Hey, all!

I wanted to visualize cat dps priorities into something more or less compact for new players. Although it's format may be more useful for different simulation programs. It is cyclic and with each cycle it should do something and go back to beginning. It is build on simple IF operator. The result is below.

Surely people who run simulations, have something like this, but maybe not in visual format.
It's not perfect since it still have 1 OR operator which can work in 3 cases currently. It is not a very big dps loss though, so it is there to simplify chart. I should also squeeze Clearcasting somewhere near beginning in next version. It should display logic that is more or less equal to logic of player who is making decisions during actual boss fight. It is also not considering really complex things described in the article on page 1. You should also refer to article if you want full insight.

Its nice that someone made a visual graph of the feral rotation. A have a few things to note:

1. In the (no,no,yes,yes,no) box you ask "Have 35 energy?". I think you mean 20 energy since you're trying to do rip.

2. In both the lower left and lower right "finishing move trees" where you suggest ferocious bite I think that would probably lead to too many bites. While losing a few seconds of rip uptime in exchange of a bite is beneficial, its a very close margin and often times requires on either lucky ooc procs or a tiger's fury to recover without too much loss.

3. On the box where you suggest "Shred or Savage Roar" on the lower right finish move tree, its possible that you could pool energy instead. If you are below 40 energy and you have 8 seconds left on both roar and rip anyway, if you were to pool the energy for a second or two longer you can benefit from the roar time that you would have been losing. Its important to note that in that case it may be the global cooldown that determines when you roar. You need to make sure you have enough time to get the combo points before the rip falls off.

4. I think a lot of the "Is Savage Roar Up" boxes could be replaced with "Will Savage Roar be up in 1 second?" boxes. Its important to maintain as close to 100% uptime as possible on roar as opposed to rip and rake where you don't want to clip them.

5. You don't include desynching of roar and rip. It might be something you don't include intentionally depending on your target audience. It might be something to put in a footnote or to keep two copies, a simplified and a complex flowchart.

6. There are some paths that don't check for tiger's fury. Ex (no,no,yes,yes,yes,no,no,no).

As a stylistic choice, I think it would be easier to read if the lines that go to the same place were merged. Specifically the 3 arrows that go to the "Is Savage Roar Up?" box just northeast of #1.

Nice version 1.

Hi, thanks for feedback.

I intentionally haven't included complex things like desynching SR and Rip, because it would make chart really big and complex. I agree with your other points though, will see what i can do with them.

From actually using it, I have found that the proc rate for BM is about the same on a long fight (LK) as the proc rate for mongoose. The advantage is that because it's a 10/45 style proc, it procs with very specific frequency, which allows for some nice lining up of procs. For instance, it aligns perfectly with the bloodlust at the start of LK, giving even more haste and resulting in a lot of white damage early on. That it also aligns with most trinkets is a nice touch too. It procs almost immediately upon coming out of throne room in P3 as well.

In terms of number of procs, I've found that to be very similar compared to mongoose; I would average around 15 procs in a LK fight, and I'd get 15 procs of BM roughly depending on if I was picked up or not. Every calculator I've seen sees 250 haste/10 sec over 120 agi/30 haste for 15. They're close, but I like the synergy with the bloodlusts and the predictability of the procs.

I don't understand your point of view with the frostmourne room example. Let's say that it is 30 sec upstairs, and 30 sec downstairs. For a 10/45 or a 15/60 the result is the same : you get one proc each upstair phase, which is better that a normal fight with more proc for the 10/45. It is the same thing with 45sec upstairs/30sec downstairs. But actually it is more 60sec/30sec so you have reasonable chances to get something like 20,25sec uptime in one upstair phase.

But anyway I think that it is quite difficult to compare a ppm enchant and an internal CD enchant

Mongoose isn't a 15/60 though. It's a PPM mechanic. What that means is that the chance of it proccing is a percentage based on your base weapon speed, but it can theoretically proc off of any attack. And it has no internal CD, so if you're lucky it can proc many times in a row. Conversely, if you're unlucky it can proc never.

Whereas black magic has a high percentage chance to proc, but has an internal CD that prevents it from proccing too much.

This hurts PPM mechanics simply because you have fewer chances to trigger the proc when you're doing something like 30 seconds on, 30 seconds off. For a ICD mechanic it doesn't matter significantly, as it will almost always proc as soon as you come up. Put it another way: given a patter of 30 sec on, 30 sec off, and given a 10/45 vs a PPM, in a 3 minute period the 10/45 will very likely trigger 4 times (it's almost a certainty). Assuming that the average proc rate for the PPM is 4 in a 3-minute period of only attacking, the chances of it proccing in that same scenario have been halved due to the lack of action for half the time.

Since I find that World of Logs or other "generic" log analyzers do an insufficient job at visualizing the events which are important for feral DPS, I've developed a small program which does combat log visualization and analysis aimed at the feral DPS spec.

It's an alpha version, so you should expect trouble. Also, I develop on linux, so I can ensure that the program runs fine with my setup (g++ 4.3.3, libQt 4.6.2).
There's a lot of stuff which should be added, starting with more trinkets, as the program atm only tracks a few of them.

Still, the program is usable and I'd be interested in hearing any feedback/ideas/problems.

You can download it from here: RWF download directory

Read the readme file before downloading. If you're on linux or plan to rebuild the executable yourself you only need the src.tar.gz, otherwise you will need both the winexe.zip and the required DLLs (which is big). If you already have Qt4.6 installed you don't need the libraries. If you opt for the exe, scan it for virus/malware. I don't develop on windows and the machine I used for compilation of the exe is behind a paranoid firewall, but that's all the protection it has.

I just sent the last 4 posts to the shitcan. Here's the deal: If you're using words like "pretty sure" "I think" or "this should be", you're doing it wrong. Post data/testing to back it up because posting conjecture is not remotely constructive to the topic at hand. Failure to do this will result in infractions/temporary bans until I feel like the point has been adequately absorbed.

The chance of BM never procing is also there sadly as i found looking at this resets fights. --->My Logs<---

I 3rd tank all the other fights which is why nothing will show on them.

Wait, what? The proc chance on black magic is so high that the chance of never seeing a proc (assuming you are capable of proccing it at all) is effectively zero. At a 35% proc rate, the chance of not seeing a proc in just 10 attacks that can proc it (shreds, etc) is only 3%. In your sindragosa attempt, you have more than 100 shreds - the chance of not seeing a proc in 100 shreds is less than 1 in a trillion. Clearly you either unequipped the weapon that was enchanted with BM, changed spec, or there was some other sort of tomfoolery going on.

Please I hope someone sees and replies to this, as this is making me slightly hated by my fellow guild-mates.

Hypothetically:
There's a staff/polearm that drops in ICC. Me ( A kitty druid ) and a hunter are eligible to roll/bid on this item. Do I not get priority over this weapon? considering that we have the same iLvl weapon.

I've been lead to believe that the weapon DAMAGE ie. 1000-2000 does affect your kitty's melee damage. Same with the weapon dps. Having a 800-1500 damage weapon would decrease your melee damage. Thus making this weapon more SUITABLE for me since I can benefit more from it since I actually use it for my melee damage, as hunters use it as a stat stick.

I had an argument with my guild whether or not the damage and dps on a weapon effects my dps/melee damage. Me being a long time feral kitty I was getting mad and decided to clear this up on here. Please help!

That was my thoughts too. The weapon was equipped and not broken. The only other weapon i carry on me is my tanking weapon and that has mongoose on it. As there we no mongoose procs then that isn't the case either.
My rake/rip tick damage isn't much different from my other fights, where the log shows BM procs, so the weapon and the 4kish FAP is gives me was there and in effect.

Perhaps the logs messed up?

I notice that the 3 fights where BM did not proc all occurred in a row. I don't recall ever running into a problem with the combat log missing one specific spell randomly in the middle of a parse, so most likely you have a 3rd weapon without an enchant (or possibly an enchant that doesn't proc, like Scourgebane) that you had equipped for those fights, or you've discovered a bug that prevents BM from proccing. Which isn't entirely unlikely when you consider the fact that BM proccing on Shred and Mangle in the first place is likely a bug as well, but I would lean towards you simply having the wrong weapon equipped for those bosses.

Looking over the logs a bit, something happened that caused it to stop proccing. If you look at the logs, there is a gap in BM procs from your death on Sindragosa#1 until 1 min after Blood Princes die. You don't have any Mongoose procs until Putricide, so you didn't equip your tanking weapon. Also, your dps was similar, so it doesn't look like you un-equipped your weapon to save repairs and then forgot to put it back on. It also comes back on after Princes when you went back to dps.

Is it possible that somehow your death on Sindragosa somehow broke the weapon enchant until you re-equipped it after Princes? It's either that or you equipped some other non-proccing weapon; no Mongoose, BM, or Berserk in that time.

Been testing out a new opening which appears to give higher DPS on fights where you can reliably estimate time until engagement, and don't have to move significantly to get to the boss.

It centres around using Gift of the Wild to proc Clearcasting (GotW appears to have a % chance per member of the raid)

Time
-8 Gift of the Wild
-7 GotW again if clearcasting isn't up.
-6 Cat Form
-2 Haste Pot
-1 Stealth
0 Ravage

If you need to get to the boss, shift haste pot and stealth back one second and use Feral charge (does not consume clearcasting).

Any ability that procs Clearcasting could be used, there's no need for Gotw (particularly since it uses a reagent and has a high mana cost) although you claim it has a far higher chance of proccing Omen than a normal spell, I will try to test that later if someone else doesn't get there first I'll just assume you're correct for now. I also assume you use Ravage instead of mangle to make best use of the 'free' attack even though Ravage is suboptimal?

If you want to proc Omen more than I suggest you use abilities during downtimes such as waiting to renew SR or Rip falling off. I make a habit of using Natures Grasp when I'm not doing anything else as it has a chance to proc it, I use Barkskin as well on fights where I don't need it for survivability. I can't say it makes a noticable difference to my dps but an extra shred per fight is always appreciated.

I've been doing something similar to this for quite some time now; I thought it was well known. The only difference is that I'm using the OOC proc for a free mangle at the beginning of the fight instead of ravage, since it allows you to get your first rip up that much more quickly.

We've been using it on Heroic LK during Valk phases for extra swipes.

Swipe till no energy, GotW Macro, where the first press casts GotW on the raid, and then the second press shifts back to cat form. Swipe once with the OOC proc from GotW, then swipe again with the energy you've regenerated, repeat. It is excellent.

It is quite useful anywhere you don't have enough targets to keep constant OOC procs flowing, assuming it is still beneficial to swipe.

Anyone able to do cost-benefit analysis of doing GotW under 20 energy for shreds during combat? It breaks auto-swing obviously, but you do get extra combo points and delicious shreds.
For my own gear it appears to be viable to increase DPS (except for the excessive reagent cost).
Lose a few white swings (3?) @ 5k damage each + OoC chances for those swings, gain a shred (24k?)...

I'll post a log later, I've been doing it this week with FRAPS but this could be very interesting if we still have OoC in Cataclysm, and also if the ratio of special attacks to auto changes favorably.

Also would like to know if the proc rate of OoC on GotW is affected by pets (from my experience it feels like it does).

This has some fairly huge implications if it is viable (changes in priority list timings due to extra CP to maximise dps).

Assuming perfect reaction time, you'll lose 4 melee hits at the least (melee hits with buffs and ICC-level gear are around .7 speed). The OoC proc loss is obviously a wash. Assuming you're doing it below x-30 energy, where x is how much furor you have (so with 3 points you should do it below 30 energy) it should be a gain provided that you get that OoC proc. Which isn't guaranteed.

It's probably viable, but the actual gain is very slight. It almost certainly isn't a good choice in 10-mans where the chance of an OoC proc off of GoTW is closer to 40-50%.

In cataclysm the choice is tremendously worse given the emphasis of savage roar on damaging autoattacks only vs. specials, at least right now.

You're spending one GCD outside of cat form; that's about 1.25 seconds assuming ~12% spell haste (~16% melee haste) and the 5% and 3% raid buffs. However, this isn't the bottleneck for autoattacks; the bottleneck is your weapon attack speed outside of cat form. GotW resets the swing timer, and you're now in caster form, so a caster form attack timer begins. A staff generally has base attack duration ~2.4 seconds; a polearm generally has base attack duration ~3.4 seconds. That's about 1.7 and 2.4 seconds respectively with 16% haste and the 20% and 3% raid buffs (the amount required for a 0.7 second swing timer in cat form). Assuming a cat form attack duration of .7 seconds, you're losing on average .5 + 1.7/.7 - 1 = 1.9 attacks with a staff, or .5 + 2.4/.7 - 1 = 2.9 attacks with a polearm. I add 0.5 because on average you'll interrupt the attack timer halfway; I subtract 1 because we've counted the full time between two successive autoattacks, which would have occurred at the normal separation (not 0 separation) otherwise. Of course, this conclusion is actually independent of haste, since we're just taking the ratio of two hasted attack durations.

Conclusions: You lose on average <weapon speed> - .5 (minimum <weapon speed> - 1) autoattacks per GotW, where <weapon speed> is the listed "speed" (really duration) of your equipped weapon. For example, a typical staff might cost you 1.9 autoattacks per GotW while a typical polearm might cost you 2.9 autoattacks per GotW.

Assumptions: Casting GotW resets the caster form swing timer, which persists into cat form. I have tested this fairly rigorously and am confident it is true. Here is a combat log excerpt I produced just now on a training dummy to demonstrate this:


Edit:

Here is a primitive analysis of the viability of using GotW in a single-target rotation, in my gear. I am using Distant Land, which has a 2.4 second attack duration, so I lose on average 1.9 attacks per GotW. If GotW hits 28 targets (25 players, 3 pets - probably a low estimate for a 25-man raid), then GotW has a 1-(1-3.5/60)^28 = 81.4% chance to proc clearcasting. I will ignore combo points and assume the clearcast is used to shred. Hence, casting GotW is worth .814(shred damage) - 1.9[(melee damage)+3.5/60(shred damage)]. According to Rawr, my shred does 14926 average damage per swing while my melee does 3315 average damage per swing. Thus, GotW is worth 4197 damage in this estimate.

If I were using Oathbinder (3.6 second attack duration), then I'd lose 3.1 attacks per GotW and in this case each GotW would be worth -826 damage in this estimate -- a loss.

I've been trying to avoid all Cataclysm discussion and 4.0.1 discussion for as long as possible as to not be spoiled, but I guess with the impending release of patch 4.0.1, it's time to start looking at rotations.

Just looking at the new talents, It seems that Ravage will finally have a use on our bars. Just from my initial glance, this appears to the be the DPS spec I'd use at 80

WoW Talent Calculator - Sigrie

Ravage would appear to be our opener now, with a solid 100% crit (Assuming 50% crit from gear, perhaps a bit lower at entry level 85 gear), and also Ravage would be usable on every Feral Charge. So in ICC, I'd be able to Ravage multiple times on every fight with the exception of Saurfang and Festergut.

While that part seems solid, one change that absolutely baffles me is the Endless Carnage talent. I'd consider our best set bonuses throughout this expansion being 4pc T10, 4pc T8, and 2pc T9. This new talent seems to be an essential combination of 4pc T8 and 2pc T9, only buffed versions of them. My question is, will this overly simplify our rotation like I think it will? At crit cap in heroic ICC gear, it just seems like they're removing the variables from our rotation with this talent.

I'm not sure how it will work out at 85 with scaling, but for the 2 or so months we have left to play in ICC, it just seems like that our rotation will be spamming Ferocious Bites while barely having to worry about keeping up Savage Roar or Rake as much due to the increased timers. I remember back in Ulduar, part of the reason DPS felt so easy back then was due to our 4pc set bonus. That extra 8 seconds turns a 1-2 CP SR into 3-4 CP SR. Correct me if I'm wrong, but will our DPS rotation essentially remain the same, only with the ability to use Ferocious Bite in between almost every refresh of Savage Roar and the usage of Ravage on Feral Charges?