Moonkin Raiding - Page 99

hevonlee · 06/03/09, 6:03 PM

Originally Posted by Eranicus

lol, my 4p bonus is bugged. If it procs while casting a SF, it shoots off 2 SF'es when the cast lands, no extra gcd ;P

It has done this for me also but not every time.

Altiris · 06/03/09, 8:00 PM

That's not a bug. The second SF is instant, which then triggers a GCD after it is cast, like any other instant cast spell.

• Hamlet · 06/03/09, 9:34 PM

Originally Posted by Altiris

That's not a bug. The second SF is instant, which then triggers a GCD after it is cast, like any other instant cast spell.

Right. People seem oddly mystified by the two simultaneous SF's, which I don't get. That part we knew was going to happen; it's precisely the change we nagged Blizzard about so much. I think people are just being confused.

Alerian · 06/04/09, 1:28 AM

I've recorded the 4T8 proc in case someone wants to see how the GCD works in action. It basically operates the same way as an instant and is queueable while you're casting your current spell.

Here's the video: YouTube - Moonkin 4T8.

EDIT: For clarity, the below post is accurate.

Xerophyte · 06/04/09, 1:53 AM

Originally Posted by Alerian

I've recorded the 4T8 proc in case someone wants to see how the GCD works in action. It basically operates the same way as an instant, except you don't have to actually push an "Instant SF" key.

I'm not sure if I'm interpreting you right here, but you seem to be implying that the new 4T8 is somehow automatic and activates without keypresses. What's happening is that while DPSing you're mashing your SFire key like loon -- similar to most of us, I imagine -- and in this modern age that queues up a new cast to start once your current one finishes. Since you got a proc that new cast is instant, but you certainly pushed an "Instant SF" key to trigger it. It's just the same as your usual SF key.

That might well have been what you meant, but there seems to be a strange amount of misconception floating around on this one so I figured clarity would be good.

Moonkin Kai · 06/04/09, 6:58 AM

Okay, so, I got the Gloves of the Frozen Glade, but the problem is, in order to fit them in, I'm gonna end up losing quite a bit of haste, enough to drop me below the 400 cap where Solar>Lunar. Is the change actually gonna be worth it? Also, is anyone else having trouble getting haste? I'm finding it increasingly hard to increase my haste to the position I want it at. Even with The Lifebinder, I'm at 475 haste, except for the lack of haste on boots, I find it hard to retrieve any extra haste without breaking 4 set.

Ashaera · 06/04/09, 8:13 AM

@Moonkin Kai -- Your gearing issues does not belong in a theorycraft thread.
Either open simple questions & answers, or do the same as everyone else & use the pretty well developed tools & answer the questions yourself.

tarrek · 06/04/09, 9:02 AM

Originally Posted by antwon87

How do you macro that? Never heard that before.

Using a keypress simulator like AutoHotKey or similar. They're not really in line with the EULA and technically you could get punished for it, but I doubt any GM would burn you for using it on a training dummy.

Altiris · 06/04/09, 9:52 AM

I have been using a Logitech G15 keyboard for about two years now, haven't been burned for it yet. Just make a macro in the software that presses your key and give it a 10 millisecond pause afterward, then set it to repeat "while pressed". I then just hold that key down and I have a macro at the 2 spot on my hotbar that casts Wrath unmodified, Starfire when I press alt, Insect Swarm when I press shift, Moonfire when I press ctrl.

Huskar · 06/04/09, 4:58 PM

Originally Posted by Moonkin Kai

Okay, so, I got the [url=http://thottbot.com/i45462]...in order to fit them in, I'm gonna end up losing quite a bit of haste, enough to drop me below the 400 cap where Solar>Lunar. ...is anyone else having trouble getting haste?...

400 haste is NOT the point when Lunar becomes better than Solar. Its not that clear-cut at all! Nor is it true that haste is worth nothing over 400, for either lunar OR SOLAR. 401 haste just marks the point when GCD clipping beings to occur, and the incremental value of haste begins to decrease. I'm not making any claims regarding solar vs. lunar, just making a clarification.

kr0n1x · 06/06/09, 3:51 PM

Originally Posted by Alerian

I've recorded the 4T8 proc in case someone wants to see how the GCD works in action. It basically operates the same way as an instant and is queueable while you're casting your current spell.

Here's the video: YouTube - Moonkin 4T8.

EDIT: For clarity, the below post is accurate.

Watching the video (thanks for it) it seems you cast two SF at the same time (when the istant one procs, and the "on cast" one lands), and the istant one doesn't trigger a new GCD but uses the one from first SF.
So, 2 SF but 1 GCD, right? Or no?
I've read about "istant cast then no GCD"... what? O_o Moonfire is an istant spell but it triggers a GCD. When i cast it, I've to wait 1 sec to cast another spell.

Why the "instant SF" doesn't trig another GCD? Is it normal? I don't have this part clear on my mind.

Altiris · 06/06/09, 6:38 PM

...No. The GCD begins when you begin casting the spell. Thus a 2+ second cast Starfire will trigger the 1+ second GCD when you start to cast it and it will be over before the spell cast finishes. Thus the first Starfire's GCD elapses during its cast. This is what allows you to cast the instant cast Starfire immediately as the first Starfire lands. The GCD you see after the instant cast Starfire is the GCD for the instant cast Starfire. It starts immediately as you cast it, but there is no cast time, so you actually notice it. It's not hard to understand and works no differently from casting Starfire and then Moonfire immediately after.

kr0n1x · 06/07/09, 5:44 AM

So you have to wait the usual 1s GCD after you've casted the instant SF, right (of course the GCD starts at press of instant SF)?

Watching the video, since the scrolling combat text shown 2 SF in 1 line, i've tought about an automatic cast without GCD. But maybe it was the caster that was really fast at pressing the instant SF after the casted one, so now it is all clear.

Poromu · 06/07/09, 10:12 AM

Anyone using AHK/G15 type scripts will generate the (2 hits) message. We have already been over this pretty much this whole page. Let's get over it.

I've been refreshing IS in Eclipse now at 3.7+ seconds left trying to get the most out of this proc, I haven't had time for any math and would enjoy it if one of the better theorycrafters could see how this affects IS up-time.

Also i'm noticing pretty infrequent ppm qualities of the 4pc. Thorim hard mode being a relative long fight once you trigger the boss.
103 IS ticks (93% up-time), 10 procs. 1.6 ppm for the boss only.

I'm seeing much lower on most fights in some cases dipping as low as 1ppm. My IS up-time is typically very high 90's and I guess I expected much more from this bonus. Hopefully when we work on Yogg w/o Keepers it'll shine a bit better being able to have a bunch of IS running at once.

Altiris · 06/07/09, 2:23 PM

But is isn't PPM, it's 8% per tick. Measuring it in PPM without 100% uptime is meaningless. 10/103 = 9.7% of your ticks procced it, which is above average.

Also, it's not just anyone using AHK/G15, it's anyone queuing the instant cast Starfire at the end of the first one, so pretty much everyone.