Generally speaking, since activated trinkets take up the GCD you can potentially end up losing 600+ damage by their use. Unless you time it with a FD that you had to use anyway. So in essence, passive trinkets are better then activated.
Generally speaking, since activated trinkets take up the GCD you can potentially end up losing 600+ damage by their use. Unless you time it with a FD that you had to use anyway. So in essence, passive trinkets are better then activated.
I would go with the DST and the Hourglass.
This is not true, bloodlust brooch does not use a global cooldown.
I would check out Cheeky's spreadsheet-even if you don't have excel, you can use open office (a free download). With my gear and a 41/20 BM spec, the DST and bloodlust brooch come out on top.
I am current thinking about some equipment changes (basted on tests Cheeky's Spreadsheet).
1. My problems are that i don´t know how the dmg is affected by -armor, and how much more often fd will resist because i lost my t4 boni.
2. Which gladi items i should get first (i have 4.6k @ season 3 start) and can´t deside what to take 2 pve (armor / new gloves (now agi instead of ap) or helm
As much as I'd like to believe we're both right, it seems one of us has gotten something wrong. From how I understand you, you want to get a 3.0 weapon down to the same speed a 2.7 weapon shoots (with SS and quiver included). That's the thing I've modeled. I used the figure '2' instead of '1.96' simply because I rounded a bit. Maybe that was sloppy, but it should nowhere near account for the 38 haste rating difference. Your statements "137 haste is needed to bring a 3.0 bow down to 2.0" and "175 haste is needed to bring a 3.0 bow down to ... 1.96 or so" do not both work. This seems, to me at least, to be a mathematical fact.
I know it's weird that ~40 haste doesn't seem to make much difference, but it has to do with the multiplicative nature of haste. I'll do the full calculations for both cases.
3.0 bow with 175 haste (+ quiver and SS)
175 / 15.76 = 11.1%
(3.0) / [(1.2)(1.15)(1.111)] = 1.96
3.0 bow with 137 haste (+ quiver and SS)
137 / 15.76 = 8.7%
(3.0) / [(1.2)(1.15)(1.087)] = 2.00
As an additional check, 175 haste gives us roughly 2% more haste than 137. 2% of 2.0 is 0.04. So reducing a 2.0 attack speed by 2% (0.04) gives us the 1.96 value.
Bottom line, it takes a lot of haste rating to make a big dent in attack speed, and the lower your speed is already, the more it takes. Luckily, most hunters should only be using haste to tighten up their shot rotations, so they won't need an obscene amount.
I see you stating that most hunters should only be using haste to tighten up shot rotations. Since the people here generally know more than I do, what do you mean by that? Am i correct in assuming haste is used not to reach the ideal speed, but to approach it. Like getting to 2.02 speed instead of 2.16 etc?
Also, I am having problems finding the ideal Shot rotation as a survival hunter using a 2.9 speed weapon. So far what i have been doing is;
when imp hawk procs, I go down to a strict 1:1 rotation with arcanes replacing a steady because curse of shadows has it deal more damage (for now). This rotation that i have been using is neither 1:1 or 1:1.5. It is a 4:5 Ratio of auto's to specials. I have been pulling anywhere between 850-975ish DPS (pet unmerged) as 5/20/36 on various fights in SSC/TK. However I cant help but think there is something i am doing wrong here. Also would haste rating benefit me at all as survival spec with a 2.9 speed weapon. I believe i am at 2.56 speed after quiver haste. I was wondering if haste would help tighten the shot rotation at all, or if My rotation/speed is alright.
PS: I have read the shot rotation guide, but a 1:1.5 rotation doesn't seem optimal for a 2.9 speed weapon...if i could manage to get 3.0 it seems to fit MUCH smoother.
I see you stating that most hunters should only be using haste to tighten up shot rotations. Since the people here generally know more than I do, what do you mean by that? Am i correct in assuming haste is used not to reach the ideal speed, but to approach it. Like getting to 2.02 speed instead of 2.16 etc?
Also, I am having problems finding the ideal Shot rotation as a survival hunter using a 2.9 speed weapon. So far what i have been doing is;
when imp hawk procs, I go down to a strict 1:1 rotation with arcanes replacing a steady because curse of shadows has it deal more damage (for now). This rotation that i have been using is neither 1:1 or 1:1.5. It is a 4:5 Ratio of auto's to specials. I have been pulling anywhere between 850-975ish DPS (pet unmerged) as 5/20/36 on various fights in SSC/TK. However I cant help but think there is something i am doing wrong here. Also would haste rating benefit me at all as survival spec with a 2.9 speed weapon. I believe i am at 2.56 speed after quiver haste. I was wondering if haste would help tighten the shot rotation at all, or if My rotation/speed is alright.
PS: I have read the shot rotation guide, but a 1:1.5 rotation doesn't seem optimal for a 2.9 speed weapon...if i could manage to get 3.0 it seems to fit MUCH smoother.
Drop iath and get 5/5 imp arcane and do auto->steady->arcane->auto->steady if you mess up your 1:1.5 rotation too often. MT (or scater+barrage+wyvern if you want) and
auto->steady->multi->auto->steady->auto->steady->arcane->auto->steady. 2.9 is fine if your latency is below 200. The sequence can be fully macroed.
iam current thinking about some equipment changes (basted on tests Cheeky's Spreadsheet).
1. my problems are that i don´t know how the dmg is affected by -armor. and how much more often fd will resist because i lost my t4 boni.
2. which gladi items i should get first (i have 4.6k @ season 3 start) and can´t deside what to take 2 pve (armor / new gloves (now agi instead of ap) or helm
how much hit rating does a hunter need for raiding?
what is an ideal crit % and ap?
will it be better to spec into MM on 2.3?
To never miss versus a level 73 mob, a raiding hunter needs 142 hit rating (95 with 3/3 Surefooted). Your other questions do not have simple answers, as they depend greatly on spec, gear, group composition, shot rotation, and other factors. Can you provide a little more background on what your goals are? Alternatively, you can use Cheeky's Spreadsheet to test some things out for yourself.
Last edited by Kierran : 11/13/07 at 1:45 AM.
Reason: Couldn't decide which grammatical form to use, so I included both :(
I know it's weird that ~40 haste doesn't seem to make much difference, but it has to do with the multiplicative nature of haste. I'll do the full calculations for both cases.
3.0 bow with 175 haste (+ quiver and SS)
175 / 15.76 = 11.1%
(3.0) / [(1.2)(1.15)(1.111)] = 1.96
3.0 bow with 137 haste (+ quiver and SS)
137 / 15.76 = 8.7%
(3.0) / [(1.2)(1.15)(1.087)] = 2.00
As an additional check, 175 haste gives us roughly 2% more haste than 137. 2% of 2.0 is 0.04. So reducing a 2.0 attack speed by 2% (0.04) gives us the 1.96 value.
Bottom line, it takes a lot of haste rating to make a big dent in attack speed, and the lower your speed is already, the more it takes. Luckily, most hunters should only be using haste to tighten up their shot rotations, so they won't need an obscene amount.
In the end this is just a math problem. In practice you just need to check how many haste items you need to approach target haste rating. 38 rating is roughly 1 haste item more, if it's worth to sacrifice a bit of stats for that is just up to you and your current gear.
Also you should keep in mind the better scaling with autoshots you have with a slower weapon, which in fact makes haste rating more valuable for slow weapons assuming same final speed.
iam current thinking about some equipment changes (basted on tests Cheeky's Spreadsheet).
1. my problems are that i don´t know how the dmg is affected by -armor. and how much more often fd will resist because i lost my t4 boni.
2. which gladi items i should get first (i have 4.6k @ season 3 start) and can´t deside what to take 2 pve (armor / new gloves (now agi instead of ap) or helm
ice i'm sitting on 5k arena points just waiting for S3 to start and cant decide which way to go with gear either. My plan was to get the S3 BP/gloves/ and 100% the axe since i have been using the HH halbred since alittle after i turned 70. That was until last weeks' MH clear were i got my t6 gloves and the BP off Archie which put a wrench in my plans. Now i'm going to get the axe for sure unless the Halbred drops this week in BT and the S3 helm over my T4 helm now. But i wonder what to do with the left over points. Serious thinking about getting my rating to 1850 for the bow since it is the sweetest look range weapon in the game but of course i'm just waiting my turn on the archie bow.
Since my druid is my main pvp char, iam just playing 3on3 for fun with some rl friends (all pve specced) and we have just rating of 1550-1600. The bow is the original reason why i was gathering points all the time. Since i need a rating of 1850 its nearly impossible for me to archive it with the team since our gear disigned for pve (items / enchants / skillpoints of all charakters).
pve stuff:
I currenty don´t raid a lot, 1-2 days per week so i have only the chance to get stuff from the first bosses of ssc / tk -.- . Thats why i think season 3 items are realy interesting for me even for pve.
Maybe i have the change to get the tuskbreaker form za, it has a lower dps but according to my calculation it will boots my dps a bit. I think its because of the hastrating / crit (dwarf bow -> gun).
I was referred to EJ from a guild member and I've learned a lot from here. This is my first post so let me start by saying thanks for all the info made available here. I'm currently spec'd 0/24/37
Macro questions:
1) I created and bound a macro for my shot rotation. It is currently
/castsequence Autoshot, Steady Shot (Rank 1), Arcane Shot (max rank), Steady Shot (Rank 1), Multishot (max rank)<--- changing this to a lower rank
Using the macro helped me a lot with tightening the shot rotation. However, how do I time the sequence to put in a [reset=value] so that I don't start with a multi after a dps stop period i.e. Najentus bubble. Or is there a way to reorganize the sequence code? I use quartz and bigtrouble so I typically wait for the autoshots before hitting the macro for the next cast.
2) I have a /target Ghoul macro for kiting ghouls to the NPCs in Hyjal. Works great for the first wave, but starts targeting dead ghouls after the first wave. I'm assuming it's proximity causing this. How can I change the macro to target a new live ghoul?
DPS/Spec:
There are times in my shot rotation when MS and AS are both on CD and I'll throw in a Serpent sting if i'm not having mana issues (and I usually don't with TotH and Efficiency + 5/5 BoW + Superior Mana Oil + Major Mageblood) useless on trash but it's added dps for bosses that aren't immune. A more experienced hunter in the guild believes stings are a waste of mana and a GCD and that I should go 4/5 Imp AS to ensure they aren't in CD at the same time. With 2.3 out today and Stings getting a boost from AP I'm not sure it's worth the respec, thoughts? I've also considered dropping TotH since mana hasn't been an issue and spec'ing for Combat Experience with 1 point into Imp stings. Some input would be greatly appreciated.
Lastly, I've been using Cheeky's spreadsheet religiously . Has it been updated with 2.3 changes for hunters so I can play with the new stuff?
I had a question about Haste. Where I stand right now i am at 2.06 attack speed. I was told that haste affects not only your attack spead but your casting times aswell. Is this correct? If so if I were to get my attack speed to 1.8 where would that put my steady shot casting time at? I mean with the .5 sec gcd it may be a problem, but maybe I'll be able to squeze a little more dps out ? Well maybe someone can point me in a direction im sure this has all been talked about over and over.
But on another note, I was just wondering if anyone has done the numbers on the "attacks ignore opponent armor" stat on items. I tried to look, but didnt see any analysis for hunters. Does anyone have an idea how much equivalent AP they produce? With the new ZA and badge items being so close to t5, its a definite stat for me to consider in my item purcahses.
Thanks I changed this around a bit since the auto shot isn't needed, it fires anyways, and it seems to work more reliably for me. For some bizzare reason the old macro would work stop working, sometimes throw errors, sometimes not.
Hey guys, I hope some of you here can help solve a problem we are facing in our guild. I figured here looked like a good place to post rather than a new thread, so here goes.
One of the three excellent Hunters we have in our guild is Survival spec and is having rather serious agro problems on a lot of encounters. This guys has been playing a Hunter for his entire WoW life, from MC to now BT but since his Survival resepc he has been pulling agro on a regular basis.
This pretty much came to a head last night when he twice pulled Flames of Azzinoth onto the raid causing wipes and several outbusts from other members. We have allways ribbed him a bit for the agro problems, but after a while I imagine it gets very old for him as it does for us.
Everyone in the raid is running Omen and are forced to keep it up to date every few days at least and the Hunter in question is almost always below the tank on reported threat when he gets agro (confirmed by myself and several other people). He also uses FD every time its off cooldown, yet this still occurs and neither he nor anyone else can explain it.
He is currently sat at around 41% crit / 2200 rap unbuffed; armory can be found here: The World of Warcraft Armory
As I mentioned, he recently respec'd survival and some of his gear/gems needs updating to reflect this, but that is not the issue (too much official forum browsing promted this comment).
As you can imagine, this is a very frustrating situation all round and I hope you guys can offer something up we may have missed.
Try getting him to update or reinstall Threat 1.0 and see if he's still having the problems.
If its not working properly, his data in Omen may well be pretty inaccurate
To be honest, after respeccing Survival, I've been faced with some early aggro problems, IF my procs (MT, EW, Hourglass and Dragonspine in my case - probably the Ashtongue Talisman for your hunter) went off too often, or right before a feign death or simply too early after an aggro wipe. Now, I haven't actually got around this quite yet, but I did make some Misdirection macros for most of the tanks we run with, and I sometimes burn both my Misdirects (actually one MD and a Readiness) before I start dps, and on every subsequent cooldown.
Also, improved Feign Death helps BUT there's still quite a large chance of it being resisted on multiple mob fights (Hydross adds, Al'Ar's embers, etc, and I'm guessing that Illidan''s Flames are pretty similar). What I usually do is use a FD right before using Readiness for a second MD. That way, I also get a second FD, while also getting more aggro on the tanks.
Last edited by Enova : 11/14/07 at 6:13 AM.
Originally Posted by XI-
In summary, TBC raiding is easy. 9/10 encounters can be summarized with 1 phrase. Stay out of the fucking fire. If this is too difficult BWL was still there last I checked, so go have at it for some practice.
11/12/07, 6:22 AM
