my macro broke for literally 3-4min during the Azgalor fight and im not sure why.
#showtooltip Steady Shot
/script UIErrorsFrame:Hide()
/castsequence reset=4 Arcane Shot, Auto Shot, Steady Shot, Auto Shot, Steady Shot, Auto Shot
/cast [exists,target=pettarget] Kill Command
I decided it would be a good idea to sick my pet on the doomguards instead of the boss due to cleave. As soon as my pet got out of range for me to send the KC, my macro just.. died. It wouldnt fire a single shot, i kept trying different things like bringing my pet back, sicking it on the boss, back and forth. Clicking my abilities and as its casting mashing my macro, everything. It just, all of a sudden kicked back in after 3min+ of nothing. If anyone knows why that would happen please let me know. I'm assuming it had something to do with the pet being out of range, but only b/c thats the only thing ive done differently than i normally do. If that was the case, it should of worked when pet was in range? but it didnt. So yea, any suggestions would be great.
I have been reading a lot about the views of other hunters on whether salvation's is a better dps buff for hunters than wisdom and I was wondering what are your personal preference was.
I have been reading a lot about the views of other hunters on whether salvation's is a better dps buff for hunters than wisdom and I was wondering what are your personal preference was.
Given our 30 second aggro dump and high mana consumption I would disagree. I would only want Salvation if there were five Paladins in the raid.
I have been reading a lot about the views of other hunters on whether salvation's is a better dps buff for hunters than wisdom and I was wondering what are your personal preference was.
If you're running out of mana (assuming chugging mana pots as needed) before the fight is over, Wisdom > Salvation.
If you're not running out of mana, Salvation > Wisdom.
Given our 30 second aggro dump and high mana consumption I would disagree. I would only want Salvation if there were five Paladins in the raid.
Might
Kings
Wisdom
Light
Salvation
Are you running out of mana? If you never run out of mana, you don't need Wisdom.
Salvation, on the other hand, means that I can burn harder from the start, I need to FD less often (every GCD saved is another 1600 damage done), and I'm not as screwed should FD ever get resisted.
Thank you for the feedback. This makes me feel better, since I knew I was overlooking a simple detail that was driving me crazy. After plugging in both using my normal raid buff senerio both builds yielded 2440 DPS (7700 Armor). The higher armor pen is slightly higher in DPS (+5) when I switch to 6200 armored mob.
I apologize if this has been a really dumb question to ask, but there has been a lot of debating amongst my guild revolving around ArP and Haste. I am of the opinion that haste is a must when using a 3.0 speed weapon until 2.1 or lower speed is achieved, then tweak other stats with gems using the gear available at that time. I have some cohorts that feel stacking ArP regardless of any other stats or factors is a "win/win."
I agree with you on trying to get a 2.1 speed auto-shot time, since that seems to work well for weaving.
However, a possible advantage to the less hasted build is that you get more benefit from haste procs and activated abilities. If I'm doing the same amount of DPS, I'd rather do it with a 2.1 speed auto-shot than a 1.7 speed auto-shot since Rapid Fire, Heroism, Quick Shots, DST, etc are partly (or mostly) wasted on the 1.7 speed auto-shot.
I have been reading a lot about the views of other hunters on whether salvation's is a better dps buff for hunters than wisdom and I was wondering what are your personal preference was.
It really depends on the group/raid. I usually run with Kings/Might/Wisdom in raids since I just switched from a T4/5 guild to a T6 guild and it's suddenly become very difficult to catch the tank on aggro. FD was up often enough for me.
On the other hand, I ran with some "less than optimal" players the other day in MgT. I made darn sure I had salv going from the pally. I still ended up either kiting pulled mobs back to the tank or staring at the floor/ceiling wile waiting for FD to come up again.
Overall, I much prefer to run K/M/W instead of Salv if at all possible.
Originally Posted by Felixalias
Locking up Kill Command once in a while won't be nearly as big a DPS loss as not using it at all.
I'd suggest trying Manito's macro, while it can still lock up on occasion, it isn't nearly as often as without a separate KC macro (more of a workaround than a fix).
I'd debate this. I've found that KC interrupts my shot rotation and may slightly decrease overall dps, even if it didn't lock up autoshot. I do, however, plan on testing it again once the new patch goes through.
Given our 30 second aggro dump and high mana consumption I would disagree. I would only want Salvation if there were five Paladins in the raid.
Might
Kings
Wisdom
Light
Salvation
I generally agree with the above list when I am in fights where I would take damage, but I usually would go
Might
Kings
Wisdom
Salvation
Light
It really depends on the boss.
Salvation can be better than wisdom for fights in which aggro can be a problem and if the fight is short. Leotheras is one fight that comes to mind. Salv is probably better than wisdom for clearing trash in TK too.
When the hunter has Blessing of Salvation does that reduce the threat given by the Misdirection? or is the threat from Misdirection based on the tank's buffs only? maybe this isnt the right forum to ask the question on but i've heard conflicting things and was wondering what the answer is. Thanks for the awesome spreadsheet and your time.
When the hunter has Blessing of Salvation does that reduce the threat given by the Misdirection? or is the threat from Misdirection based on the tank's buffs only? maybe this isnt the right forum to ask the question on but i've heard conflicting things and was wondering what the answer is. Thanks for the awesome spreadsheet and your time.
--Kassad
To expand, Misdirection is based on the threat generated by the hunter. Salvation would decrease the threat sent to the MD target, +2% Threat to gloves enchant would increase it. That's probably the real reason why hunters "shouldn't" get Salvation. Though the hunter could start a fight without Salvation, send of three shots at full threat then have it buffed since Light is hardly an amazing fourth paladin buff to have if the raid was particularly worried about it.
Shot Rotation Woes:
Okay, in short I'm confused on my shot rotation. I'm a survival hunter using the good old badge xbow with a bit of passive haste but not too much. No DST or 4pc T6.
The issue stems from Haste. I was messing with Cheeky's and it was telling me that haste pieces of gear would give me an unprecedented increase in dps if I used them. However, my understanding of my shot rotation was basically one set down in the Shot Rotation Illustrated thread in which I copied http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...etterShot.jpg; it's served me quite well and my dps has been quite satisfactory in raids. As I understood one would need a 2.5 seconds or slower shot in order to avoid clipping, I already have 2.39 and any more haste would just intensify this issue.
This has become further complicated when I read posts such as [Hunter]Macros de-mythified - Elitist Jerks which talk about how one builds a shot rotation is to simply sub out Steady Shot for Arcane and Multi-Shot. Cheeky's tells me that such an approach would lead to several hundred dps loss on my part.
So to come to my question itself: how is it possible that haste leads to such a dramatic increase in my dps according to Cheeky's while also causing more clipping issues? As haste has a larger effect on my auto-shot time than my Steady Shot cast time it seems like I'll just start clipping harder and harder. Any help would really be appreciated as I've tried my hardest to research this over the last week and have just come up blank.
Last edited by Neichus : 07/12/08 at 4:04 PM.
Reason: Further info
Shot Rotation Woes:
Okay, in short I'm confused on my shot rotation. I'm a survival hunter using the good old badge xbow with a bit of passive haste but not too much. No DST or 4pc T6.
The issue stems from Haste. I was messing with Cheeky's and it was telling me that haste pieces of gear would give me an unprecedented increase in dps if I used them. However, my understanding of my shot rotation was basically one set down in the Shot Rotation Illustrated thread in which I copied http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z...etterShot.jpg; it's served me quite well and my dps has been quite satisfactory in raids. As I understood one would need a 2.5 seconds or slower shot in order to avoid clipping, I already have 2.39 and any more haste would just intensify this issue.
This has become further complicated when I read posts such as [Hunter]Macros de-mythified - Elitist Jerks which talk about how one builds a shot rotation is to simply sub out Steady Shot for Arcane and Multi-Shot. Cheeky's tells me that such an approach would lead to several hundred dps loss on my part.
So to come to my question itself: how is it possible that haste leads to such a dramatic increase in my dps according to Cheeky's while also causing more clipping issues? As haste has a larger effect on my auto-shot time than my Steady Shot cast time it seems like I'll just start clipping harder and harder. Any help would really be appreciated as I've tried my hardest to research this over the last week and have just come up blank.
Whether or not haste benefits you would depend on which stat you are sacrificing to get more of it. If you can get your attack speed to 2.0 that would be great. One thing to keep in mind is that haste reduces the cast time of steady shot. So the math of 1.5 sec steady + .5 sec auto shot + .5 sec special shot (arcane or multi) is not quite how things work.
The important thing is to maintain a high rate of fire. "Clipping" is not the end of the world. Even if you lose some shots to clipping, if your overall rate of fire goes up, you are better off. I would recommend trying a Dr. Boom test and use the Recap damage meter. If you highlight total damage, you can see an "intervals" reading. Use whatever approach gives you the lowest number. Latency, reaction time, etc... all matter.
In general I would go for more haste, the 1-1 shot rotation is a pretty good deal. It is very mana efficient.
Well as I understand haste reduces the casting time of Steady Shot but not the GCD, which still leaves my Steady Shots forcing some room. So it would in fact be a little less than 5 seconds for two rotations because at the end the second SS would end earlier and give Auto-Shot's .5 second cast time to go. But I'm not sure how big of an effect that is. But thank you.
I use Manito's too but I never noticed any significant DPS increase by using it over the 3:2 /cast/cast.
Try testing it against a Blasted Land servant and just count the shots taken over a fixed period of time (I used 60 seconds, and turned off AotH and ensured I also got no random haste effects.)
Well as I understand haste reduces the casting time of Steady Shot but not the GCD, which still leaves my Steady Shots forcing some room. So it would in fact be a little less than 5 seconds for two rotations because at the end the second SS would end earlier and give Auto-Shot's .5 second cast time to go. But I'm not sure how big of an effect that is. But thank you.
I am not so sure about the effect of haste on the global cooldown. I did a study on shot times (with Cheeky as my subject) and found that shot times varied.
The times listed are the time since the previous shot of any type.
Auto Steady Arcane Multi
Shots Shots Shots Shots
Average 1.007 1.433 0.340 0.992
Std Dev 1.267 1.150 0.201 0.419
Median 0.718 1.217 0.359 0.854
These were done from from a combat log. These figures are for all periods including those with haste effects and interruptions. The measurements could be affected by latency and I have no way of measuring reporting error.
It looks like the casting time of Arcane shot was affected by haste.
I really don't feel like going through enough combat logs to come up with a statistically conclusive finding. I would say that I have not seen emperical evidence that supports the global cool down being unaffected by haste.
Latency makes this very hard to measure. That is why I recommended a Dr. Boom test. It will include your latency. One thing to keep in mind about Cheeky's spreadsheet is that it puts latency at .2. If your situation is more than .2 you might find that your ideal shot rotation is different, just find Cheeky's latency cell and record the other number.
This may or may not be a repeat question. Please feel free to shoot me in the face if it is.
I am a standard 41/20/0 hunter in a casual raiding coalition that doesn't seem to grasp the fact that hunters perform better with adequate support instead of just being used in the warlock group for ferocious inspiration.
But I digress. I've recently been part of the team that's progressing steadily in The Eye/Serpentshrine/Hyjal, and thus I've been getting decent gear upgrades. However, despite Cheeky's showing that my DPS should be going up, I've been finding it increasingly difficult to even break 1k DPS on trash and 1.2k on bosses, where I used to hover around 1.3k on bosses.
Now, I'm using the Crossbow of Relentless Strikes, and I may be wrong, but this seems to have all happened when I picked up the Scaled Drakeskin Chestguard and its 25 additional haste rating. This brought my statcard attack speed to 2.
Now I've begun swapping in and out of the 3:2 and 1:1 macros on different instances to test their effectiveness, and the results seem to be similar between them.
Cheeky's shows my DPS should be around 1600. I'm struggling to get 1.1k average DPS on the first three Hyjal bosses. What am I doing wrong?
This may or may not be a repeat question. Please feel free to shoot me in the face if it is.
I am a standard 41/20/0 hunter in a casual raiding coalition that doesn't seem to grasp the fact that hunters perform better with adequate support instead of just being used in the warlock group for ferocious inspiration.
But I digress. I've recently been part of the team that's progressing steadily in The Eye/Serpentshrine/Hyjal, and thus I've been getting decent gear upgrades. However, despite Cheeky's showing that my DPS should be going up, I've been finding it increasingly difficult to even break 1k DPS on trash and 1.2k on bosses, where I used to hover around 1.3k on bosses.
Now, I'm using the Crossbow of Relentless Strikes, and I may be wrong, but this seems to have all happened when I picked up the Scaled Drakeskin Chestguard and its 25 additional haste rating. This brought my statcard attack speed to 2.
Now I've begun swapping in and out of the 3:2 and 1:1 macros on different instances to test their effectiveness, and the results seem to be similar between them.
Cheeky's shows my DPS should be around 1600. I'm struggling to get 1.1k average DPS on the first three Hyjal bosses. What am I doing wrong?
A couple things. Hunters are best at receiving group buffs, not really giving them. Second, can you provide a WWS report? It's impossible to know if you are screwing up your rotations without seeing that.
Originally Posted by missiletoad
I get enjoyment out of constructing buildings out of my fries and demolishing them with my chicken nugget army as I make monster noises. But you people. You people are FREAKS.
My question has to do with spec on felmyst. I am a bm hunter and I am wondering if their is a good possible way of keeping a pet alive on this fight. The thought right now is that the hunters in my guild may have to go mm to compensate for the damage taken in this fight. Any help will be appreciated. Thank you.
Right.
WWS from our kill of FLK in SSC. 6/14 Etar - WWS
and a WWS from our venture into TK 7/10 Etar - WWS
The thing that jumps out is you shoot more autos than steadies: 230 autos vs 209 steadies on the FLK win, and similar ratios elsewhere. That implies a problem with your shot rotation. Try your rotation out on Dr. Boom until you can get somewhere between 2 to 3 steadies for every 2 autos.
07/11/08, 4:38 PM
