Visualising the optimal cat rotation ingame - Page 11

RareBeast · 03/11/10, 6:06 PM

The two box system seemed really confusing initially, but after using it for a bit I find it an excellent solution. Hearing that FaceRoller only pops up when you need to press it basically makes it not worth it for me. The Ovale boxes being greyed out and showing a "cooldown" to the next action allows me to be far more accurate and doesn't rely on my shoddy reflexes to get things right.

So i'll put in a big vote for the Ovale version, although perhaps someone can look at the differences in the code of FaceRoller and Ovale and work out optimisations that the Ovale devs might include to increase it's performance.

fatalsaint · 03/11/10, 6:35 PM

Originally Posted by RareBeast

So i'll put in a big vote for the Ovale version, although perhaps someone can look at the differences in the code of FaceRoller and Ovale and work out optimisations that the Ovale devs might include to increase it's performance.

My hope, if I get some time, is to write my own small box to accompany the main FR box that will show the "next" action instead of an "off" action/filler button like in Furions.

So essentially you'll always see the next two actions (in theory).. the one you're doing, then the next one, as you do the one the next one pops into the box. It'll actually look like it "rotate's".

Unless there's nothing to do, you'll get the teacup in the main window with the "next" action in the smaller box until it's time to use it.

At least, that's currently whats in my head. Coding it on the other hand.....

With Faceroller it won't be as simple as just adding a box like with Ovale, it will all be custom LUA to do it in... essentially this starts making the Feral Druid Faceroller module almost an Addon in and of itself that just happens to use Faceroller.

I don't know how long this will take me though. Or if I'll be able to do it.

Twong · 03/11/10, 6:36 PM

Originally Posted by minekomineko

As of the latest WoW patch and Ovale version 3.3.30, I'm having problems with Furion's script version 2.8, specifically during berserk. During berserk, usually it's best to spam shred as much as possible while keeping bleeds, SR, and mangle up, but I don't think the script recognizes that berserk has been used, because it continues to suggest pooling energy as if berserk weren't active. It's only a minor inconvenience because it's only a matter of remembering to continue shredding even if the addon does not suggest to do so.

Was this due the newer version of ovale? I noticed this happening as well. So i was doing as minekomineko does and just shred as much as possible during my zerks.

stygma33 · 03/12/10, 9:13 AM

I really appreciate all the work you guys are doing with this, i like Furion's 4 button option better than the 1 box option. Especially whne you enable scrolling.

The 2 button Faceroller option sounds promising as well.

My question is, for those of you good with code, why not rework Facemauler or Feral by Night, which already has the suggestion boxes and a lot more, the code just needs to be updated to 3.2 then 3.3 and T10? I've been able to go in there and add cooldown timers for the Ashen Ring proc, and my skills consist of opening up the script and tinkering. So I know there are others out there way better suited.

fatalsaint · 03/12/10, 11:16 AM

Originally Posted by stygma33

My question is, for those of you good with code, why not rework Facemauler or Feral by Night, which already has the suggestion boxes and a lot more, the code just needs to be updated to 3.2 then 3.3 and T10? I've been able to go in there and add cooldown timers for the Ashen Ring proc, and my skills consist of opening up the script and tinkering. So I know there are others out there way better suited.

From my perspective, I opened and looked through FBN.... it's massive.

Far beyond my understanding or knowledge of the mechanics of the game, and maintaining a script that size is not something I have the time to do. It has special code for different bosses and tons of checks for skills of other classes that I've never played.

It's easier for me to start over, and slowly build something back up adding what people want/need. The project may eventually get that big.. but starting there would be beyond me at the moment.

Walk before you run type of thing..

stygma33 · 03/12/10, 2:04 PM

Completely understandable, and I really appreciate what you guys are doing. Have you looked at facemauler? That is the slimmed down only worrying about rotation tool that FBN was based off of.

Either way, you guys are making my life easier and I appreciate it.

minekomineko · 03/12/10, 8:05 PM

I tested Fatalsaint's Ovale script last night in ICC25, and it only has one issue that I saw. It was repeatedly telling me to apply rake, even when rake was most definitely already applied. Other than that, it works pretty well.

fatalsaint · 03/12/10, 8:15 PM

Originally Posted by minekomineko

I tested Fatalsaint's Ovale script last night in ICC25, and it only has one issue that I saw. It was repeatedly telling me to apply rake, even when rake was most definitely already applied. Other than that, it works pretty well.

Good Catch! It's this code!

#actions+=/rake,time_to_die>=9
unless {TargetDebuffPresent(RAKE mine=1) or TargetDeadIn(less 10)} Spell(RAKE)

Which says that if your rake isn't present.. or the target is dead in more than 10 seconds.. then rake

.

that should read:

#actions+=/rake,time_to_die>=9
unless {TargetDebuffPresent(RAKE mine=1)} if TargetDeadIn(more 8) Spell(RAKE)

Fixed original.

Leafkiller · 03/14/10, 3:33 AM

@fatalsaint

I did a side by side test of your Faceroller implementation vs. your Ovale script (with structural modifications I will describe below). I noticed some difference in behavior - it looks like the timing for when to clip Savage Roar is different (it kicks in earlier in Ovale by 1-2 seconds). Also, as you observed the refresh rate seems faster on Faceroller - which warns for a refresh of rake sooner (good) and also slips in some extra Shreds (which may or may not be a good thing since it can overlap half a GCD when Mangle/Rake are about to drop). I did see one case during Berserk where Faceroller was asking for continuous Shreds rather than refreshing Rake (which Ovale was requesting) but in subsequent tests I was not able to reproduce that.

I am wondering if you changed the timing in the Faceroller script for the Savage Roar clipping based on your Simcraft testing or if you just coded it differently, as the difference looks to large to me to be script execution speed.

Structurally I moved the TF/Berserk icons to the left and always display them so I can see their cooldowns, removed the trinket boxes since no high level cat trinket has an on use function at present, added an empty main box which I overlayed with the Faceroller box, and added an extra main box to the right with fillers removed - sort of a prediction box. I find it easier to have a box that includes main skills + fillers and one with no fillers vs. what Furion uses where he has one box for the main skills with another for fillers. Here is your script with my mods to it (I added a notation to the version string so I can see which version I have in Ovale):

# Fatalsaints Feral Cat DPS Ovale Script v1FixedRakeWhitespacesTabs Leafv1.2
#
# Based on SimulationCraft actions
# http://elitistjerks.com/f73/t81052-best_possible_feral_dps_simulationcraft
#
# Source:
# http://elitistjerks.com/f73/t84378-visualising_optimal_cat_rotation_ingame/p10/#248
# -----------------------------------------------------------------------

Define(FFF 16857)
Define(FF 770)
Define(RIP 1079)
Define(MANGLE 33876)
Define(SHRED 5221)
Define(TIGER 5217)
Define(RAKE 59886)
Define(ROAR 52610)
Define(BITE 22568)
Define(BERSERK 50334)
Define(OMEN 16870)
Define(TRAUMA 46857)
Define(MANGLEB 33878)
SpellInfo(RIP resetcounter=ripshreds)
SpellInfo(SHRED inccounter=ripshreds)

AddCheckBox(CheckBoxTF "Suggest Tiger's Fury")
AddCheckBox(CheckBoxFF "Suggest Faerie Fire")
AddCheckBox(CheckBoxBk "Suggest Berserk")
AddCheckBox(CheckBoxMangle "Suggest Mangle")

AddIcon help=cd size=small
{
	if Stance(3) {
		Spell(TIGER priority=4)
	}
}

AddIcon help=cd size=small
{
	if Stance(3) {
    	Spell(BERSERK)
    }
}
AddIcon help=main {
}
AddIcon help=main {
	if Stance(3) { # Cat Form
		# actions+=/faerie_fire_feral,debuff_only=1
		if {CheckBoxOn(CheckBoxFF)} and {TargetDebuffExpires(FFF 0) and TargetDebuffExpires(FF 0)} Spell(FFF)
		
		# actions+=/tigers_fury,energy<=30,berserk=0
		if {CheckBoxOn(CheckBoxTF) and BuffExpires(BERSERK 0) and Mana(less 35)} Spell(TIGER)
		
		# actions+=/berserk_cat,energy>=80,energy<=90
		if {CheckBoxOn(CheckBoxBk) and Mana(more 79) and Mana(less 91)} Spell(BERSERK)
		
		# actions+=/savage_roar,cp>=1,savage_roar<=1
		if {ComboPoints(more 0) and BuffExpires(ROAR 0)} Spell(ROAR)
		
		# actions+=/savage_roar,if=buff.combo_points.stack>=3&dot.rip.remains-buff.savage_roar.remains>=0&buff.savage_roar.remains<=8
		if {ComboPoints(more 2) and TargetDebuffPresent(RIP mine=1) and more than 1s between TargetDebuffExpires(RIP mine=1) and BuffExpires(ROAR)} unless BuffPresent(ROAR 9) Spell(ROAR)
		
		# actions+=/savage_roar,if=buff.combo_points.stack>=3&buff.savage_roar.remains-dot.rip.remains<=3&buff.savage_roar.remains<=8
		if {ComboPoints(more 2) and TargetDebuffPresent(RIP mine=1) and at most 3s between BuffExpires(ROAR) and TargetDebuffExpires(RIP mine=1)} unless BuffPresent(ROAR 9) Spell(ROAR)
		
		# actions+=/shred,cp<=4,extend_rip=1,rip<=3
		if {ComboPoints(less 4) and TargetDebuffPresent(RIP mine=1) and TargetDebuffExpires(RIP 4 mine=1) and Counter(ripshreds less 3)} Spell(SHRED)
		
		# actions+=/rip,cp>=5,time_to_die>=6
		# actions+=/ferocious_bite,cp>=5,time_to_die<=6
		# actions+=/ferocious_bite,cp>=5,rip>=8,savage_roar>=11
		if {ComboPoints(more 4)} {
			if {TargetDeadIn(less 7) or {TargetDebuffPresent(RIP 8 mine=1) and BuffPresent(ROAR 11)}} Spell(BITE)
			if {TargetDeadIn(more 5) and TargetDebuffExpires(RIP 0 mine=1)} Spell(RIP)
		}
		
		# actions+=/mangle_cat,mangle<=1
		if CheckBoxOn(CheckBoxMangle) and {TargetDebuffExpires(MANGLE 1) and TargetDebuffExpires(MANGLEB 1) and TargetDebuffExpires(TRAUMA 1)} Spell(MANGLE)
		
		# actions+=/rake,time_to_die>=9
		unless {TargetDebuffPresent(RAKE mine=1)} if TargetDeadIn(more 8) Spell(RAKE)
		
		# actions+=/shred,if=(energy>=80|buff.omen_of_clarity.up|buff.berserk.up|cooldown.tigers_fury.remains<=3)
		# actions+=/shred,time_to_die<=9
		# actions+=/shred,cp<=0,savage_roar<=2
		if {Mana(more 79) or BuffPresent(OMEN) or TargetDeadIn(less 10) or BuffPresent(BERSERK) or BuffExpires(TIGER 3) or TargetDeadIn(less 10) or {ComboPoints(less 1) and BuffExpires(ROAR 2)}} Spell(SHRED)
	}
}
AddIcon help=main {
	if Stance(3) { # Cat Form
		# actions+=/savage_roar,cp>=1,savage_roar<=1
		if {ComboPoints(more 0) and BuffExpires(ROAR 0)} Spell(ROAR)
		
		# actions+=/savage_roar,if=buff.combo_points.stack>=3&dot.rip.remains-buff.savage_roar.remains>=0&buff.savage_roar.remains<=8
		if {ComboPoints(more 2) and TargetDebuffPresent(RIP mine=1) and more than 1s between TargetDebuffExpires(RIP mine=1) and BuffExpires(ROAR)} unless BuffPresent(ROAR 9) Spell(ROAR)
		
		# actions+=/savage_roar,if=buff.combo_points.stack>=3&buff.savage_roar.remains-dot.rip.remains<=3&buff.savage_roar.remains<=8
		if {ComboPoints(more 2) and TargetDebuffPresent(RIP mine=1) and at most 3s between BuffExpires(ROAR) and TargetDebuffExpires(RIP mine=1)} unless BuffPresent(ROAR 9) Spell(ROAR)
		
		# actions+=/shred,cp<=4,extend_rip=1,rip<=3
		if {ComboPoints(less 4) and TargetDebuffPresent(RIP mine=1) and TargetDebuffExpires(RIP 4 mine=1) and Counter(ripshreds less 3)} Spell(SHRED)
		
		# actions+=/rip,cp>=5,time_to_die>=6
		# actions+=/ferocious_bite,cp>=5,time_to_die<=6
		# actions+=/ferocious_bite,cp>=5,rip>=8,savage_roar>=11
		if {ComboPoints(more 4)} {
			if {TargetDeadIn(less 7) or {TargetDebuffPresent(RIP 8 mine=1) and BuffPresent(ROAR 11)}} Spell(BITE)
			if {TargetDeadIn(more 5) and TargetDebuffExpires(RIP 0 mine=1)} Spell(RIP)
		}
		
		# actions+=/mangle_cat,mangle<=1
		if CheckBoxOn(CheckBoxMangle) and {TargetDebuffExpires(MANGLE 1) and TargetDebuffExpires(MANGLEB 1) and TargetDebuffExpires(TRAUMA 1)} Spell(MANGLE)
		
		# actions+=/rake,time_to_die>=9
		unless {TargetDebuffPresent(RAKE mine=1)} if TargetDeadIn(more 8) Spell(RAKE)
	}
}

fatalsaint · 03/14/10, 5:28 AM

Originally Posted by Leafkiller

@fatalsaint
I did a side by side test of your Faceroller implementation vs. your Ovale script (with structural modifications I will describe below). I noticed some difference in behavior - it looks like the timing for when to clip Savage Roar is different (it kicks in earlier in Ovale by 1-2 seconds).

Ok, My ovale script is actually using an older model of the SimCraft rotation that includes a line that should be completely unnecessary.

Ovale:

		# actions+=/savage_roar,cp>=1,savage_roar<=1
		if {ComboPoints(more 0) and BuffExpires(ROAR 0)} Spell(ROAR)
		
		# actions+=/savage_roar,if=buff.combo_points.stack>=3&dot.rip.remains-buff.savage_roar.remains>=0&buff.savage_roar.remains<=8
		if {ComboPoints(more 2) and TargetDebuffPresent(RIP mine=1) and more than 1s between TargetDebuffExpires(RIP mine=1) and BuffExpires(ROAR)} unless BuffPresent(ROAR 9) Spell(ROAR)
		
		# actions+=/savage_roar,if=buff.combo_points.stack>=3&buff.savage_roar.remains-dot.rip.remains<=3&buff.savage_roar.remains<=8
		if {ComboPoints(more 2) and TargetDebuffPresent(RIP mine=1) and at most 3s between BuffExpires(ROAR) and TargetDebuffExpires(RIP mine=1)} unless BuffPresent(ROAR 9) Spell(ROAR)

The bolded part there was removed in my final SimCraft rotation because it was pointless and made 0 difference in DPS. When you actually think about it mathematically, the second line says if ROAR-RIP <= 3. Well, if RIP happens to be more than ROAR (which is what the first line is trying to catch) - then that results in a negative number. A negative number is <= 3.

Faceroller:

	--actions+=/savage_roar,cp>=1,savage_roar<=1
	--actions+=/savage_roar,if=buff.combo_points.stack>=3&buff.savage_roar.remains-dot.rip.remains<=3&buff.savage_roar.remains<=8
	if checkSpell(spells, roar, gcd) then
		if cp >= 1 and buffs[gsi[roar]].active == false then
			return roar
		elseif cp >=3 and buffs[gsi[roar]].time_left-myDebuffs[gsi[rip]].time_left <= 3 and buffs[gsi[roar]].time_left <= 8 then
			return roar
		end
	end

So the only thing I can think is:
A) Ovale is using a different equation with it's "more than 1s" and "at most 3s" and "between" than both SimCraft and Faceroller's rather direct math of "sr-rip<=3" setup. (or, Ovale is interpreting BuffPresent(ROAR 9) differently than expected. Maybe try if BuffExpires(ROAR 8) instead?)
B) SR was your next move, so Ovale (as was discussed earlier) was recommending SR before it's time. In this case though, it should have been dimmed out I think.

I did see one case during Berserk where Faceroller was asking for continuous Shreds rather than refreshing Rake (which Ovale was requesting) but in subsequent tests I was not able to reproduce that.

That should never happen and is very strange. In Faceroller, shred is the dead last of importance. Every other skill is an immediate return of the function as you see above with roar, but in the 2 locations that shred is recommended I merely set a variable that is returned at the very end of the function. So essentially, shred is only recommended when nothing else is triggered.

However, the one time I could see this is, what I explained before, Faceroller polled once and returned shred just before rake dropped - and no event triggered that caused it to poll again for a few seconds to notice rake had dropped. I would imagine this to be extremely rare though, and your first shred after this should have made it look again.

Leafkiller · 03/14/10, 6:45 AM

I removed the line you bolded and the scripts are closer together in behavior - but not identical. I am seeing some odd suggestions from Faceroller. Sometimes with 4 combo points up and Savage Roar timed out, it will suggest Rip for a few seconds and then switch back to recommending SR. I was able to reproduce this after letting SR drop off and just spamming Shreds - it happens when TF is on cooldown and I get the energy below 25 - when it hits 25 it will suggest Rip - and then shift to SR later either when I use a skill or if I do nothing and wait awhile (the timing is variable for the refresh). Another questionable suggestion is TF with low energy when Omen has procced.

Some things I wonder about in the rotation which are more a Simcraft question - it will suggest refreshing Rip with no mangle on the target.

Duilliath · 03/14/10, 2:10 PM

Originally Posted by Leafkiller

Some things I wonder about in the rotation which are more a Simcraft question - it will suggest refreshing Rip with no mangle on the target.

That needn't be a problem in and of itself. The bleed debuff doesn't come into play until the first tick of Rip, so as long as you can apply Mangle before then, there's no major issue.

Gurrshael · 03/14/10, 2:47 PM

Originally Posted by fatalsaint

From my perspective, I opened and looked through FBN.... it's massive.

Far beyond my understanding or knowledge of the mechanics of the game, and maintaining a script that size is not something I have the time to do. It has special code for different bosses and tons of checks for skills of other classes that I've never played.

It's easier for me to start over, and slowly build something back up adding what people want/need. The project may eventually get that big.. but starting there would be beyond me at the moment.

Walk before you run type of thing..

Yeah, FBN's a complex beast.

Since I am used to FBN's layout and didn't want to switch to another suggester I went through FBN's code, removed all the features I've never used (all that's left is the move suggester and OoC notification) and cleaned up remaining code.

It still uses the suggester based on computing relative strength of finishers/CP generating abilities but I plan to change it in the next iteration.

Basically, I want rewrite the suggesting logic of FBN to use a fixed "rotation" (hardwired, not user-configurable) from SimulationCraft/Team Robot that seems to be producing the best dps.

I can share the modified addon if anyone is interested.

fatalsaint · 03/14/10, 2:55 PM

Originally Posted by Leafkiller

I removed the line you bolded and the scripts are closer together in behavior - but not identical. I am seeing some odd suggestions from Faceroller. Sometimes with 4 combo points up and Savage Roar timed out, it will suggest Rip for a few seconds and then switch back to recommending SR. I was able to reproduce this after letting SR drop off and just spamming Shreds - it happens when TF is on cooldown and I get the energy below 25 - when it hits 25 it will suggest Rip - and then shift to SR later either when I use a skill or if I do nothing and wait awhile (the timing is variable for the refresh).

Wow. Yeah, this one I'm at a total loss. Rip should only be being suggested when you have 5 (or more, but you can't have more) combo points on target - not 4. The energy doesn't even come into play when suggesting rip.

Oh but wait, now that I'm looking at it. I have that check I was talking about earlier regarding the global cool down and if the spell is ready on SR but not on Rip. So maybe what's happening is that while you're spamming shred, as soon as you hit 5 combo points you are on GCD and it skips the check for Roar but catched RIP. Then it won't check again until something happens.

Maybe I should remove that GCD check completely. It was in all the examples for Faceroller when suggesting a spell but I just really see no reason for it.

Another questionable suggestion is TF with low energy when Omen has procced.

Some things I wonder about in the rotation which are more a Simcraft question - it will suggest refreshing Rip with no mangle on the target.

I checked both in SimCraft. I used the T10BiS profile from the OP in the other thread. Not hitting TF with Omen procced lowers the dps by 6 (14033 vs 14039). Not hitting rip if mangle is not up lowers it by 2 (14037 vs 14039). Not doing them both results in a perfect match of 6+2 (14031 vs 14039).

So, at least as far as SimCraft is concerned - it's better this way. Don't know about practical application though.

Originally Posted by Gurrshael

Yeah, FBN's a complex beast.
I can share the modified addon if anyone is interested.

I'd be interested to take a look. If it's small enough not to crush my mind as soon as I open it, I can probably code in that SimCraft best DPS rather easily since I've already done the LUA in the FR addon. I've never used FBN so I don't know what it looks like on screen.

chetal · 03/14/10, 2:56 PM

Originally Posted by Gurrshael

Yeah, FBN's a complex beast.

Since I am used to FBN's layout and didn't want to switch to another suggester I went through FBN's code, removed all the features I've never used (all that's left is the move suggester and OoC notification) and cleaned up remaining code.

It still uses the suggester based on computing relative strength of finishers/CP generating abilities but I plan to change it in the next iteration.

Basically, I want rewrite the suggesting logic of FBN to use a fixed "rotation" (hardwired, not user-configurable) from SimulationCraft/Team Robot that seems to be producing the best dps.

I can share the modified addon if anyone is interested.

I would like to try it once you change it to closer match simcraft's rotation. I currently use a one box setup of ovale which I get the best results with.

styopa · 03/14/10, 3:18 PM

I found these scripts originally improved significantly on the Ovale default druid script - is that still true?

According to Ovale, their default script is up-to-date (optimized?) for 3.3.3, but this one hasn't - as far as I can tell - been updated since 12/2009 (2.08a)?

Leafkiller · 03/14/10, 4:25 PM

Originally Posted by fatalsaint

Wow. Yeah, this one I'm at a total loss. Rip should only be being suggested when you have 5 (or more, but you can't have more) combo points on target - not 4. The energy doesn't even come into play when suggesting rip.

Sorry - it is not the 4 vs 5 combo points (I wrote that late last night) but rather just get it to 5 combo points, get TF on cooldown and spam Shred until energy drops below 25. You should be able to see it pretty easily. I have only done a cursory glance at the code you put on Curse so I don't know about the pros/cons of the GCD check you are thining of removing.

On hitting TF with Omen - at least with my reflexes there is a good chance I will lose some energy hitting TF with Omen procced at the same time. Probably the dps loss is very low - not unlike the 6dps that Simcraft is reporting for not hitting it with Omen. Thanks for checking that.

On the Rip vs Mangle decision, "Not hitting rip if mangle is not up lowers it by 2 (14037 vs 14039)", since Mangle benefits other classes it is likely that Mangle should be prioritized ahead of Rip at that moment if the feral is the only one in the raid responsible for keeping the Mangle debuff up. I think we can survive a personal 2 dps loss.

Leafkiller · 03/14/10, 4:41 PM

Originally Posted by styopa

I found these scripts originally improved significantly on the Ovale default druid script - is that still true?

According to Ovale, their default script is up-to-date (optimized?) for 3.3.3, but this one hasn't - as far as I can tell - been updated since 12/2009 (2.08a)?

I don't think 3.3.3 will change our scripts - other than lowering the frequency of needing Mangling - which should add a few hundred dps to the raid group if one or more ferals are responsible for the debuff.

However, a couple of people have reported a problem with the Shred code in the current script where it continues to try to pool energy while Berserk is up (and possibly other times). In my version of the script this stopped happening when I made a couple of changes that included removing the mangle debuff checks from the Shred line (which I did because I changed mangle to refresh at 1 second) and also putting brackets around "2s before Spell(TIGER)" (making it "{2s before Spell(TIGER)}"). Not knowing how Ovale parses I was simply guessing at what could cause problems.

fatalsaint · 03/14/10, 5:07 PM

Originally Posted by Leafkiller

However, a couple of people have reported a problem with the Shred code in the current script where it continues to try to pool energy while Berserk is up (and possibly other times). In my version of the script this stopped happening when I made a couple of changes that included removing the mangle debuff checks from the Shred line (which I did because I changed mangle to refresh at 1 second) and also putting brackets around "2s before Spell(TIGER)" (making it "{2s before Spell(TIGER)}"). Not knowing how Ovale parses I was simply guessing at what could cause problems.

Does that problem exist in mine as well or just the OP's?

I don't see a mangle check in either of my shred suggestion lines.

I'm inclined to agree with you about Mangle, if it isn't going to affect the DPS that much but it gives a higher uptime to mangle, and you're the manglebot (or there isn't one), then refreshing mangle first may be a better idea. You do waste a combo point though.

Thinking on this though actually sparked my curiosity. Currently the absolute highest priority is SR. So if you have 5 CP's and SR and Rip are off.. it recommends SR.

Since SR doesn't scale with CP and firing it with just 1 CP is just as effective as 5, you just need to clip it next time, so I rearranged the SimCraft putting rip above SR:

actions+=/rip,cp>=5,time_to_die>=6
actions+=/savage_roar,cp>=1,savage_roar<=1
actions+=/savage_roar,if=buff.combo_points.stack>=3&buff.savage_roar.remains-dot.rip.remains<=3&buff.savage_roar.remains<=9

I got 14044, which is an increase. I might change this is my FR and see what it does on a dummy.

Leafkiller · 03/14/10, 5:54 PM

Given the change to Mangle in 3.3.3 it probably is not worth worrying about - since we will only need to mangle 20% as frequently as we currently do. I have not seen any pooling issues in either your script or the FR addon.

Interesting about refreshing Rip before clipping SR. Have you tried to move Rake before Rip? I always wonder if that should be a higher priority with the 4 piece T10 set and I did observe a higher uptime on Rake than Rip on some of the very high dps parses - which these scripts will not do (I think the priority in Simcraft will typically put Rake at at about a 5% lower uptime than Rip - at least that is what I observe in my parses).

Furion · 03/14/10, 7:06 PM

Originally Posted by nastybuff

Does Ovale support tracking of potion cooldowns ?

Define(LUST 2825)

if BuffPresent(LUST) and {DebuffPresent(64382) or BuffPresent(71401) or BuffPresent(71485) or BuffPresent (71492) or BuffPresent (71484) or BuffExpires (LUST 16)} Item(40211)

That should be the code I used for suggesting hastepots. You don't have to define items. Actually you don't have to define spells either you can do everything by ID it's just harder to read.

And maybe someone who still plays the game might want to reopen this thread as I won't be updating the OP anymore

Umah · 03/14/10, 9:56 PM

Originally Posted by Gurrshael

Yeah, FBN's a complex beast.
...
Basically, I want rewrite the suggesting logic of FBN to use a fixed "rotation" (hardwired, not user-configurable) from SimulationCraft/Team Robot that seems to be producing the best dps.

I can share the modified addon if anyone is interested.

I'd be interested! I really liked that FBN "scaled" with your equipment, buffs and procs! I think that boss options where kind of an overkill. TimeToLive is important for the priority list, the rest should be up to the user.

A single target+swipe mode would be great though, which keeps up Rake+SR+Rip(+FF+Mangle) and else optimizes for swipes. User configuration wise options for Mangle-Bot and FF-Bot might help. Suggestions for TF, Berserk and NG should be optional imho, If you "hardwire" the rotation, I do not see why it would be better than current Ovale or upcoming Faceroller scripts?

The downside of FBN is its complexity, its junk'ish coding style and too many options and conditions (bosses), the great thing about it is that it on the fly calculates your best move.

Originally Posted by Leafkiller

Interesting about refreshing Rip before clipping SR. Have you tried to move Rake before Rip?

While I did not find what you were referencing to: if both Rip and SR are going to be off soon and I have little energy up I tend to refresh Rip first and directly after Mangle->SR or Rake->SR. The reason is that else you will lose a long time of no Rip being up. Simulationcraft shows that 85% uptimes of Rake and Rip give great DPS, normally I am at 77-80%.

I use Elk Buff Bars showing Mangle, Rake, SR and Rip right below Ovale, so that I do have complete control. There are some times where I wonder if an FB didn't fit in. FBN was a lot more aggressive on FBs (though the FB recommandation time windows where tiny, like 0.5-1sec).

Desta77 · 03/15/10, 6:09 AM

hi all
on the start i would like to sorry for my english, its not my primary language

Gurrshael i have a question:
That your fixed FBN still got timers for hidden cd of trinkets and tracker for primary abilities(like mangle, rake, sr and rip with 3 steps scaling when shreded)?? its easier to config it when u have all in one addon. Its important (for me) to check which buff from DW is on to use potion of speed or beg for histeria from our dks.

Old move suggester was nice(if u want to learn the priorities) but sometimes suggested mangle when player was behind the target and debuff was on the target, if u will be changing the script it would be nice to see suggestion of FB when rip got 8 sec or more to end and SR more then 3 sec,

And of course i would be interested in your version of FBN too.

stygma33 · 03/15/10, 10:03 AM

Originally Posted by Gurrshael

Yeah, FBN's a complex beast.

Since I am used to FBN's layout and didn't want to switch to another suggester I went through FBN's code, removed all the features I've never used (all that's left is the move suggester and OoC notification) and cleaned up remaining code.

It still uses the suggester based on computing relative strength of finishers/CP generating abilities but I plan to change it in the next iteration.

Basically, I want rewrite the suggesting logic of FBN to use a fixed "rotation" (hardwired, not user-configurable) from SimulationCraft/Team Robot that seems to be producing the best dps.

I can share the modified addon if anyone is interested.

If you just want the features you have described, you may want to look at recoding facemauler, as that is where FBN got it's move predictor.

The thing FBN has that Facemauler doesn't other than all the useless boss specific stuff, is the cooldown timers and active timers for trinkets, and also uptime timers for all your moves like mangle, rip ect.

And yes I would be interested in an update T10 version of FBN without all the bloat.

Mihir · 03/18/10, 12:10 PM

Problem with redoing/continuing FBN is, that a lot of it's important calculations are done in huge nested expressions, often with 4 or 5 levels of parentheses. And there's nearly no documentation in the code. So often you'll find yourself wondering why a certain part was made as it is, without any way of knowing for sure.