Oktan

I'm a little confused on this. Does this mean there is a server side mechanic, of some sort, to track hots that are over healing once the weapon procs? I am under the impression that hots don't tick if the target is at 100%. If the target is at 95% and your hot brings them to 100% with some over heal, then that shield is applied, right?

The nice thing about being a pessimistic, is that you're constantly proven right, or pleasantly surprised.

 

Paininabox

GC answering some questions about it:

In the same thread as before.

Level 80 Restoration Druid Spreadsheet here.
(v1.41)

 

SkagasmAddict

This is indeed an awesome increase, but unless I'm reading the information wrong it seems that this would have an even greater up time for druids (right up to the 32-33%) depending on how many HoTs you have ticking at the time the ICD is up.

I read it as any heal that isn't 100% overheal will have a 10% chance to proc the buff and that it procs off of HoTs. Just having a WG up and ticking on 6 targets almost guarantees a proc within a few seconds. Add in a compliment of HoTs on a tank or Rejuvs ticking all over the raid and you're talking about 10+ chances to proc it per second. The only thing that could compete with that is JoL.

I also suspect the proc may have great synergy with the huge bloom of a lifebloom triple stack.

 

ttyl

Ok, so it's horrible for Disc Priests?

I still think it would be best in the hands of a Holy Paladin... How many bosses could a tank consistently benefit from a 8sec 10k shield versus how many bosses could a raid benefit from a 8sec 2k+ shield (with ~1 ppm)?

 

Kysse

Does anyone have a list of BiS Leather pieces from all current content?
There is one a few pages back, but it also includes Cloth, which is sometimes hard to get over a DPS or Priest.

 

Paininabox

One could counter with the fact that most hard encounters challenge healers with huge raid damage combined with heavy tank damage. Thus, numerous shields across the raid are indeed beneficial. This argument is really just a mirror argument of the paladin vs. druid vs. shaman vs. priest^2 healer debate. Everyone has something they do better and thus in those situations the weapon would be better in the hands of that healer. Hence, there is really no cut-and-dry "X gets it" when X doesn't necessarily have the mechanics to be effective in all encounters.

I'd also like to point out that paladins aren't going to be putting out a 10k shield unless they cast 3 critting HL's and the tank never gets hit in the meantime. The paladin is more likely to put out a ~2.25k shield every HL cast.

I still say just give it to your best/most dedicated healer. I think it's pretty certain that the proc is at least not trash for resto druids, if not excellent depending on how it handles full overheal hot ticks. Barring disc priests (they got ripped off), I believe the delta between the healers using this mace is small enough that larger variables, like fight mechanics and skill, will outweigh it.

Level 80 Restoration Druid Spreadsheet here.
(v1.41)

 

◊ Lord BEEF

Honestly it seems about equal for all types of healers except discipline priests. Even then it's not bad.

 

Inorrri

I'm pretty sure a resto druid MT healing will put up a much larger shield than holy pala. Assuming rejuv+regrowth hot + 3lb stack + wg + nourish spam (glyphed that is) as soon as the bonus procs, I really doubt any holy pala can compete with that when hot overhealing also count towards the shield, so the amount of *shielded* per second should be higher.
On a raid healing I'd say holy priests and resto shammies will be a bit ahead, but not far away. Although druids can gain a semi-ohsnap aoe cd with this - tranqulity.
Oh and obviously nobody can compete with druids uptime of the bonus.
All in all it's an okay mace, I can definately see it benefitting my healing, but not something I'd go crazy over.

 

ttyl

Let's think about the proc in each encounter:
Razorscale Phase 1: Sporadic and slow raid damage, unlikely to benefit raid healing. Would be a small to zero increase in tank healing.
Phase 2: Large benefit to tank healing.
Ignis: Small chance to benefit raid healing during Flame Jet ticks. Large benefit to tank/slag pot healing.
XT: Good for tank healing. Amazing benefit to raid healing (even more amazing benefit to raid healing on hard mode).
Kologarn: Large benefit to tank/stone grip healing. Random raid damage, useful against Arm Sweep.
Iron Council: Very large benefit to tank healing on all three modes. Inconsistent, non-threatening (if people move when they're supposed to) raid damage on easy/medium mode. Would be good on hard mode.
Auriaya: Large benefit to tank healing. Consistent raid damage (unless this is interruptable? I dont remember), would be good here.
Hodir: Large benefit to tank healing. Inconsistent raid damage. During Frozen Blows, would be amazing for both tank and raid healing (if you were lucky enough to get the proc during it).
Thorim: Great for arena and gauntlet event healing. When Thorim jumps down, it would be a very large benefit to tank healing and inconsistent raid damage (how is raid damage on hard mode 25?).
Freya: Consistent tank damage (heavy tank damage in hard mode). Low, random raid damage.
Mimiron P1: Very large benefit to tank healing. 0 to raid healing.
P2: Amazing benefit to raid healing.
P3: Decent benefit to tank healing. 0 to raid healing.
P4: ~Equal benefit to tank and raid healing.
Vezax: Large benefit to tank healing, inconsistent raid damage. Sounds like it would be very nice for raid healing in hard mode?
Yogg P1: Decent benefit to tank healing.
P2: Random damage, low benefit. Would be a nice proc in the brain room?
P3: Consistent tank damage, inconsistent raid damage.
Algalon: Sounds like a heavy tank damage/movement fight?

Theoretically, like you calculated, the mace would be an overall increase for any healing spec. But, if the shield is not used, should that proc still count as an "increase"? It seems to me the only fights you could guarantee a raid healer's proc and 8 second shield will be used are: XT, hard mode Iron Council, Kologarn, Auriaya, P2/P4 Mimiron, and hard mode Vezax? Out of those, Kologarn and Auriaya aren't very hard and their raid damage isn't a challenge. Compare that list to fights that the proc and shield will always be a benefit for tank healing.

 

isonicq

Revitalize can already proc despite the target of a Rejuv or WG being at full health, even if the actual Rejuv or WG doesn't actually tick. I suspect the same sort of mechanics will be used here to let overhealing HoTs contribute to the shield.

 

Ezarg

The raid healing benefits are kind of dependent on the buff uptime, since if the uptime is less than something like 30% it's going to be rare enough that you can't really count on it to proc at a specific time. If there is an ICD then for fights like Kologarn and others where raid damage comes in large bursts to the whole raid, it's going to be quite frankly entirely dependent on how the ICDs (and the following procs) sync up with the bursts.

Not saying that it's useless for raid healing - I'm sure it will be nice enough to have. Also, in case of tank healing it's pretty much always good regardless of the encounter (of course it will be stronger in some encounters than the others) but if you could keep the tank up before you got the mace, this isn't going to change that much. On the other hand with raid healing where the damage is a lot more incidental this could be actually really nice simply because if someone gets low and you hit him with a decent-sized heal and get a proc and a shield on them at the same time, that's where it becomes priceless.

 

Trammell

I have skimmed through this thread and read many pages (mostly the post 3.1 date). I am struggling with whether the 4pc t7.5 vs. t8.0 gear sets. The casual 25 man guild I belong to imploded once we hit Ulduar and have moved into a new guild focusing on 10 man progression (hard modes as permitted). I do all the gear research for my wife as she just plays the toon and doesn't bother with the min\max of gear. She has always been a MT healer and spreads HoT's around when time permits. Looking at the comparision the stats alone look like it would be an upgrade for her. It is the set bonus that has me questioning the pro's & cons.

Thanks

Armory

 

Goomp

As more hard mode loot has been discovered I had been sifting through it trying to determine my personal best in slots drops along with drops that are normal attainable drops that are worthwhile secondary best in slots to use during progression. For many people, myself included, some of the best in slots will be most likely be unattainable for long periods of time or in the case of cloth items may take some extended waiting depending how loot is done. My list expands off Norfair's basic layout and uses the same reasoning that different players have different tastes in gearing.

HH = Heroic Hardmode
NH = Normal Hardmode
BiS = Best in slot based off spellpower (Some may be off slightly depending on kings/tree/gemming etc.)
P = Personal BiS choice, yours will probably vary. Initially I chose to drop the T8 gloves simply because of the larger amount of choices (and haste gloves dropping normally off Vezax) but will probably reevaluate once more hard mode drops are available to me.

Also noted are Cloth and Crafted drops as the availability of those can vary.

Items are generally ranked by category from best -> good.

Head:
Crown of Luminescence (BiS, HH, Crit, Cloth)
[Conqueror's Nightsong Headpiece] (Set, Crit, P)

Neck:
[Sapphire Amulet of Renewal] (BiS, HH, Haste/Spi, P)
[Charm of Meticulous Timing] (HH, Haste/Mp5)
[Evoker's Charm] (Haste/Spi)
[Freya's Choker of Warding] (Haste/Mp5)
[Life-Binder's Locket] (Crit)

Shoulders;
[Shoulderpads of Dormant Energies] (BiS, HH, Crit)
[Conqueror's Nightsong Spaulders] (Haste, P)

Cloak:
Sunglimmer Cloak (BiS, HH, Haste, P)
Drape of the Sullen Goddess (HH, Crit)
[Cape of the Unworthy Wizard] (Crit)
[Shroud of Alteration] (Haste/MP5)

Chest:
Vestments of the Blind Denizen (BiS, HH, Haste)
[Conqueror's Nightsong Robe] (Crit, Set, P)

Bracers:
Grasps of Reason (BiS, HH, Haste, Cloth, P)
[Unsullied Cuffs] (Haste, Cloth)
[Bracers of the Broodmother] (Haste)

Gloves:
[Handwraps of the Vigilant] (BiS, HH, Crit, Cloth, P)
[Gloves of the Frozen Glade] (HH, Crit)
[Handguards of Potent Cures] (NH,Crit)
[Grips of the Unbroken] (Haste)
[Conqueror's Nightsong Handguards] (Crit, Set)

Belt:
[Belt of Arctic Life] (BiS, Haste, Crafted, P)
[Cord of the White Dawn] (Crit, Crafted, Cloth)
[Belt of the Crystal Tree] (Haste)
[Unravelling Strands of Sanity] (Regen)
[Flamewrought Cinch] (Crit)

Legs:
[Conqueror's Nightsong Leggings] (BiS, Crit, Set, P)
[Leggings of the Lifetender] (Haste)

Boots:
[Boots of Fiery Resolution] (BiS, HH, Haste, Cloth, P)
[Spellslinger's Slippers] (Haste, Crafted, Cloth)
[Boots of Wintry Endurance] (Crit, Crafted)
[Boots of the Servant] (Haste, Cloth)
[Boots of Hasty Revival] (Crit)

Rings:
Conductive Seal (BiS, HH, Haste/Spi,P)
[Fire Orchid Signet] (BiS, NH, Haste/Mp5,P)
[Glowing Ring of Reclamation] (Crit/Spi)
[Radiant Seal] (Haste/Mp5)
[Ring of the Faithful Servant] (Crit/Mp5)

Trinkets (again refer to this thread, but my personal opinion is as follows):
[Sif's Remembrance]/Show of Faith (BiS, NH/HH, throughput/regen)
[Illustration of the Dragon Soul]* (BiS, throughput)
[Spark of Hope] (Mana intensive fights)
[Pandora's Plea] (Honorable mention for certain fights)

*[Scale of Fates]/[Eye of the Broodmother] (for those like myself that never got an Illustration of the Dragonsoul)

Weapon 2h:
[Staff of Endless Winter] (BiS, HH,Crit)

Weapon 1h:
[Val'anyr, Hammer of Ancient Kings] (Obligatory mention, BiS, P)
[Guiding Star] (Haste, P)

Offhand:
[Ironmender] (BiS, Haste, P)

 

Paininabox

From GC, clarification on the proc. I think it's pretty clear now that full overheal hot ticks also contribute to the shield.

Source: World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> Explain Val'anyr please

Level 80 Restoration Druid Spreadsheet here.
(v1.41)

 

Mawic

The value of the Tier bonuses will vary quite a bit depending on your role and how your total healing output is distributed across each of your spells.

Here are the values I use with my own gear, based on some rough napkin math on generic archetypes:

Tier Bonus	Tank Healing	Raid Healing
	10% Lifebloom	0% Lifebloom
	35% Nourish	15% Nourish
	25% Rejuv	45% Rejuv
	5% Swiftmend	5% Swiftmend
T7 2pc	27	0	Saves 49 mana/cast, assume 1 cast/9sec
T7 4pc	87	37	Assume 2 hots on target, unglyphed (+20% vs +30% bonus healing)
Nourish Glyph	105	45	Assume 2 hots on target, no T7 4pc (+20% vs +32% bonus healing)
T8 2pc	15	15
T8 4pc	125	225	Assume 1/2 strength initial tick, 3/6 Rejuv ticks actually tick (3 vs. 3.5 ticks)

These values assume approx. 3000 Spellpower fully raid buffed, and are calibrated to values of 1 for both Spellpower and Mp5. If you use these numbers with a LootRank profile, just multiply the score of the T7 2pc by your value for Mp5, and the value of the rest by your value for Spellpower. The Nourish Glyph is included simply for contrast with the T7 4pc.

Even if you're primarily a MT healer, it won't take too many upgrades to surpass your old T7 bonus. I'm still using my T7 4pc, but none of the upgrades I've picked up so far have been T8. I wouldn't break up the T7 4pc for a single piece of T8, but I probably wouldn't hesitate if I had 2-3 pieces of T8. The T8 4pc makes it a given.

 

sivart33

I just want to correct you on a few things, the hots only proc the shield when they heal. From blue post "If it helps to explain it, the blessing is triggered by healing being done." that means no over-healing. So when they are ticking off on someone they will proc the shield (15% chance) but not when they are not ticking, it will do nothing.

Also this is a personal thing, but i would never stack lifebloom up over 1 since the mana cost is such a high amount, and stacking LB higher will not help your nourish spamming.

 

Spazmo

I think you're confusing a few things here. The blue post you quoted makes a distinction between the blessing and the "bubbles" (shields) it creates. Your hots only proc the blessing (ie the 15 second buff you get on yourself which allows your heals to shield people) when they heal actual damage. Once you have the 15 second blessing buff on yourself however, all your heals - including full overheals, which also includes HoTs "ticking" on a target who is at full health (which don't even show up in the combatlog) - will shield your target.

 

S0und

i already saw some discussion about the 4p T8 setbonus, but i want to share my experience about it.

Here it is a stat from 2 Vezax try + 15 try on Yoggi + a kill from yesterday.

STAT

To be honest iam quite happy with the result. The bonus did 9% healing overall.

i got 2630 sp raidbuffed

- mostly iam healing with reju
- WG when it's cooled
- regrowth > nourish
- iam using nourish only for burst healing
- LB on tanks

Too bad this bonus is not working with the reju glyph.

 

goodolarchie

The 4pc bonus is great, despite being a letdown mechanically (no talent, no crit, no glyph). My parses show it to be about 7-10% of my total healing. The biggest novelty of it in my opinion is that it helps bridge the gap on fights where pre-hotting isn't always possible or feasible, and where retroactive healing on random raid damage is important. It feels right at home for Ulduar.

Goomp that looks like a good list, you might wanna update the BIS weapon to this guy: Constellus

 

mrf

noob question:
what is the best gem for a blue slot?
[Purified Twilight Opal] 9 sp + 9 spirit
vs
[Sparkling Sky Sapphire] 16 spirit

Im using the first atm, you probably already answered this question somewhere :P
Thanks

 

goodolarchie

noob answer:
throughput > all

Often times its not even worth using the blue unless the socket bonus is something like
[ ]Blue
[ ]Red
Socket Bonus: +7 Spellpower

In this case by going with Purified + Runed you aren't sacrificing throughput.

 

Dendrek

[edit] As Oktan points out in the following post, I was mistaken. To avoid spreading misinformation, I've removed this post. My apologies.

 

Oktan

The way this works is that when the proc happens (which is a 10% chance whenever a hot or direct spell heals, with a 45 sec internal cooldown) you gain a buff (the Blessing) on yourself. Now all of your heals for the next 15 sec cause an 8 sec damage shield. The shield stacks with itself. It includes healing done by subsequent ticks of existing hots on the target. Note that the spell has to actually heal, so hots ticking on a fully-healed target cannot cause the proc. However the shield is based on the size of the heal itself, not the amount healed – i.e. 100% overhealing will not proc the Blessing on the healer, but the shield itself includes overhealing once the Blessing is active. The shield can grow to a maximum size of 20,000 damage absorbed.

The nice thing about being a pessimistic, is that you're constantly proven right, or pleasantly surprised.

 

Cathiecj

It doesn't work with the glyph? Meaning my swiftmend will eat my rejuv?

Also, since we now see Constellus (1H-Mace - Spell MP5) dropped from Hodir in Hard Mode. Is it possible this might be BIS with the Ironmender?
Constellus and Ironmender = 108 Stam 102 int 45 Spi 19 mp5 661 spwr 36 haste 29 crit 1 blue gem slot with 5 spwr bonus.
Staff of Endless Winter = ......111 Stam 128 Int 84 Spi...........587 Spwr ........... 104 Crit 2 blue gem slot with 9 spwr bonus.

Are the losses worth it though? Im inclined to think not. but that is A LOT of Spwr.

Link to Constellus http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/...constellus.jpg.. Sorry don't know how to make it a mouse over.

 

Norfair

If you gem purified gems in both weapons:

1h combo: 587 (mainhand) + 9 (gem) + 5 (bonus) + 74 (offhand) + 63 (enchant) = 738 spellpower.
Staff: 587 (staff) + 18 (gems) + 9 (bonus) + 81 (enchant) = 695.

It's 43 difference, but the spirit is good for about 8 spellpower too. In the end 35 spellpower and 36 haste gain with the 1h/oh combo versus 75 crit and a bit more mana regen (think 5-10 mp5?). I prefer the mainhand/offhand combo then.

Looking for guild with healthy raidtimes for Icecrown.