I was thinking more in reference to Arch's bow vs. Legion comparison and what you guys thought. Mabey I should have been more specific, but I was wondering what you thought about namely that matchup for a BM with dst and all those other haste procs? Are they enough to qualify using that 3.0 or stick to the 2.9? How about sacrificing some slots (belt/bracers/etc, while retaining 4pc t6) inorder to bring that 3.0 down to a 2.9 if the faster is more ideal? How much passive haste is required for that?

Wow, such great information here!

I would love for people to give me any advice possible. I am working on becoming not only the top DPS'ing Hunter in my guild, but I want to be tops in all DPS for the guild. Whether or not this is possible, I don't care, that is my goal and I want to work towards doing what I need to do to ensure it happens.

I am currently specced SV for 5-man heroics and for Expose Weakness for the guild, but from what I have read here, I am way too early with my gear to be SV. I currently have an unbuffed of AGI of 644, and it seems that is about 150 too low. If that is the case, I am not helpig my guild with DPS, I seem to be hurting it.

My concern is not playing a spec that fits me, it is playing the best DPS spec for the guild with my current gear. Within the next two weeks, I will have the PvP feet, PvP bracers, Arena 3 chest and the Shifting Camo legs from Heroic badges. So, I know my gear needs help, but with the current gear I have, and the eventual upgrades I'll be receiving, which is the better to spec to go with? From what I have read here, I am assuming BM at this point.

As far as my shot rotation goes, I generally work a Auto>Steady>Auto>Steady>Arcane>Auto>Steady>Multi...rinse and repeat. From what I have read, this sounds near accurate, and I am as careful as I can be with clipping any Auto shots. However, one Hunter in my guild, MM specced, uses both Serpent Sting and Kill Command for all fights. I was under the impression the mana loss from Serpent and KC was too great, and better spent for more Steadys?

I have noticed alot of people discuss their DPS here. My DPS for Kara hovers around 400-430 in Kara, which to me seems low after reading some numbers here. However, I am pretty sure my gear is lacking compared to many here, so I am not sure if my 400ish DPS is about right for what I have. What is a good DPS target number for Kara, and even Gruul's since our guild dropped Maulgar for the first time?

My armory link is (it does not seem to be showing my T4 mitts with +15 AGI yet): The World of Warcraft Armory

Thanks for any and all help, this seems to be the best place to find out my answers and get honest advice, even if it is hard to swallow.

Littlestan,

I don't have time to respond to all of your message from here at work, but with partial Karazhan gear and a BM spec you should be pushing 800+ dps for hunter friendly fights such as Prince. Kill Command needs to be part of your regular DPS cycles, but Serpent Sting is still not worth it unless you have a terribly low AP. BM spec is definitely the way to go. Survival will never really compete with BM DPS but it is commonly agreed that 700 base agility is the point where the raid buff is enough to make up for your individual DPS loss. Of course there are many factors to this and some people will argue that the range is anywhere from 600-800 agility. With 644 agility as a survival spec hunter you can rest assured that your base agility is a little low.

We keep our guild pretty tight so everyone you see in raid is basically what we have every raid. I am the only hunter in the guild and i beleive they intend to keep it that way. So, no EW or TSA for me just a spriest and if I am really lucky a heroism.

If you have ever a few decent melee/physical dps you might consider swapping to survival.

I have actually been considering that as-well. The only downside is that our melee attendance tends to bounce around a bit. I have been looking for a thread or post that specifically adresses the EW gain for warriors, rogues, shaman, misc-non-tanking feral druid. The way I have been figuring it though is the casters in the group with me are all also gaining my 3% damage. Subtracting 3% dps from every caster aswell as the dps loss I have when going survival didnt seem prudent.

Also as far as scaling is concerned I am thinking the percentage will always cale better, but i really havnt found testing for this vrs EW.

That log is really strange. I know the second version of WWS doesn't allow for construct damage to be removed, which inflates raid DPS, but some of the numbers don't seem to make much sense. The fight seems far too long for it to be a properly merged log.

Anyway, a few things to note without having to really look at the log: Glau is an orc, and I'd assume those high crits were while he had Blood Fury up. His DPS time is also fairly low, which increases the impact cooldowns had on his DPS.

You're also using a scorpid still for PvE, that's generally a bad idea. If you don't already have a ravager (or even a cat/WS), go get one. Judging by the fact that you had no AotH procs, I'd assume that log was from a raid where you were also PvP spec'd. Go 7/48/6 if you want to stay marks for raids, otherwise I'd say go BM. Do whatever you can to convince your pally's for Might/Kings before any other blessing. Depending on the fight the third could be BoS or BoW. Teron is also an extremely physical DPS friendly boss, making CoR a good idea. Though, if your rogue performance is usually that bad I don't know how necessary it is (Again, it's probably due to the bugged log).

My guess would be that he had a Survival hunter in the raid as-well as a Marksman. Check for Recklessness on the boss.

We had an SV hunter too and I´m MM myself. Also I already pointed out that us not having Recklessness debuffed seems to be part of the reason, I´m just unconvinced that´s all.

Just saying Bm is already a higher dps spec coupled with trueshot aura

That´s true, I´ve been somewhat puzzled by the discrepancy in mob hp too. It´s not merged though, only my own chat-/combatlog involved.

Makes sense. Over the course of the whole report including trash mobs his average Auto Shot hit for about 100 and Steady Shot for 150 less than mine.

I do have a Cat too, I just didn´t take her with me because I didn´t think it´d make such a big diffrence as MM hunter. Anyway the point is - I´m still doing 400 dps less even without pet damage taken into account.

I skilled 0/43/18 on purpose because on the one side IAotH screws with my Shot Rotation and more importantly I still needed the 3% hit from surefooted to be hitcapped. This will change by the time I get some more of my wishlist items. Do you think it´s better to cope with my lack of hit rating and get IAotH anyway?
Concerning our Rogues - they both died so early on it´s difficult to judge their performance really. They´ll propably suffered from the same lack of CoR the Hunters did.

I've been trying to search, but can't find anything narrow enough to address this--what are thoughts on BM or hunters period and haste rating? I was able to pick up Arrow-fall Chestguard - Items - World of Warcraft on my first run in ZA after returning to my hunter. With my current gear setup, it was a small (~3 dps increase) over the merc gladiator chest. What gets me curious, though, is the timing bit for BM hunters. Like a good theorycrafter, I've passed sunfury to use the Wolfslayer due to speed.

Today on our first zul'jin kill, Jin'Rokh dropped. I passed because the MT wanted it for PvP fun regardless, but I was curious what the haste would equate to. On Cheeky's sheet with my current gear set up it amounted to a significant dps drop (~25 dps) as opposed to the Vengeful Glad axe. What I'm curious about, though, is whether it would be worth building some kind of haste set (while still maintaining hit cap) with a slower bow--be it Sunfury, a Glad wep, or the bow off of Zul'jin/Vashj. Is this done by BM hunters (or heck, even marks with enough haste to get down to a 1:1 rotation) with good result?

P.S. The past two days in ZA I've noticed that spamming

/cast Auto shot
/castsequence reset=3 Steady Shot, Auto Shot
/cast [exists,target=pettarget] Lightning Breath
/cast [exists,target=pettarget] Kill Command

causes pretty significant lag. Has anyone else noticed this due to 2.3? What sort of macro are people currently using to avoid a KC clipping your autoshots (the above will still clip autos with KCs)?

I can´t really comment on your haste question beside - use the hunter spreadsheet - which obviously you already do.
Concerning your macro question though this may be related to Auto Shot not beeing recognized implicitly.
Check Tibors post on page 52 of this thread for a more detailed explantation.
This is propably going to be fixed with 2.3.2 by prefixing Auto Shot with an exclamation mark in your cast sequence.

So comparing myself to the other two Hunters in Glaus raid, not counting our pets contribution I´m still about 100-150 DPS behind. Is it reasonable to assume this is because of their slightly better equipment and CoR, or are there other things I´ve done wrong?

Hello all

I apologize for reposting something thats probably been discussed 1 million times but if someone would be so kind: Look at my armory, and assume for a moment that I switched out the Bladefist's Breadth for the Dragonspine Trophy, I've heard that this could negatively affect my DPS; is this true?

Also--is the Don Santos > Sunfury and Wolfslayer; if not then would the poster please explain why not?

Thank you in advance.

Be careful about obeying the Spreadsheet God blindly. Haste benefit is strongly affected by latency, and Cheeky's defaults to 0.2 second. Make sure you have the latency set properly. For me, the axe is only 4 dps better than Jin'Rokh. (I agree that if you have the axe already, there's no need to go after the 2H -- it'd have to be an unusual configuration where the 2H'd be better.)

Your wws shows there were no fairie fire AND curse of recklessness on gorefiend. That helps tremendously on him as he has low armor. The armory isn't loading for me so I can't comment on gear. Heres a wws of me using bristleblitz bow doing comparable average damage to yours because we use fairie fire and CoR Loading... Had you gotten fairie fire and CoR on him you'd be doing a lot more on average than me which is what marksman hunters are supposed to do. Tell your guild it's silly not to be using those

Hi,
I was thinking about using Bindings of Lightning Reflex (wrist) and I'm wondering if these would clip my shots as BM with a 2.9 or 3.0 bow. From your(Cheeky's) spreadsheet when I input them, they were a significant DPS boost to the other wrists from BT/Hyjal.

Looking at Teron Gorefiends debuffs I see 11 aplications of Faery Fire (Feral), there´s no CoR though - I´m aware. I´m not sure our tanks will approve if I ask for it, as we already get the MT killed every now and than due to too hard hits.

I'm aware of the latency settings on Cheeky's sheet. I stick with the .2 seconds because my latency usually hovers between 130-250 assuming no one is doing something crazy on another computer. I'm mostly curious more generally about BM and haste. I guess I don't feel competent to do the math to back this up, but my instincts tell me that building a haste set to push a 2.9/3.0 weapon down to 2.7 is a dps loss when one could just use the Wolfslayer and stack yet more ap/crit. Its just a downer to me that I'll be using a Kara weapon forever while rogues and warrs take these bows =(.

Oh, and whoever posted the bit about Bongos and Macros causing lag: that sounds spot on, as I am in fact using Bongos and do remember reading something about that when looking at the changed versionf or 2.3. I'll update Bongos/turn that option off ASAP. Does anyone know of a viable 1/2 macro solution, though, to make sure that Kill Command falls after the auto shot and before the steady shot in a BM rotation to avoid clipping? The macro I linked previously purports to avoid that problem, but perhaps just due to 2.3 it still causes clipping.

There's an option under the action bar options menu called Show Casted Buffs & Debuffs. Turning that off fixed my fps issues with this particular mod. (Bongos)

I'm going to be going back to MM/SV for raiding to help with trapping, after playing with Cheeky's spreadsheet I'm looking at about 665 Agility, 1447 AP, 28.97 Crit.

Im using [Steelhawk Crossbow] with 2.80 weapon speed.

I went through several threads looking for Macros for shot rotation but most seem to be centered around steady/Auto.
Is there a thread with, functioning after the patch, MM/SV macros that will give the 1:1.5 rotation with multi and arcane and one without Multi for CC situations.

Or could someone post ones that work for them.
I do have a cat, but I will be leaving out KC for mana purposes.

Any one have/or seen a mod that will show your current ranged attack speed in a small movable window? Seen several for mellee but none for hunters.