Quick question about Haste Potion usage for BM Hunters, in this case on Brutallus but also in general - it seems like Haste Potions are going to cause some pretty noticeable clipping. I'm at a 1.55 speed with just Drums + Haste Potion, and 0 passive haste gear. When IotH procs, it's down to 1.38. Obviously as I add passive haste gear this will become more pronounced.
In this case is the haste potion still going to be a net damage increase over not using one, just some of the haste from the potion is "wasted"? That's what Cheeky's spreadsheet seems to indicate, but I just wanted to be sure that made sense.
Further, if that's the case does it make more sense to combine haste cooldowns or stagger them? Last night we only had 3 drums, so I was using Rapid Fire OR a Haste Potion during the period no drums were up, but that means they didn't combine with BW or Trinkets. Does it make more sense to just use everything at once? (BW/Trinket/RF/Haste Pot/Drums). Is there a way to model that in the sheet?
What I do for him is when I pop CDs the 1st time I Pop everything but the haste pot so Rapid Fire, TBW, Blood Fury, and drums then right as Rapid Fire runs out I pop my Haste Pot. Seems to work good for me even messed up on our kill and got my haste pot CD out of sync had threat a little bit waiting for the 2nd Fd to come up after blowing CDs and even(this is terribad) let HM drop for like 2 sec around 50%. Still put out 2.2K DPS with no shaman(for GoA, SoE, and BL) or feral druid in my group.
Just wondering if when you hit the 1:1.x tab in cheeky's... does anyone else get absurd rotations that look nothing like what you expect them to be?
I always have to manually enter the correct 1:1.5 or 1:1.4 rotation I want to achieve.... I have no idea what kind of rotation the default gives me.
W
Wihle were' at it... the 3:2 button gives a perfect 3:2 rotation all the time right? not a 4:3, 5:4 or whatever you would get depending on your haste..
Hey guys, small question about dualwielding vs 2hand weapons. I'm currently toting the wellfare axe and wondering if there is any dualwield combination that would be better for me as a beastmastery hunter. I'm currently at a speed that has me clipping when I get several speedbuffs at the same time so should probably have no haste on it. I have access (or will again when we start after this summer slow time) to heroics, kara, za, tk, ssc and the first two bosses of MH. It is my understanding that you can use adamantite sharpening stones which makes dualwielding more attractive than it looks at first sight looking at the stats...?
any other comments on my gear would be very welcome
Hey guys, small question about dualwielding vs 2hand weapons. I'm currently toting the wellfare axe and wondering if there is any dualwield combination that would be better for me as a beastmastery hunter. I'm currently at a speed that has me clipping when I get several speedbuffs at the same time so should probably have no haste on it. I have access (or will again when we start after this summer slow time) to heroics, kara, za, tk, ssc and the first two bosses of MH. It is my understanding that you can use adamantite sharpening stones which makes dualwielding more attractive than it looks at first sight looking at the stats...?
any other comments on my gear would be very welcome
As Felixalias said, dual [Dagger of Bad Mojo] is a good combination for its armor penetration. [Vanir's Right Fist of Brutality] is also a good choice, and being a fist weapon can hold an adamantite weight stone for added crit. Even though it has haste, it's not a whole lot and you can always drop to a lower ratio of steadies to autos if you get too many haste procs.
Felixalias and Kikuchiyo: thanks for the fast replies. With two of those daggers I will come out at 644 ArP with my current gear, without ever really having looked at ArP as a stacker-stat. Is there any kind of sweet spot for ArP?
Last edited by Goldy : 07/22/08 at 9:22 PM.
Reason: saw the difference between weight and sharpening stones
Felixalias and Kikuchiyo: thanks for the fast replies. With two of those daggers I will come out at 644 ArP with my current gear, without ever really having looked at ArP as a stacker-stat. Is there any kind of sweet spot for ArP?
Armor pen is always good to have and always increases your damage until the mob hits 0 armor after sunders/curse of reck/etc. It all depends on what bosses you are shooting and what debuffs they have. A quick glance at some of the higher-end Sunwell gear shows a lot of ArP so I can imagine 1900-ish is possible towards the extreme end, which pushes the more squishie bosses with 6200 or so armor close to, but not quite, zero.
The spreadsheet does a good job of showing how much weight ArP should be given in relation to other stats. For what it's worth, for my gear, it shows ArP as slightly above crit but below agility as far as item budget is concerned although I'm a survival hunter so agility is weighed pretty heavily.
I was wondering if someone could post the current shot rotation macro that BM hunters use. I think mine is quite old and might be dated. My shot speed is at 1.93, so I'm pretty sure I should be using a 1:1 macro.
Goldy: As a personal preference, I like to stick with 700-800 ArP. I'm currently at 4/5 MH and 5/9 BT progression, so with only 1 piece of T6 available, sacraficing crit/agility for ArP is difficult. Keep in mind ArP is a scaling attribute, the more you have the better it gets, but never sacrifice too much of your key AP/Agi/Crit stats.
I see you're a little bit behind me (in terms of gear), so I would recommend picking up the Badge Cloak and S3/S4 helm for some added ArP. I'm also a big fan of my current belt and boots, easily available from ZA.
Once you're in the latter stages of BT and in Sunwell, ArP is very easy to come across, especially on Tier pieces.
@reebz sorry skyguard's drape is what I have set to equip when mounted because of the bombing quests and saving myself from a nasty death-fall.... long time ago. I have the badge cloak and the drape of the darkreavers as well. I switch between those depending how much hit I need. But that belt is very nice indeed if I wanna go the ArP way, or at least, continue on that path.
I just got [Wrathfire Hand-Cannon] which puts my paperdoll speed down to 1.45 (BM specced).
Are there any detrimental effect using a weapon that fast?
I've swapped from Manito's 3:2 macro to this 1:1 macro:
And test on Dr. Boom shows a perfect cycle. However, I think it has lowered my dps.
I used to use [Truestrike Crossbow] with a paperdoll speed of 1.88.
The reason why I swapped in the first place what in attempt to lower mana consumption.
So, I'm in a bit of a pinch over which weapon to choose.
But mostly, if anyone could answer my first question, I'd be very happy.
It completely depends on what your own stats are, and it will change whenever your stats change.
if so, how should be the choice of stats? I know that 1st it comes agility, as it has crit and AP, but in which circunstances should we choose crit over AP, or AP over crit?
For example, a hunter with 2500 AP and 15% crit shouldn't be the choice, but if so, how do we determinate what we need?
I am currently with ~1800 AP and 29.50% crit.
What should benefit more?
if so, how should be the choice of stats? I know that 1st it comes agility, as it has crit and AP, but in which circunstances should we choose crit over AP, or AP over crit?
For example, a hunter with 2500 AP and 15% crit shouldn't be the choice, but if so, how do we determinate what we need?
I am currently with ~1800 AP and 29.50% crit.
What should benefit more?
As always for these type of question just refer to the spreadsheet and see which pieces of gear or gems help you the most.
I just got [Wrathfire Hand-Cannon] which puts my paperdoll speed down to 1.45 (BM specced).
Are there any detrimental effect using a weapon that fast?
I've swapped from Manito's 3:2 macro to this 1:1 macro:
And test on Dr. Boom shows a perfect cycle. However, I think it has lowered my dps.
I used to use [Truestrike Crossbow] with a paperdoll speed of 1.88.
The reason why I swapped in the first place what in attempt to lower mana consumption.
So, I'm in a bit of a pinch over which weapon to choose.
But mostly, if anyone could answer my first question, I'd be very happy.
It is not a 3:2 macro, its a /cast /cast macro. Based on common attack speeds it often results in a 3:2 rotation, but the number of steadies vs. autos will vary based your given attack speed and button (or g15) spamming. There is not any reason to go back to a castsequence macro, as it would product same result at a 1.45 speed - 1:1, as well as allow latency to be a greater detriment to your DPS.
You dont need something that fast. Always stick with /cast /cast over /castsequence, and also the Truestrike will likely serve you better.
I'd say Troll. 1% Bow Crit (Troll) is probably more valuable than 5% pet damage (Orc) if you can manage to stick to bows (much easier than sticking to guns for us dwarves). I can't speak to Berserking versus Blood Fury, but Trolls also get about 5 agi more than Orcs.
Originally Posted by PSGarak
Personally I am not considering any spec without Corpse Explosion, because Corpse Explosion is the best spell in the game in any game that has a spell named Corpse Explosion.
Actually, I think Orcs are generally considered to have the best racials for hunters. 5% pet damage is a ton, and bloodlust is great. On the Alliance side, Dranaei have it best, with the +1% to hit for themselves and their pets, especially considering pets cannot become hit capped.
Berserking costs mana, and gives you a (unless you're at 50% or less HP) only a 10% haste buff, that scales to a 30% haste buff depending on how low you are. That CAN be a pretty high bonus, but it also only lasts 10 seconds. Bloodfury at level 70 gives 282 AP with a self-Mortal Strike effect (benefit of cleansing Wound Poisons on you if you use it in PvP, fyi) for 15 seconds, which is 4 more AP and 5 seconds shorter than the Bloodlust Brooch's on use ability. So it's basically an extra Bloodlust Brooch versus whatever benefit 10% haste (30% if at REALLY low HP) gives you.
Orc is far and away superior to troll for end-game PvE.
5% pet damage is not as significant as people will claim it to be, but it's definitely an increase in DPS.
Their free trinket/self MS is also superior to berserking in TBC wow, due to the fact that hunters don't particularly need the extra haste on demand since there's only so fast steady can go, so you can end up with a 1:1 rotation with or without it.
The crit to bows is decent, certainly better than anything tauren or blood elves have, but it pales in comparison to what orcs can offer.
Plus, do you really want to live without shoes for the rest of your characters life?
For BM hunters, I'd agree, 5% pet damage is huge, but for SV, I think 1% crit is better. 1% crit is almost 1% more personal damage (~0.8% at 50% crit), not counting GFTT, EW, TotH. So 5% pet damage is only better if your pet does at least 16% as much damage as you - and mine doesn't. Yours might.
Anyway, it sounds like with the activated racials, Orc will be the better choice anyway. Just be glad you aren't alliance, I suppose.
Originally Posted by PSGarak
Personally I am not considering any spec without Corpse Explosion, because Corpse Explosion is the best spell in the game in any game that has a spell named Corpse Explosion.
I'd pump your AP before your crit at this point (that is if you have a straight up decision between an AP increase or crit increase). Honestly though, only under a few circumstances have I ever seen AP and crit be very different in terms of value. I would look at what gives you the most overall agi/crit/ap and make your decisions from there. It's not realyl worth trading 20 crit for 40 AP if you have to lose 15 intellect as well, for example. it's still a good idea to just increase your overall stats at this point unless you're seriously lacking in any one category.
07/22/08, 1:59 PM
