Restoration Itemization - Page 21

aramisx · 02/17/09, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by jula

I use the simple conversions of 1 int => 0.5 mp5, and 1 spi => 0.3 mp5 + 0.15 SP. and i get the following list of rings, ordered by spell power:

[Signet of Manifested Pain] - 74 SP, 24.5 mp5, 46 crit, 36 haste, 46 sta
[Titanium Spellshock Ring] - 73 SP, 16.5 mp5, 42 crit, 48 sta
[Lost Jewel] - 70.5 SP, 31.3 mp5, 42 crit, 45 sta
[Band of Channeled Magic]- 69.8 SP, 31.1 mp5, 43 haste, 42 sta
[Wyrmrest Band] - 67 SP, 36 mp5, 32 haste, 41 sta
[Renewal of Life] - 66 SP, 37.5 mp5, 28 crit, 48 sta
[Ring of Decaying Beauty] - 66 SP, 36 mp5, 35 haste, 48 sta
[Loop of the Kirin Tor] - 64.4 SP, 40mp5, 49 sta
[Ring of Holy Cleansing] - 63.3 SP, 28.6 mp5, 36 haste, 36 sta
[Timeworn Silken Band] - 63.2 SP, 28.3 mp5, 36 crit, 37 sta
[Circle of Life] - 59 SP, 31 mp5, 34 haste 42 sta

You know, I'm new to this forum, and still relatively new to the game as I've only been playing for about six months, so I can say that this list in particular is so helpful. I've been wondering what kinds of things I should be looking at.

Now it may just be my naite, but I'm really loving the Renewal of Life and the Loop of the Kirin Tor. Is it wrong to regard the mp5 over the SP? I can't seem to make a consensus based on this really long thread debating such things.

Hotalicious · 02/17/09, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by aramisx

Now it may just be my naite, but I'm really loving the Renewal of Life and the Loop of the Kirin Tor. Is it wrong to regard the mp5 over the SP? I can't seem to make a consensus based on this really long thread debating such things.

Once you have the regen to support yourself through Naxx then Spell Power is our most "powerful" stat. Powerful essentially meaning that for each point of Spell Power, you gain more benefit that you would from lets say...spirit, haste, whatever.

Is it wrong to go mp5 now? No. As your gear improves it will become unneeded. This is just for Naxx/Maly/Sarth (current content). Ulduar could change all that. Will the fights require more longevity and less pure healing power? What will the new mana regen changes bring? We shall see. Right now there really isn't a "wrong" way to do anything.

This is my $.02. Hope it helps!

calderstrake · 02/17/09, 7:19 PM

The problem I see with grabbing gear solely based on spell power is that you ignore other benefits of the other stats. True, the content is very forgiving currently and you can be less strict, but why do this? I don't see this as a reason to be lazy with your stats just because you can and still get away with it. We should all know by now that healing meters are useless for measuring effectiveness, so why keep pushing the same old tired mantra? Just because Spi isn't used to calculate the ToL bonus doesn't mean it should be ignored. It still provides the basis for Innervate calculations and current mana regen. Recommending gear that you think will be more useful in the next patch when it isn't even on PTR is just foolishness.

The way I see it, Druid should continue to practice balanced stat gearing. In this spirit, theses three rings are best in slot and can be mixed as your budget and/or the RNG determines best.

[Lost Jewel]
[Band of Channeled Magic]
[Loop of the Kirin Tor]

In terms of itemization, Loop of the Kirin Tor is the best, but doesn't have the highest spell power. If we can get a ring with these stats in 3.1 but with higher numbers, it will be the clear #1 choice.

• malthrin · 02/18/09, 10:27 AM

3) This change won't change the relative values of Int and Spirit. Int was already a good regen stat (in part because it provides other bonuses). However, you are rarely ever choosing between a +100 Int chest and a +100 Spirit chest (though you might be with gems). More to the point though, the regen formula is SQRT of Int * Spirit * a constant. We are just lowering the constant. If Spirit was good for you before, it will still be good for you. If the only reason it was good for you before was because you took a lot of out of FSR breaks, well 1) again I am skeptical, and 2) yes, under that specific situation you will notice a nerf to your regen.

If you mean these changes will nerf Innervate, yes, it will. On live Innervate can be 120% of your bar, say 25,000 mana. Historically it was more like 75% of your bar, and it should be closer to that with these changes.

Blizzard quotes from last night on the mechanics and magnitude of the nerf to spirit regen. The coefficient at 80 is 0.005575. Based on the Innervate comment, we can probably expect to lose around 1/4-1/3 of that, and correspondingly see Intensity bumped up to 40 or 50%.

Fallenangel · 02/18/09, 10:45 AM

If innervate is changed to 75% of your mana bar (roughly) then the Great-Regen-Nerf of 3.1 will boil down to losing about 65mp5 in current gear levels. No-change, anyone?

Playered · 02/18/09, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by malthrin

Blizzard quotes from last night on the mechanics and magnitude of the nerf to spirit regen. The coefficient at 80 is 0.005575. Based on the Innervate comment, we can probably expect to lose around 1/4-1/3 of that, and correspondingly see Intensity bumped up to 40 or 50%.

[Napkin math]: In order to get my Innervate down to around 75%~ we would be looking at a coefficient change to around 0.004 and Intensity would have to go between 40-45%, resulting in a general 30%~ reduction to the regeneration formula.

Guess we won't have long to wait to see what actually happens but those seem to be roughly the figures I assumed they would weaken it by (or well the worst I thought we would get hit by was a 40% reduction, turning Intensity to 50%).

[e] Fallen I don't know where you are getting the MP5 loss from..?

• Hamlet · 02/18/09, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by malthrin

Blizzard quotes from last night on the mechanics and magnitude of the nerf to spirit regen. The coefficient at 80 is 0.005575. Based on the Innervate comment, we can probably expect to lose around 1/4-1/3 of that, and correspondingly see Intensity bumped up to 40 or 50%.

e: nm

Fallenangel · 02/18/09, 11:00 AM

Assuming 19k mana pool, you "lose" 25% of it every 6 minutes from the innervate nerf = 65mp5.
Granted that's not really accurate, shorter fights will mean this nerfs hit harder, otoh innervate isn't used when you're at 0 mana. In adddition, on fights that last 7-9 minutes innervate is usually used only once, further reducing the impact.

Edit: Did innervate really give 75% of the mana-bar pre 2.4? Didn't play a resto seriously then but I recall it was lower.

Cube · 02/18/09, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by Fallenangel

Edit: Did innervate really give 75% of the mana-bar pre 2.4? Didn't play a resto seriously then but I recall it was lower.

If I recall correctly, it was around there for T6 geared resto druids. However, that was mainly because the standard gemming practice was to use healing/MP5 gems rather than for spirit because MP5 gave a greater return per item point.

After 2.4, I remember regemming all of my Healing/MP5 gems for Healing/spirit and pure Healing gems because the increased in 5sr MP5 and innervate's relative increase gave me way too much MP5.

Playered · 02/18/09, 12:57 PM

Heh I was right

This post states that:
"The amount of base mana regen granted has been reduced 40%."
"The effects of talents that provide mana regen while casting have been increased by 67%. This includes: /snip/ Intensity and Meditation are now 17/33/50% mana regen while casting (up from 10/20/30%)."

This now means OO5SR regeneration is double your normal regeneration down from 3x. Your Innervate should also go down 40% so that if you currently got a 25k mana restore now gives you 15k.

Paininabox · 02/18/09, 5:27 PM

Cool, thanks for the update, Playered. Now to plug this change into my spreadsheets and such to see how this'll look...

aramisx · 02/18/09, 11:29 PM

wow...i missed a lot apparently in this whole discussion....so recap for me please:

Innervate is being nerfed significantly while mana regen talents are being buffed?

Its times like these i wish I would have spec'd Resto from the beginning instead of switching from Feral because i often feel so clueless. :P

red · 02/19/09, 1:36 AM

Originally Posted by aramisx

wow...i missed a lot apparently in this whole discussion....so recap for me please

1) "While casting" (as in, when you've cast a spell in the last 5 seconds), there will be effectively no change.
2) "While not casting" (cast no spell in the last 5 seconds), you will regen much less mana per second. Like 2/3 of what it is now. So if you stop casting and wait a little bit, you'll get much less benefit than you do now.
3) Innervate will restore significantly less mana than it does now.

voxxington · 02/19/09, 2:45 AM

I'd just like to clarify the mathematics behind the mana regen nerf. I've seen several times that there will be 'no change', in regards to our current mp5 while casting. Some napkin math shows:

1000 mp5 outside 5 second rule
333 mp5 inside 5 second rule

Going by 40% reduction to the out of casting regen, and a 50% value to Intensity, up from 30%, should give us:

600 mp5 outside 5 second rule
300 mp5 inside 5 second rule

Granted, it isn't substantial, but fully raid buffed it could be noticable. Is my math off in this case, or are people simply writing off the 40-50 mp5 nerf as insignificant?

*edit* The 40-50 value I'm taking from an estimated 'raid buffed' situation.

Cadsuane · 02/19/09, 3:19 AM

Originally Posted by voxxington

I'd just like to clarify the mathematics behind the mana regen nerf. I've seen several times that there will be 'no change', in regards to our current mp5 while casting. Some napkin math shows:

1000 mp5 outside 5 second rule
333 mp5 inside 5 second rule

Going by 40% reduction to the out of casting regen, and a 50% value to Intensity, up from 30%, should give us:

600 mp5 outside 5 second rule
300 mp5 inside 5 second rule

Granted, it isn't substantial, but fully raid buffed it could be noticable. Is my math off in this case, or are people simply writing off the 40-50 mp5 nerf as insignificant?

*edit* The 40-50 value I'm taking from an estimated 'raid buffed' situation.

If u got 1000mp5 outside 5 second rule,
then your mp5 inside 5 second rule should be 300.
This is all from spirit that is getting changed. The 33 extra would come from baseline or straight mp5 that isn't getting changed.

So your regen inside the 5 second rule should be the same.