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02/13/10, 7:47 AM
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#766
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Druid
Lightbringer (EU)
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Litch: apart from generally low level items which are certainly gimping your threat output (doubly so for the weapon slot, which would be by far the largest jump should you upgrade it), the set you're wearing on armory is extremely stamina oriented. While it certainly has its place on a hard hitting boss with rogues and hunters giving you bonus threat, in most other circumstances it's really overkill - at the expense of threat generation and avoidance. You may want to consider swapping (quite) a few DPS-oriented pieces in, every time your survival doesn't feel threatened.
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02/13/10, 5:28 PM
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#767
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Druid
Antonidas
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I also ran into the AOE threat problem as well.
My solution, which has been working wonders, is the following.
This is assuming that you slave Maul in macros to Lacerate, Mangle, and Swipe as well as gylph Maul.
1) Select your target and hit Lacerate+Maul
2) Swipe+Maul twice in a row.
3) Cycle through steps 1 and 2 and drop in a Mangle+Maul if you want..
If you gylphed for Maul and have 3 or more enemies, hit Enrage and go through the cycle. This will ensure that Maul is hitting as many people as possible and generating a large threat lead.
Typically, DPS will pull off to you if they are not assisting off of you. In the realm of PUGs, this is quite common.
As stated before, getting the Expertise Cap and Hit cap will also work wonders for aggro generation, but the cycle above will help cement it.
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02/13/10, 6:55 PM
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#768
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Von Kaiser
Tauren Druid
Alleria (EU)
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Additionally to Argatha's proposal, in heavy AE situations I'm constantly tabbing (and Shift-Tabbing) through all enemies, watching Threatmeter to find targets where I am low on threat and/or dd's coming close, so I can get some more threat on those targets via Maul and maybe Mangle. If you identify 2 targets where you need more threat, check if there's a melee second on the aggro list and hit that mob first.
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02/14/10, 7:38 PM
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#769
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Druid
Steamwheedle Cartel (EU)
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Best solution for threat problems with big groups is using nameplates with visible threat. (Aloft is good mod to get beater visual effects)
When you got some mob that is near to lost threat on him glow of nameplate will change, you will have couple of second to reaction (taunt or simply dmg him more).
Additional benefit will be that you see what mobs are tanking by you (some can by tanks by other tanks) and you can focus only on your targets.
BTW some times is good to use Berserker on trash, free boost of threat on demand.
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02/15/10, 9:05 AM
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#770
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King Hippo
Tauren Druid
Twisting Nether (EU)
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Due to the way our raid days work (we don't raid on Weds) and some attendance issues, we're starting our first serious LK attempts tonight after a couple of short tries at P1.
How do others at this stage feel about HP levels for tanking the LK? It's probably going to be my job and at present nothing has really required that I optimize in a particular direction, therefore I am using a mix of 30sta, 10agi/15sta and 20agi or 10agi/10hit gems (see my armory)
This leaves me around the 54-55k mark depending on trinkets and I'm thinking this isn't really going to cut it. Do you think it's worth me quickly going for 30sta gems across the board to make things easier for the healers?
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02/15/10, 9:09 AM
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#771
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Glass Joe
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hit vs expertise
So my roommate was showing me one of the higher end druids from the Dethecus server and I noticed that he had 155 hit rating and 40 expertise. My question is, if you can't be dodged or parried, is it OK to miss a few times, or should I focus on not missing with a chance to be parried? I'm currently sitting right below the soft cap for expertise(which I believe it's 25), and at 275 hit rating(looking to replace my pants and chest).
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02/15/10, 9:34 AM
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#772
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Don Flamenco
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Originally Posted by Daboran
Due to the way our raid days work (we don't raid on Weds) and some attendance issues, we're starting our first serious LK attempts tonight after a couple of short tries at P1.
How do others at this stage feel about HP levels for tanking the LK? It's probably going to be my job and at present nothing has really required that I optimize in a particular direction, therefore I am using a mix of 30sta, 10agi/15sta and 20agi or 10agi/10hit gems (see my armory)
This leaves me around the 54-55k mark depending on trinkets and I'm thinking this isn't really going to cut it. Do you think it's worth me quickly going for 30sta gems across the board to make things easier for the healers?
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I think you will want to go full-on Stamina for this encounter. Our main LK tank is a DK, and there were plenty of times where his health pool was just a bit too low. LK can do some HUGE hits, so a very large HP pool (~65k or so) can be extremely helpful. If I were tanking this encounter I'd go all Stam
hit vs expertise
So my roommate was showing me one of the higher end druids from the Dethecus server and I noticed that he had 155 hit rating and 40 expertise. My question is, if you can't be dodged or parried, is it OK to miss a few times, or should I focus on not missing with a chance to be parried? I'm currently sitting right below the soft cap for expertise(which I believe it's 25), and at 275 hit rating(looking to replace my pants and chest).
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Hit and Expertise both work out to be pretty similar in tanking situations (I'm assuming you're talking tanking based on your armory); both stats are mainly there for threat generation, as the "parry-haste" mechanic that wrecked so much havoc in BC is largely missing from most WotLK bosses. I personally like to have a decent amount of hit so that my Growls don't miss as often (though when I simply can't afford to miss a taunt I use Glyph of Growl in place of Maul), but Expertise is just money for threat. A balance is nice, and there are no specific "soft/hard cap" numbers to really shoot for as a tank, but rather you get enough so that your threat is where you need it to be.
Last edited by Daenerys : 02/15/10 at 9:41 AM.
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02/15/10, 9:51 AM
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#773
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Mr. Sandman
Night Elf Druid
Argent Dawn (EU)
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Originally Posted by Oldmcdonald
So my roommate was showing me one of the higher end druids from the Dethecus server and I noticed that he had 155 hit rating and 40 expertise. My question is, if you can't be dodged or parried, is it OK to miss a few times, or should I focus on not missing with a chance to be parried? I'm currently sitting right below the soft cap for expertise(which I believe it's 25), and at 275 hit rating(looking to replace my pants and chest).
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I've never been worried about being below hit cap for a long time. It depends on the fight really. Fights like Heroic: Deathwhisper you really don't want to be missing anything so I was drafting in some DPS gear to reach hit capped and some DPS trinkets to max threat. Most fights though you'll get the Tricks/MD's though so threat isn't much of an issue.
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02/15/10, 10:30 AM
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#774
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Von Kaiser
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Originally Posted by Daboran
Due to the way our raid days work (we don't raid on Weds) and some attendance issues, we're starting our first serious LK attempts tonight after a couple of short tries at P1.
How do others at this stage feel about HP levels for tanking the LK? It's probably going to be my job and at present nothing has really required that I optimize in a particular direction, therefore I am using a mix of 30sta, 10agi/15sta and 20agi or 10agi/10hit gems (see my armory)
This leaves me around the 54-55k mark depending on trinkets and I'm thinking this isn't really going to cut it. Do you think it's worth me quickly going for 30sta gems across the board to make things easier for the healers?
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This is a fight you purely want to go for stam given the mechanics. When off tanking there is no incoming damage that is really a threat, with the exception of multiple shambling horrors enraging at the same time and hunters being slow on tranq (but that is what barkskin is for).
The main threat is Soul Reaper which hits for ~40K upfront, another ~40K in 5 seconds and gives the Lich King a brief +100% damage buff once it goes off. Once spirits are down you and the other tank should be swapping for this and using a cooldown if you are the one taking the increased Lich King damage. However even with Barkskin up I would take hits well over 30K and up to 40K, at which point you need a health pool that can take 2 of those with only some hots/earthshield/shield giving some cushion rather than hoping you avoid or a holy light and another heal hit you before the next swing.
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02/15/10, 4:51 PM
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#775
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Glass Joe
Tauren Druid
Burning Legion
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I haven't seen this brought up yet, and Druids that I've asked on my server just think I'm an idiot for even suggesting it, but...
Is it feasible to tank with Cryptmaker? I was trying to figure out a way to stay at the hit cap without losing too much. The only suggestions so far on these forums have been to use necks/rings/cloaks with hit. I was trying to find a solution that would allow me to keep all the bonus armor on those pieces, and Cryptmaker seems to be it. In fact, this gives me the option of going with Armor Neck, Cloak, Ring + Ashen ring, or Armor Neck, Cloak, Ring, any other ring I choose + Hit food and one Vivid in place of a Tear.
Not to mention Cryptmaker has higher threat and higher EH, at the cost of only 2% Dodge. To me it seems like a much better solution for staying hit capped than losing ~1.5k armor.
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02/15/10, 5:33 PM
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#776
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King Hippo
Night Elf Druid
Blackhand
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Originally Posted by Bonemage
This is a fight you purely want to go for stam given the mechanics. When off tanking there is no incoming damage that is really a threat, with the exception of multiple shambling horrors enraging at the same time and hunters being slow on tranq (but that is what barkskin is for).
The main threat is Soul Reaper which hits for ~40K upfront, another ~40K in 5 seconds and gives the Lich King a brief +100% damage buff once it goes off. Once spirits are down you and the other tank should be swapping for this and using a cooldown if you are the one taking the increased Lich King damage. However even with Barkskin up I would take hits well over 30K and up to 40K, at which point you need a health pool that can take 2 of those with only some hots/earthshield/shield giving some cushion rather than hoping you avoid or a holy light and another heal hit you before the next swing.
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Just a note its 100% increased haste not 100% damage (I think 100% damage would probably be one shotting our warrior tank). One of the easier ways to mitigate this is to ranged taunt the Lich King and then when he gets to the far tank have the MT ranged taunt back. You negate almost the entire 5 second window that way which is much safer then eating the 27-30k dps the lich king starts outputting when he has that buff.
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02/15/10, 10:59 PM
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#777
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Von Kaiser
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Barkskin + Enrage
Does the first 20% reduction from barkskin diminish the 12% reduced by 4P enrage? or is it just a flat 32% reduction?
As well as the other way around.
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02/16/10, 1:51 AM
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#778
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Glass Joe
Goblin Warrior
Anetheron (EU)
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Since it's percentage based, it stacks additive. Flat 32% if you pop both.
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02/16/10, 3:25 AM
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#779
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Glass Joe
Tauren Druid
Balnazzar (EU)
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Originally Posted by dmw
Since it's percentage based, it stacks additive. Flat 32% if you pop both.
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This is very powerful when tanking the Lich King in either 10/25. Personally in 10 I can tank him almost the whole fight (I require one break to help CD's reset, where our warrior will taunt and shield wall a 'Soul Reaper'). Combine Barkskin and Enrage about 2-3 seconds before Reaper hits, to mitigate both portions of damage. Then 30 seconds after use Survival Instincts to coast through the next one. I combine Frenzied Regeneration glyphed with my Juggernauts 'on use' and then rinse repeat. This allowed our warrior OT to happily provide extra stuns and deal with any leftover ragings on our first kills in 10/25 this week.
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02/16/10, 7:51 AM
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#780
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Piston Honda
Tauren Druid
Draenor (EU)
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Originally Posted by dmw
Since it's percentage based, it stacks additive. Flat 32% if you pop both.
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Do you have any evidence for this? Alot of other mechanics that use percentage-modifiers stack multiplicatively, so it's not at all obvious that 4T10-Enrage stacks additively with Barkskin.
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