WrathCalcs - Moonkin DPS Spreadsheet - Page 2

• Adoriele · 12/02/08, 5:29 PM

Originally Posted by Erdluf

I wouldn't think there would be a security issue. The "Scenarios" just have a name, and map values to cells. The "report" is generated when I push a "Summary" button. It is not automatically updated as other inputs change.

This is on Excel 2007 Professional. The Scenarios were saved with the spreadsheet in .xls format, which probably means that a similar feature was in older versions.

I think I've got Excel 2002 Professional at home on one machine, and a more recent version (probably 2007) of the "Home" or "Student" version on another machine. I'll see where this works, and doesn't work.

I think you'd need to use VBA to automatically generate the scenarios and reports based on current values. Using VBA would raise security issues.

Yeah, I looked into it, it's not as cool as I thought. I may add to the OP with details on generating a report, though. Definitely saves me the headache of having to worry about it, though.

Erdluf · 12/02/08, 11:23 PM

You can get Excel to tell you how much an output (say DPS) will change if you change some input (say hit) by 1. The displayed answer will automatically be updated as other values in the spreadsheet (say Spellpower) or the original input (hit) are modified.

This works with at least Excel 2000 Professional, 2007 Professional, and 2007 Home and Student. I don't believe it works with Open Office, but maybe I just couldn't find it.

Suppose my input and output are named Hit and DPS. I want to know how much DPS changes, if Hit is increased by one. I need a grid of two rows and four columns (can also be done as four rows and two columns). I'll use R4 through U5.

In S4, put =Hit
In T4, put =S4+1
In R5, put =DPS
In U5, put =T5-S5

Select cells R4 through T5.
In old versions of excel go to the Data menu, and select Table.
In new versions of excel go to the Data Tab, click the arrow for "What If Analysis" and then select "Data Table."
In the dialog box that comes up, type "DPS" into the "Row" cell. Leave the "Column" cell blank.
Hit Ok.
You will see the current DPS in both R5 and S5. The value of DPS associated with (Hit+1) is in T5.
Your answer (how DPS scales with Hit) will be in cell U5.

Note that if your input has a cap (say number of talent points in Improved Moonfire), you'll want to avoid the "overflow" in T4. For IMF, you might use

In S4, =if(IMF==2,1,IMF)

now S4 will always be zero or 1, and T4 will always be 1 or 2.

You can extend this procedure to get the scaling for multiple outputs (say DPS, DPM, Time till OOM) by adding additional rows to the table:
R5=DPS, U5=T5-S5
R6=DPM, U6=T6-S6
R7=OomTime, U7=T7-S7
Instead of Selecting cells R4 through T5, you would select cells R4 through T7 before bringing up the Data/Table dialog box.

Edit: It appears the input cell ("Hit" in my example, needs to be on the same worksheet as your data table).

Edit2: It looks like the character stats should be unbuffed, in caster form (since Furor, AI, etc. all increase TotalInt). The spreadsheet is currently ignoring the Lunar Guidance bonus from increased Int. In Basic Calcs, the Total Spellpower cell, I'd add +0.04*Lun_Gui*(MkFInt-Int).

Edit3:Similar issue for increased spellpower from increased Spirit. In Total Spellpower, adding +0.05*iMK*(TotalSpi-Spirit).

• Adoriele · 12/03/08, 4:45 PM

Originally Posted by Erdluf

You can get Excel to tell you how much an output (say DPS) will change if you change some input (say hit) by 1. The displayed answer will automatically be updated as other values in the spreadsheet (say Spellpower) or the original input (hit) are modified.

This works with at least Excel 2000 Professional, 2007 Professional, and 2007 Home and Student. I don't believe it works with Open Office, but maybe I just couldn't find it.

Suppose my input and output are named Hit and DPS. I want to know how much DPS changes, if Hit is increased by one. I need a grid of two rows and four columns (can also be done as four rows and two columns). I'll use R4 through U5.

In S4, put =Hit
In T4, put =S4+1
In R5, put =DPS
In U5, put =T5-S5

Select cells R4 through T5.
In old versions of excel go to the Data menu, and select Table.
In new versions of excel go to the Data Tab, click the arrow for "What If Analysis" and then select "Data Table."
In the dialog box that comes up, type "DPS" into the "Row" cell. Leave the "Column" cell blank.
Hit Ok.
You will see the current DPS in both R5 and S5. The value of DPS associated with (Hit+1) is in T5.
Your answer (how DPS scales with Hit) will be in cell U5.

Note that if your input has a cap (say number of talent points in Improved Moonfire), you'll want to avoid the "overflow" in T4. For IMF, you might use

In S4, =if(IMF==2,1,IMF)

now S4 will always be zero or 1, and T4 will always be 1 or 2.

You can extend this procedure to get the scaling for multiple outputs (say DPS, DPM, Time till OOM) by adding additional rows to the table:
R5=DPS, U5=T5-S5
R6=DPM, U6=T6-S6
R7=OomTime, U7=T7-S7
Instead of Selecting cells R4 through T5, you would select cells R4 through T7 before bringing up the Data/Table dialog box.

Edit: It appears the input cell ("Hit" in my example, needs to be on the same worksheet as your data table).

Edit2: It looks like the character stats should be unbuffed, in caster form (since Furor, AI, etc. all increase TotalInt). The spreadsheet is currently ignoring the Lunar Guidance bonus from increased Int. In Basic Calcs, the Total Spellpower cell, I'd add +0.04*Lun_Gui*(MkFInt-Int).

Edit3:Similar issue for increased spellpower from increased Spirit. In Total Spellpower, adding +0.05*iMK*(TotalSpi-Spirit).

Bagh, still can't seem to get this to work, though it's a bit more promising. I'm using Excel 2003 Basic on my work computer, I'll keep trying to get it working, and I've got 2007 Student at home as a last resort. I got your PM as well.

Good call on the spellpower calc, though. Never even thought of it.

[edit] AHA! Got it! Expect 1.1 in the not too distant future, with scaling for a whole shit ton of stuff. Should allow me to clean up a lot of the calc pages as well, now that I'm not going to have to do talent-by-talent calcs.

Manthra · 12/03/08, 6:53 PM

OpenOffice from www: OpenOffice.org - The Free and Open Productivity Suite is a great free tool. It's pretty much Office renamed and open source. Supports all the new formats.

• Adoriele · 12/05/08, 3:35 PM

WrathCalcsv1.1-

In this version, just about everything on the Character sheet shows scaling values of some sort. For stats, you'll see the added DPS of +1 (+.01 for latency). For talents, you'll see the benefit of the number of points you have in the talent, compared with being untalented. if you are untalented, you'll instead see the value of the first point. For most others, you'll see the value of the buff, whether you have it or not.

If there are multiple versions of a buff (i.e. food) with no clear default value (i.e. BoK is usually going to be all or nothing), the benefit will disappear if "None" is selected. Similarly, if one buff overrides another (i.e. you pick Divine Spirit and also choose a spirit scroll), the lesser buff's benefit will disappear, unless it's a consumable (to show you that, yes, you are wasting your money).

Buffs that do not stack, but also don't have the same total benefit, will only show their differences. I.E. if you have iMkAura, and have selected Swift Retribution as your All-haste raid buff, Swift retribution will show no benefit, but iMkAura will show the benefit of the added spellpower from Spirit.

Benefits which are a tautology are not shown (I.E. the benefit of +1 MP5 is... +1 MP5).

Also, bug fixes:
- Spammy rotations now work correctly with Eclipse, and the model is more fleshed-out.
- You can now choose to use a Smart Eclipse rotation
- Mana benefits from procs were being given even if the buff wasn't active. If you have no Moonkin Form, OoC, or JoW, you will notice a sharp decrease in available mana.
- Various talent interactions weren't being totaled properly, these have been fixed.
- It is assumed that if your MotW is better than the one listed in Raid Buffs, you'll be casting yours.

Issues:
- It is assumed that you are not casting FF, even if talented for it. Mostly, this is because I don't have the calcs in for how casting it affects your DPS. There is also no listing for a regular FF debuff, so the only way to get iFF's crit benefit is to set the Spell Hit Debuff to iFF instead of Misery.

[Edit] Hot on its heels, v1.1.1 includes an Idol selector.

Erdluf · 12/05/08, 10:59 PM

Yay!

You undervalue Int a bit. Scaling from Int should be something more than (12% of scaling from Spellpower + 25% of scaling from Crit).

At least part of the problem is in the TotalSp formula:

TotalSp = ... + 0.04*Lun_Gui*(MkFInt-Int) + ...

When Int increases by 1, MkFInt shoul increase by 1.2 or so, but (MkFInt-Int) increases by only about 0.2.

As a workaround that gives what I think are reasonable results, I did:

In "Character Sheet":
E52: "ExtraInt"
E53: 0 <--- Named E53 "ExtraInt"
B53: Changed to "=ExtraInt+1"
Table at B52:C53, now has a column-input of ExtraInt

In "Basic Calcs", the "Total Int" formula now begins: "=(Int+ExtraInt+..."

With this change, Int DPS scaling goes from about 0.28 to about 0.41 (no other changes to your downloaded spreadsheet, unless I messed up).

• Adoriele · 12/06/08, 1:56 AM

Good call on that work around. A lot better than forcing people to input their pre-LG spellpower. I've got it changed locally, I'll upload it either tomorrow or Monday.

[edit] Doesn't fix the scaling numbers for LG itself, though. Right now it only shows the benefit from Furor.

Erdluf · 12/07/08, 3:03 PM

Originally Posted by Adoriele

[edit] Doesn't fix the scaling numbers for LG itself, though. Right now it only shows the benefit from Furor.

Instead of the data table stuff, you can just use

Lunar Guidance Benefit = Spellpower Scaling * 4% * Lunar Guidance Points * Raid Buffed Int

• Adoriele · 12/07/08, 5:37 PM

Originally Posted by Erdluf

Instead of the data table stuff, you can just use

Lunar Guidance Benefit = Spellpower Scaling * 4% * Lunar Guidance Points * Raid Buffed Int

That might just work. I was gonna say that Spellpower's value diminishes as you add, but it doesn't. It's just that everything else's value rises.

Namsar · 12/07/08, 6:50 PM

Edited: out all my junk, need to drink more coffee before posting.

crmccar · 12/12/08, 4:56 PM

Hey Adoriele,

I'm a little confused about the different rotation types provided. All the rotations labeled with "filler" I assume define what you do while Eclipse is on cooldown. However, it doesn't seem to say anything about what's happening when eclipse is off cooldown or procced. Could you clarify what's going on here? I tried but failed to figure it out from the calc pages. Thanks!

• Adoriele · 12/12/08, 5:42 PM

Originally Posted by crmccar

Hey Adoriele,

I'm a little confused about the different rotation types provided. All the rotations labeled with "filler" I assume define what you do while Eclipse is on cooldown. However, it doesn't seem to say anything about what's happening when eclipse is off cooldown or procced. Could you clarify what's going on here? I tried but failed to figure it out from the calc pages. Thanks!

This is what the Eclipse Rotation Type selector is for, though I know it's a bit hard to understand what I'm getting at with that, so I've updated how it displays the rotation: When choosing an Eclipse Rotation Type, the form is pre-Eclipse, Eclipse, post-Eclipse. So choosing "W-SF-W" means that you'll cast Wrath to proc Eclipse, Starfire during Eclipse, and Wrath again during the cooldown. Note that this field DOES NOT UPDATE when you switch your filler type, and the post-Eclipse selection should always match your filler, so if you switch from, say Wrath Spam to Starfire Spam, you will need to re-select your Eclipse Rotation Type, or it will assume you're casting SF-W-SF (W-SF-W if you're using Wrath filler).

v1.1.2 also include a couple scaling fixes, Int and Lunar Guidance being the big ones. It'll be up on the OP in a couple minutes.

crmccar · 12/12/08, 6:00 PM

Originally Posted by Adoriele

This is what the Eclipse Rotation Type selector is for, though I know it's a bit hard to understand what I'm getting at with that, so I've updated how it displays the rotation: When choosing an Eclipse Rotation Type, the form is pre-Eclipse, Eclipse, post-Eclipse. So choosing "W-SF-W" means that you'll cast Wrath to proc Eclipse, Starfire during Eclipse, and Wrath again during the cooldown. Note that this field DOES NOT UPDATE when you switch your filler type, and the post-Eclipse selection should always match your filler, so if you switch from, say Wrath Spam to Starfire Spam, you will need to re-select your Eclipse Rotation Type, or it will assume you're casting SF-W-SF (W-SF-W if you're using Wrath filler).

v1.1.2 also include a couple scaling fixes, Int and Lunar Guidance being the big ones. It'll be up on the OP in a couple minutes.

Ok, thanks for answering that. What still confuses me though is that none of the numbers change for the "filler" rotations when i change my eclipse rotation type - only the "spam" rotations do. If I'm understanding your explanation correctly, the "filler" numbers should change too.

• Adoriele · 12/12/08, 6:03 PM

Originally Posted by crmccar

Ok, thanks for answering that. What still confuses me though is that none of the numbers change for the "filler" rotations when i change my eclipse rotation type - only the "spam" rotations do. If I'm understanding your explanation correctly, the "filler" numbers should change too.

Eclipse is not fully-implemented for those rotations yet. It's been mentioned a few times, including the OP.

thedopefishlives · 12/13/08, 12:24 PM

Originally Posted by Adoriele

Eclipse is not fully-implemented for those rotations yet. It's been mentioned a few times, including the OP.

If you want some numbers for the "filler" rotations and Eclipse, you can try Rawr. I cannot guarantee that the math is 100% accurate, but it should at least give you a ballpark figure for how much benefit Eclipse will give you.