Beast Mastery Bible - Page 41

Zurgat · 05/30/07, 3:02 AM

Originally Posted by Equalizer

I see, and they replace steady in the rotation? Not trying to fit it in with a steady?

Damn now I need to make multi/arcane rotation too bugger.

with BM your shot speed is so fast that it'd be nearly impossible to "add" it to the shot rotation without replacing steady shot. a Macro might be able to do it once every 4-5 shots.
if you're MM, it is definitely easier.

Just persuade your raid leader to put you with a Shadow priest

Equalizer · 05/30/07, 3:54 AM

Shadow Priest is a non-issue, so I'm just working out a proper rotation.

Mech0z · 05/30/07, 4:45 AM

Glaurong I agree with the possiblitity to get tokens for items. But I think they should add different tier sets first. The current tier 4 is more of a MM from my point of view where the tier5 is much better for BM set bonus wise. Also survival has a tougfh time with the amount of agility on tier 4 dunno if this is the case for tier 5 - 6.

But seeing some spec tier items like warlocks have would be nice (why do warlocks get all the love

)

Zurgat · 05/30/07, 5:09 AM

Do pets get a % of your +hit ?
my kitty seems to miss a fair ammount, for obvious reasons.

Sapa · 05/30/07, 6:03 AM

Originally Posted by Zurgat

Do pets get a % of your +hit ?
my kitty seems to miss a fair ammount, for obvious reasons.

No, they don't.

Edit Magteridon kill last night:
http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report...1454,2016&a=40

My Cat:
Melee 3% missed, 4% dodged
Claw 6% missed, 6% dodged
KC 4% missed, 12% dodged
Glancing hits: 20%

Morogrim kill:
http://www.lossendil.com/wws/?report...40&s=8157,8708
Cat:
Melee 5% missed, 7% dodged
Claw 3% missed, 7% dodged
KC 1% missed, 6% dodged
Glancing hits: 24%

Equalizer · 05/30/07, 6:18 AM

Originally Posted by The Iron Colonel

Arcane/Multi will virtually always do more damage than steady (I say virtually because there might be some contrived situation in which this isn't true, but we can safely assume this is always the case). The issue is that Arcane and Multi cost significantly more mana and have only a marginal damage advantage over steady (for BM hunters). Thus, when mana is a concern, there is little incentive to cast arcane and multishot for BM hunters. In cases where you have a shadow priest or mana is otherwise not an issue to contend with, Arcane and Multi will net you more damage. It's really a matter of mana economy rather than maximizing damage.

So I'm going to be a pest. When I do a priority rotation in Cheeky's SS (Multi 1st, Arcane 2nd) it says my DPS should be 1050. When I do a steady shot rotation it says my DPS should be 1060.

Why doesn't it report higher DPS with the Multi/Arcane rotation if it's suppose to be more DPS?

Xoran · 05/30/07, 6:23 AM

Did you put in some armor for the target?

Equalizer · 05/30/07, 6:27 AM

Originally Posted by Xoran

Did you put in some armor for the target?

Good question, no I didn't and I don't see where to do that to be honest. But is the one Arcane Shot every 6 seconds that isn't mitigated by armor going to add more then maybe 2 or 3 dps?

Xoran · 05/30/07, 7:27 AM

On top of the gear tab is a box for target level and armor underneath. I dont know if it alone explains the difference, but you can easily play with it.

Sienna · 05/30/07, 7:30 AM

I was trying out all kinds of castsequence / cast combinations last night but wasn't succesful yet to create a macro which does steady/auto and puts in KC when it is up, and not only that, it puts KC after autoshot fires, not before. I tried using modifiers in /castsequence such as

/castsequence Steady Shot, Auto Shot, [Modifier:Shift] Kill Command

Apparently modifiers don't work for castsequence as they work for /cast. If this did work, it would only do the first 2 parts of the sequence most of the time and whenever KC was ready I was gonna hit shift when steady was casting so after steady casts, it would shoot Auto and then put KC. Did anyone figure out a workaround for this by any other means?

Edit: This works /castsequence reset=ctrl Steady Shot, Auto Shot, Kill Command

I keep resetting my macro before it reaches Kill Command whenever KC is not active and leave it be when it is active. Although it's an annoying way to do it.

Equalizer · 05/30/07, 7:41 AM

Originally Posted by Xoran

On top of the gear tab is a box for target level and armor underneath. I dont know if it alone explains the difference, but you can easily play with it.

Thanks for the info, went ahead and tested.

Added 10,000 armor (bringing the mob to 48.64% Mitigation) and that made the Arcane/Multi rotation end up 38 DPS ahead of the Steady/Auto rotation. Of course I don't really know what a normal amount of armor is for a boss, it obviously varies. But I guess the lower the mitigation the better a Steady/Auto rotation does.

khel · 05/30/07, 7:42 AM

Originally Posted by Howitzer

no joke? If you don't mind could you post his name, etc? I'd like to see his setup / talent configuration. Also, is he outclassing people in 25 man raids? I could see this happening pre 2.1 if you're talking 5 mans or Kara.

Warlocks beat me pre 2.1, but I always beat the rogues/mages/shadowpriests. I only have Gruul and Mag to show for it though.

Post 2.1, I was still top3 on Gruul (haven't worked out KC totally yet though...latency issues are causing me to have to ignore it for now), and pretty much blew everyone away on Magtheridon even though I was a clicker (hunters should be doing that anyway really for that fight).

Kheled - Shattered Halls (EU) is the toon, but pvp specced atm.

Cheeky · 05/30/07, 8:31 AM

Originally Posted by Equalizer

Good question, no I didn't and I don't see where to do that to be honest. But is the one Arcane Shot every 6 seconds that isn't mitigated by armor going to add more then maybe 2 or 3 dps?

Depending on how much armor the mob has, yes.

Equalizer · 05/30/07, 8:35 AM

Originally Posted by Cheeky

Depending on how much armor the mob has, yes.

Yeah I figured it out after Xoran pointed out the armor area of the SS.

Now I just need to start figuring out what the armor value is of bosses so I can choose the right rotations.

Howitzer · 05/30/07, 8:36 AM

I wanted to wait a couple of weeks after 2.1 to post my own differences between the 3 trees in fights where "easy" is not a term widely used yet that defines the fights I had parsing. My logs are only from Serpentshrine Cavern and Tempest Keep, specifically Void Reaver, Hydross, Tidewalker, and Al'ar.

There are a lot of Hunters that come here asking "whats the best spec?" and I still hold true to the fact that it depends greatly on your own play style and what you are most comfortable playing as. As I'll show you, all 3 trees are capable of great damage output, but some are definitely better than others depending on certain factors.

Week 1 (right when 2.1 hit)

Hydross kill with 5/20/36 Survival build:
http://netigen.com/kuya/wws-20070522-Hydross2.1/
971 DPS (with a Feral druid - no shadow priest)

Void Reaver with 0/36/25 (38/23 type like 2.0)Marks build:
http://netigen.com/kuya/wws-20070501-VoidReaver/
721 DPS

Tidewalker kill with 5/20/36 Survival build:
http://netigen.com/kuya/wws-20070523-Tidewalker2.1/
869 DPS

Week 2

Hydross kill with 41/20/0 Beast Mastery build:
http://netigen.com/kuya/wws-20070529-Hydross/
1068 DPS (with a Feral druid - no shadow priest)

Al'ar kill with 12/46/6 Marks build:
http://netigen.com/kuya/wws-20070529-Al'ar/ <-- cut/paste this link
751 DPS

Void Reaver kill with 12/46/6 Marks build:
http://netigen.com/kuya/wws-20070529-VoidReaver/
769 DPS

Conclusions so far:

Survival 2.1:
Very gear dependent. You need to take the time to throw in all 8 agi gems into all your sockets and get every agility enchant available. This spec, to me, really shines the most with a minimum 33% unbuffed crit level because of EW and ToTH procs. The mana that you save with this build is really amazing and you can see it in the WWS logs on mana returned from that wonderful 3 point talent. If, however, you are a Hunter that is regularly grouped with a shadow priest such as myself, it gets to the point where you cannot burn mana fast enough even if you tried quite literally. I believe this build with the proper gear and a great knowledge of shot rotations can out-DPS the marks tree currently. The proof is in the pudding. The other Hunter in all my logs who served as an excellent control and who I might add I consider my equal is 36/25 Marks in every single one of those WWS logs. He is always full raid buffed, potted, and in the same group as me for every run.

Marksman 2.1:
While the Marks tree has always been something dear to me I am really to the point now where I can't see it pulling ahead of the pack when compared to the other 2. Even with an unbuffed 2350 RAP @ solid 30% to crit with max hit this spec CAN put out huge numbers......but not "sustained" numbers. There just seems to be a drop-off in sustained dps from the MM tree that the BM tree and even the SRV tree don't suffer as greatly from. Possibly the lack of sustainability in terms of mana and the dependence of 3 shot rotations for maximum output, (arcane, steady, multi). The biggest flaw I have seen here is the inability to always use Multi-shot which is a bread-and-butter DPS boost for this tree considering you're investing 6 talent points which you can only use "some" of the time because of CC'd adds, aggro issues, etc. Don't get me wrong, MM is still a "Decent" tree, but after trying the other 2 trees in 2.1 I'm not too impressed anymore.

Beast Mastery 2.1:
Never thought I'd really believe it, let alone say it, but this spec with all variables in unison can pump out insane sustained DPS. What I mean by variables is: Your pet can be used and has moderate to low risk of sudden death and you have good paladins in a raid that are not anal about buffing your pet with BOK/BOM/MOTW/ etc. Last night's Hydross as BM pushed DPS that exceeded or matched 1100+ spell damage Warlocks / Mages that were seeding and AOE'ing almost the entire fight. Now to me, thats pretty damn unheard of. As hard as it is to micro-manage the pet, use KC at every opportunity, (I don't use macros), steady shot in perfect rotations, and everything else required to stay alive, I really think that the BM tree, (while it'll take getting used to), is what I will be sticking with for full-time raiding from here on out. The Survival tree would be my close 2nd choice because it truly is a lot better now than it was in 2.0 even with the band-aid fix to the Survival Instincts talent.

Anyway, I hope this gives you all a little more perspective from my own POV.