 PM
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#786
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Von Kaiser
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Well, it seems to me that if he's running 1.6k DPS, unless he's 3-4k DPS behind everyone else, his guild's progression might not be doing the massive DPS yet. The problem with that is, the slower the kill, the more the mana drain. Our guild does about 45k DPS in Naxx and about 78k DPS on Patch, which is lower than a number of guilds I have seen. I actually do have mana problems on a couple of fights in Naxx still, so I still have mana talents. This might change in Ulduar, especially if there is less AoE in general there.
You can check out my spec, which appears to be identical to Kluger's except for 3/3 Moonglow over 2/3 iMF. It's good enough mana regen without sacrificing important damage talents.
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03/31/09, 3:55 AM
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#787
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Glass Joe
Tauren Druid
Spinebreaker
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I know when I run on my laptop (which is fail but hey need wow on the road) I can only get 3k dps outta my boomkin. But when I'm at home I'm back to 5k dps no problem. Laptop 300 lat 7 fps vs computer 150 lat 60 fps. With even this easy rotation lag is very critical. Time wasted on even watching for your ecplise proc is slowed. I mean their are ways to get around it too tho. For instance when wrath crits you see the natures grace buff even before your wrath hits, if i see 2 procs it's safe to start your starfire rotation. But thas just me and this method will be outdated as of 3.1 because it's now a 3s buff. Also i've be thinking about removing the treant point into something more useful, treants were great before as offence in world pvp and such but now with a dual spec, I think I'll be speccing to a pure dps because sadly treant dont add to are overall damage done, and secondly u have the dual spec to make a more pure pvp spec which can easily be switch on the fly. but then again this is just my thinking, and i have seen may boomkin with different ideas so my thinking can too be wrong.
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03/31/09, 4:14 AM
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#788
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Piston Honda
Night Elf Druid
Ravencrest (EU)
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Originally Posted by ixle
I know when I run on my laptop (which is fail but hey need wow on the road) I can only get 3k dps outta my boomkin. But when I'm at home I'm back to 5k dps no problem. Laptop 300 lat 7 fps vs computer 150 lat 60 fps. With even this easy rotation lag is very critical. Time wasted on even watching for your ecplise proc is slowed. I mean their are ways to get around it too tho. For instance when wrath crits you see the natures grace buff even before your wrath hits, if i see 2 procs it's safe to start your starfire rotation. But thas just me and this method will be outdated as of 3.1 because it's now a 3s buff. Also i've be thinking about removing the treant point into something more useful, treants were great before as offence in world pvp and such but now with a dual spec, I think I'll be speccing to a pure dps because sadly treant dont add to are overall damage done, and secondly u have the dual spec to make a more pure pvp spec which can easily be switch on the fly. but then again this is just my thinking, and i have seen may boomkin with different ideas so my thinking can too be wrong.
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It was painful to read your post, but two things:
a) Have you tried the lagfix thing thats floating around?
b) treants are in general worth the talent point.
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03/31/09, 5:16 AM
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#789
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Glass Joe
Blood Elf Mage
Balnazzar (EU)
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@ Taric: Apart from the problems already stated with your spec, which are easily fixed, there are a few things you can do with your gear.
First of all, barely any of it is enchanted. Do yourself and your raid a favour and do some daily quests so you can afford to enchant them. If nothing else your weapon absolutely should have a minimum of +50 Spellpower. You're currently running at 280 Spell Hit. Putting Icewalker on your boots would put you 29 OVER the cap, allowing you to remove the poorly itemised +20 Spell Hit enchant on your gloves in favour of +28 Spellpower. You'd also be able to put a Veiled Noble Topaz in your legs, gaining additional Spellpower and Haste. Don't chase poor socket bonuses - put +19 Spellpower gem in those boots.
None of this is terribly expensive - maybe take a night off raiding and run some dailies? Remember, Spell Hit (til cap of 263) > Spellpower > Spell Haste > Spell Crit.
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03/31/09, 1:17 PM
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#791
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Piston Honda
Night Elf Druid
Bloodhoof
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Originally Posted by Nrahk
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Yes we lost a lot of crit, but remember that not every moonkin is allowed to roll on cloth gear. Some are still living in the past where moonkins are forced to drink from the "leather" only water fountains and cling to hopes that all the other clothies get a cloth piece before they are even allowed to bid.
So the hit is very welcome to a lot of moonkins. However, trading crit for spirit is not so welcome, and lackluster 4pc t8 means we still may try and find those last few cloth pieces that do not have spirit on them for max DPS. However, the shammies did get their tier gear changed, so there could be a chance. For now it is a waiting game to see what happens before 3.1 is put on live.
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03/31/09, 1:22 PM
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#792
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Don Flamenco
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Originally Posted by Eilt
Yes we lost a lot of crit, but remember that not every moonkin is allowed to roll on cloth gear. Some are still living in the past where moonkins are forced to drink from the "leather" only water fountains and cling to hopes that all the other clothies get a cloth piece before they are even allowed to bid.
So the hit is very welcome to a lot of moonkins. However, trading crit for spirit is not so welcome, and lackluster 4pc t8 means we still may try and find those last few cloth pieces that do not have spirit on them for max DPS. However, the shammies did get their tier gear changed, so there could be a chance. For now it is a waiting game to see what happens before 3.1 is put on live.
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Looking at the gear lists currently available - which is only a small subset of the total gear list, I'm sure - it appears that most of the "best-in-slot" stuff will fill in that crit gap, but mostly through cloth non-spirit-itemized pieces. If you don't have the option of rolling on cloth, let alone the "good" cloth that all the mages and warlocks are drooling over, you will probably lose a not-insignificant amount of crit.
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03/31/09, 1:30 PM
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#793
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Moonwhisper
I do not fully agree with the view that it is a better choice to put talent points into moonglow instead of imp MF or to circumvent genesis talent. I however believe that there is no need to have a single point in Moonglow.
Rationale:
I have in raid situations (i.e. naxx25) mana excess (might change in 3.1) with having 1/1 OOC and 1/3 intensity. I think this is true for many PVE moonkins.
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Naxx 25 =/= Sarth 3D.... and from the looks of things, many fights in Ulduar will be close to the length of Sarth 3D rather than the joke that is Naxx 25. With less crit bonus in 3.1, and the BoW/mana totem not stacking, and the innervate nerf, it might be necessary to pick up a little something extra. I know I'm often close to going OOM on sarth 3D, and sometimes do go OOM depending on the dynamics of the fight (how many raid members die, if i have to BR or heal myself real quick, etc). I would ideally like to pick up 2/3 intensity, but would 3/3 moonglow instead of IM provide that little bit I'm missing? I need to keep IFF b/c of no SP, but I guess I could give up gale winds and lose all of that aoe (but is there a lot of aoe on boss fights in Ulduar?). Just some thoughts... any input would be appreciated.
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03/31/09, 4:11 PM
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#794
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Druid
Frostmane
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Originally Posted by Nrahk
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What you'll end up doing is focusing on gear outside the Tier 8 gear with haste/crit. Many Druids used a hit trinket, cloak, rings, neck, etc. to get a fair amount of +hit so the change will be helpful to them. It will also allow changing out hit gems for other things such as spell power, spell/haste or possibly pure haste if you feel your haste is too low.
That said, I do find it odd, but these aren't final numbers.
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04/01/09, 1:45 AM
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#795
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Glass Joe
Tauren Druid
Nazjatar (EU)
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Solar- /Lunar Eclipse
I perfer the Lunar because: - SF Idol has higher itemlvl
3 extra ticks from MF Glyph, are often lost when 1st SF crits on a Solar-Rota
crazy bloodlust timing
two of these maybe outdated with 3.1.
Moonkin need some extra bonus from spirit, maybe T9 setbonus:
Your Innervate also increases spellpower equal to spirit.
At the moment I try to reapply MF whenever it is off, IS when Eclipse is on cd.
How do you manage your DOT uptime? Reapply only when Eclipse is on hidden cd (and hope it is up 100% during the next Eclipse), or when dot falls off? How does, with the 4T8, IS-uptime fit in here?
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