Fallenangel

Taking less healers might be a push from Blizzard's side, as all existing raid content can be easily healed by 6 healers, and very most likely with 5 - I did Sapphiron with 5 and it's probably the most healing intensive fight. This might be due to spammability of WG and CoH, but overall it is healty for the game if the required number of healers in a raid is 5-6 and not 7-8.

 

Lightflower

Why do you say that it is healthy for the game to have to bring 5-6 healers to a raid rather than 7-8? If you are looking at it from a "5x5 groups" make up kind of philosophy, no one needs to bring 5 tanks to a raid either.

Remember that healers are definitely not covered by the "bring the player not the class" paradigm that governs tanks & dps but are instead more pigeonholed into their niche roles.

While it is entirely possible for few healers to address all the raid damage at this stage of progression, you can't seriously expect that Blizzard will keep it that way unless they are prepared to release a major content patch every 2 months or so. Raid guilds have already cleared all 25 man content and will thus be farming until Ulduar is released. Unless it is a significant step up in terms of difficulty, you will simply see ennui set in amongst the upper tiers of raiders.

Finally, if 5-6 healers are what Blizzard intend then we are definitely going to see the development of a very antagonistic and competitive attitude between healing classes. For example, if a Holy Paladin is needed to address MT damage then you have 4-5 slots left for three classes which strongly promotes a direct comparison between healing classes & specs to determine the 'best'. While it wouldn't return to the days of Shaman Plateau, at least one class will generally be relegated to 1 raid slot with corresponding backlash in the community.

 

Abolition

The irony of this statement is that it actually dropped off a random mob in Storm Peaks for me while on my Rogue alt. I was so dissapointed seeing as it were BOE, I would have mailed it to my Druid immediately.

 

InSaen

Someone correct me if i'm wrong:

[Darkmoon Card: Blue Dragon] procs 2% of the time with no internal cooldown. So a druid with a one sec GCD casts ~50 times a minute. So it takes 50 casts (100/2 =50) to get the trinket to proc and we cast 50 times in 60 secs. So (15secs/60secs)*100% = 25% uptime. So using one of the spirit trinkets like [Majestic Dragon Figurine] for example, you would have ~1400mp5 out of 5 second rule, subtracting what we get from intensity that leaves 980mp5. So Blue dragon gives you 980mp5 inside the 5 second rule when it procs. With a 25% uptime that comes out to 245mp5 passively. So blue dragon alone is worth 245mp5 and the other spirit trinket is worth ~60mp5. Meaning from this combo alone we're sitting on 305mp5 just from trinkets.

Is this correct?

 

Nitz

Why would you substract Intensity regen ? It retains 30% of your spirit OO5SR mana regeneration, not adding 30% to your base spirit regen.

 

Fallenangel

While it's true that you don't need 5 tanks for 25 men raids, having a similar ratio of healers:raid-size for 5, 10 and 25 raids is a still a good thing from a guild-roster POV. The niche roles of healing is a concern, but it's more of a 10-men raid one, since you only have 2 healers in such raids.
Considering there are 4.5 specs of healing (haven't raided with disc priests myself), 6 spots doesn't sound too bad. Compare this to DPSers, which have 15-17 raid slots, that's more or less a slot per DPS spec.

Blue dragon - nerf it already. Can't say I'm fond of pure-regen trinkets, but this item has got to go.

 

Kermit

But the trinket and Intensity doesn't stack do they? Let's say you have 900 OO5SR-regen and 300 mp5 in combat, then I this trinket raises the regen with (900-300=) 600 during the proc. He was discussing the mp5 added by this trinket beyons normal regen, hence the intensity subtraction. Or did I completely misunderstand you?

 

Vazu

We haven't tried Sartharion with drakes up yet.

That said, I'm using:
[Majestic Dragon Figurine]
[Spirit-World Glass]

I stopped using MP5 and Spirit consumables because my regen is a little high. I switched to Frost Wyrm flasks and Firecracker Salmon. I agree with previous posters here. I just haven't encountered many situations where I was really in fear of going OOM. The only possible exception has been our first couple of Malygos kills where I was pushing it to make sure nobody died and probably overhealing. Even then, Innervate was way more than enough. Once I'm more fully decked in 25-man T7, and fill in a few more slots with BIS gear, I'll be regemming to spellpower or +int gems as well. I would love an Illustration trinket later as well. But we're giving those to our DPS casters first it seems.

 

• Playered

You have 1000 mana regeneration.

Intensity sets you at 30% of that working in combat (300 MP5).
Innervate sets you at 100% (1000 MP5) and then adds an additional 400% (4000 MP5) to give you a final total of 5000 MP5.

Blue Dragon proc sets you at 100% (1000 MP5)
It doesn't "give you an extra 100%" regeneration.

 

Lightflower

I don't think it's correct InSaen because I believe you are overestimating the proc rate of the trinket. With a 2% chance to proc & no ICD, you would not expect 1 proc every 50 casts. In fact, unless my probability calculation is way off, the chance of no proc in 50 casts would be 0.98^50 = 36.41%, going to 13.2% in 100 casts and 1.7% in 200 casts.

Hopefully I'm not too far off base but I would expect a realistic proc for the trinket is more likely once every 3-4 minutes. Obviously though, it has the possibility of going off multiple times in a fight.

At any rate, given spam casting with zero oFSR time where the value of Blue Dragon would be highest, the maximum benefit would be 2% of 100%/30% of Spirit. With 1000 Spirit, that equates to 66.67 which would put it quite firmly below other regen trinkets.

 

Diz

[Darkmoon Card: Greatness]
[Spirit-World Glass]

Opinions on using these two together on a resto druid?

I May end up using [Majestic Dragon Figurine] and the darkmoon card.

and does no one Consider[Darkmoon Card: Illusion] to be of any use for healing?

 

◊ Lord BEEF

If you're getting the greatness card, I think the intellect version would probably be best overall. It seems silly to have an intellect proc but it really increases your regeneration significantly.

 

• Playered

It probably will be, I can do some rough math later to check out a comparison.
However you will need to gear slightly more Spirit around it because otherwise you will not get a full mana pool return from Innervate (although not by any large amount) - and I usually like to have a buffer of around 3k~ from Innervate.

 

Unseen

Atleast with my current gear, if i'd get an intellect card it would still proc spirit for me.

For trinkets i personally am actually at a loss for what would be worth using. I'm currently using the dragon figurine and the badge trinket, as i haven't got my hands on any other good trinkets yet. Going double regen trinkets feels like a bad idea for now though, as my mana really isn't pushed too hard on any current 25man encounters (did sapph-kt-malygos-sartharion today, and i didn't use a single mana pot, nor did i innervate myself). I'm thinking [Illustration of the Dragon Soul] would probably be the best one to get. Ideally, i guess having 2 spell power and 2 regeneration trinkets available would be the best, and switch between them based on need.

 

• Playered

Doh true :P Int card does not mean Int proc, silly me.

If its any encounter you have 0 mana issues at all then it is easy farm content that you do not need to specifically gear for, if you really want to ditch your 'regen' trinket for another power one then just get the badge one or some other generic 100~SP one to equip.

Illustration would be my 'forever' trinket that I doubt I would switch out at all, the loss of that much SP for more regeneration seems a bad trade off in any reasonable sence.
MDF would be my generic second trinket although in the case you mentioned I might throw Egg on for the sake of it, or if it gets to the point where no one else needs Forethought then maybe that as it should end up as a free HoT on the MT when I refresh RGs.

 

Antkins

i'm thinking of using -

[Darkmoon Card: Greatness]
[Majestic Dragon Figurine]


the reason that i am thinking of using 2 regen trinkets, is the fact that you can gear and gem differently in other slots. ie more haste / crit on gear, and put more +19 SP gems in slots. i've noticed in raids that there has been lots of rings, necks, back pieces, and various other items with no spirit on them, but really good other stats on them. so 2 regen trinkets could make up for that.

 

ithecho84

Those are excellent trinkets, but Spell Power literally is our highest rated stat, so you should have probably been using Frost Wyrm and Firecracker Salmon anyways. Also, is there something about Furor that you know that I don't? :3

 

Vazu

That's a negative on Furor. I level'd as Moonkin and obviously went brain dead when I did my resto spec!
(I made level 70 about 2 months before WoTLK was released. Played a Warlock for pre-BC/BC..)

Thank you for noticing. Sheesh! I'll have to move things around a bit now.

 

◊ Lord BEEF

I was using Spirit-World Glass and Magestic Dragon Figurine and it was just silly. I lucked into a JeTze's Bell shortly after and now I'm using the Figurine and the Bell. The figurine is worth about 207 spirit and 30 spellpower before Kings.

I like having regen trinkets but I don't think I need much more. I feel like I have as much regeneration as I did at 70 with sunwell gear.

 

Nubreed

I agree to this. I currently am only using the Majestic Dragon and another random trink and still feel as though my regen is through the roof. With the 280 Spirit which you stack in the first minute of any given encounter plus innervate (even more with the glyph) I haven't seemed to have had any mana problems in 10-25 man Naxx and 10-25 Sarth. I haven't tried in the Malygos encounter yet though.

I have debated moving back towards more spell power/haste and less spirit. What are the thoughts on using any of the haste trinkets to reduce GCD possibly to remove the GCD talent from a given build?

 

GTtheBard

Any time anyone brings this up, I have to wonder where they'll put the points. Currently, you can get 18/0/53 without sacrificing anything important. Dropping more than 2 points in Gift of the Earthmother forces you to put points elsewhere in the Resto Tree without giving up Wild Growth (even after the cooldown it'll be useful)...besides, you can't get anything worthwhile in the Balance tree with just two points. The next useful talent for Resto Druids is Lunar Guidance, which requires three talents to reach and five talent points to max out.

Everything else in the Resto Tree is fairly lackluster - you could opt for Empowered Touch, and upgrade the biggest heal in the game even further. You could take Improved Tranquility, for the time you use it once in a blue moon (though admittedly, that 4 minute cooldown looks hot). 2/5 Tranquil Spirit? To make Nourish cheaper? Why? Regrowth is better until 4t7, and I can't imagine people keeping that bonus in t8 content.

Unless you plan on dropping Wild Growth, Gift of the Earthmother remains one of the best talents in the Resto Tree. I'm not a huge fan of Wild Growth, but it is a useful spell in our arsenal. I can't imagine dropping it at the moment, even if it means 12% of my Intellect becomes Spell Power.

 

Nubreed

Yeah, I can see your view on Resto being lackluster. I am not a huge fan of Wild Growth but it does remain useful especially trinketed. So is the consensus keeping toward raising spirit/spell power over haste? Due to the major addition that trinkets add to both of these stats, I just want to make sure my min/maxxing is as high as it can be.

 

Vazu

Spellpower, Int (until you have about 1k unbuffed), Spirit

Basically it's been determined that for resto Druids, [Ember Skyflare Diamond] is > than [Insightful Earthsiege Diamond] for us at ~ 1000 INT unbuffed. That's assuming you always have Replenishment in raids.

 

Unseen

It has? I would really like to see the math on this one. The insightful earthsiege proc is still giving me thousands of mana per fight. While i may not need that mana too badly at the moment, i really think it will beat out 24 spellpower with ease if t8 content challenges our mana pool in any way.

 

Erdluf

Nitpick: Innervate increases that by 400%. That is a 500% multiplier.