I have used the spread sheet and it says Don's works out to be higher DPS then legionkiller by about 17 DPS with a straight SS/Auto rotation. This works great when i'm in a group with locks/mages but if i'm in the melee group with a shaman(heroism) and drums i find myself clipping alot with Don's. I know the spreadsheet says Don's should out DPS legionkiller on paper but when i bring it to the real encounters i find the damage lacking compared to legionkiller. Most fights your moving around threwing more arcanes/multi-shots on the run. personal opinion for me is that Legionkiller out dps Dons. I have both and i know what i feel better using.

Those are some impressive numbers he was putting out. Looking at his buffs he was in a very good group SP/shaman and whatever. I know that for me being in the melee group vs Locks/mage makes aobut a 300 DPS difference in my DPS. All in all those are very impressive numbers for sure.

Hi there, I've been playing my hunter for some time now. Although the PvE theorycrafting in this forum has been highly educational for me in the past I wanted to ask a direct question here. In a day or so I'll be able to pick up the Season 1 bow through honor rewards, my current spec did just ok for arena last season playing mostly 2v2 with a warlock. We want to compete this season however for 3v3 bracket. Our team make up will be Disc Priest, SL/SL lock, and a hunter who's spec has yet to be determined(me).

So my question is, with this make up do you see BM or SV as more viable for 3v3? The advantage I can see is TBW. With a spell lock and the mana drain capacity of the team a cooldown like this seems invaluable. However, Silencing Shot and Scatter shot have proved to be excellent tools as well. Can anyone give me some insight as to how well different hunter specs work with this team make up or something similar?

Finally, is there anything glaringly wrong with how I'm setting my gear up so far? (other than the bow, I've just been downright unlucky)

My Hunter's Armory

After rereading the post I see that this is almost directed entirely at PvP, let me know if I should move this.

If you're going to play Hunter, Priest, Warlock then you're going to play the drain game. What's important is not 18 seconds of burst dps, it's controlling the damage output of your opponents until you can wear out their healers/casters mana.

You want scattershot, you want entrapment or imp wing clip, you want silencing shot, you want improved stings. Your composition is about control, not burst dps. Get that healer out of mana and keep him out of mana and you can win with 100 dps.

I don't have Excel on this computer and it's something I only ever used for hunter spreadsheets so far so I'm not in a huge rush to go out and get it. Here's my question:

I picked up Legionkiller last night, more with the mind to use it for SV than my normal BM or MM raid specs. However, after conversing with two of the other hunters in my guild, I'm wondering if it would be a decent upgrade over my current bow, Serpent Spine Longbow, for all three raid specs. The other thing is that we downed Archimonde for the first time and are learning Illidan now, so it's also a question of whether or not I want to immedeately dump 300g+ on a scope.

What was your group makeup like for that fight?

I've been reading alot of posts on this site, in regards to hunters, and have always wondered: Do any of you use shot rotation macros, and if so, what are they?

Did a quick analysis of our presence and shots fired:

228 - seconds Glau present
356 - seconds Midnight present

118 - Auto Shots fired by Glau
76 - Auto Shots fired by Midnight

1.93 - Average seconds between Auto Shots for Glau
4.68 - Average seconds between Auto Shots for Midnight

232 - total shots fired by Glau
192 - total shots fired by Midnight

1.02 - shots per second for Glau
0.54 - shots per second for Midnight

You are messing up your 1:1.5 rotation, bad.

Legion killer (for most BM hunters) is a 2 dps upgrade or there abouts, whether thats worth it to wear / scope to you is a personal question Whether its better for survival and marks is entirely based upon your current haste, and what kind of a shot speed you can handle.

Thanks a lot. I was MM last night when I got the weapon, and swapped it on for trash just to play with it. The rot speed change is no problem for me. In terms of SV, I wanted it for the Agility because I'm the only one of our four active hunters that doesn't really have a decent SV set. I can get to...:S...699 raid-buffed Agility. >.> Anyway, I think I'll probably build up the scope and just save it until I have enough for a second, then use it on Legionkiller. I've had to do two 35 Agi chants, 2 8 Agi gems, and this scope in the past three to four days. I'm sick of farming.

I don't actively use a shot rotation macro. However, I have one in the wings that I put out on my bar and just spam-click for fights when I know I'll either be getting Heroism of my FPS will go to singles. While macroing can really even out your rotation and up your DPS, I find that I have more timing issues with potions, healthstones, FD, etc when I'm using one because of the reset on it. For example, on Gorefiend tonight, I was spamming my macro and took a ton of burst damage, got down to something ridiculous like 700 hp left. I died because the reset on the macro wouldn't let me pop the HS like I needed to in order to save my sorry butt. At least as I understand it, it's an issue with the reset time on the macro.

Hmm, I guess I´ll have to practise a bit more, even though your numbers might make me look a bit worse than it actually is. Of those 356 seconds presence I spent about 50 seconds not performing any shots, just waiting for my death. The raid leader wants it this way to prevent early deaths in the middle of the raid.
If I just take the time passed between my first and my last shot it´s down to 245 seconds which equals roughly 3,23 seconds per Auto Shot on average. It´s still bad, just not as bad.

Taking a closer look at my rotation I realize there´re some occasions where I completely miss an auto shot. One of the reasons this happens is propably because I´m used to castsequence macros which broke in 2.3 and start casting steady shot a tiny bit too early.
Another reason may be feign death. Now I´m not sure if it´s always been this way but just recently it became more obvious to me that feign death resets my auto shot timer. In theory I figured it´s propably best to cast feign death right after an auto shot and proceed with the normal shot rotation afterwards. If I´m casting feign death too early this too will result in almost twice the normal delay between two auto shots. Unfortunatly feign death doesn´t seem to be recorded in the combatlog (which seems a bit odd to me btw) so I can´t really check on this.

Any hints beside maybe practising at Dr. Boom to improve my shot rotation?

edit: Our latest BT raid report including my unspectacular Teron Gorefiend performance which resulted in almost exactly the same Hunter DPS as last week: click me!.
I had to rename myself to "Mid" in the log because WWS would screw report splitting assuming we´re fighting "Midnight" in Karazhan on almost every Boss. -.-

Ok this is a really long Help me please question loll but please, I really need advice on this

I was looking at some of the hunters in my guild on wws report and noticed one of them was using aimed shot. First reaction was "WTF!!!!" who would use aimed shot in a boss fight with such a long cast time, a poor dmg ration compared to steady and all.. But something popped out in my head... maybe the guy was using it only in moment where the ability could become something good, like when he would use rapid fire and then aimed shot in less than 1.5 seconds. So to be sure I looked through the logbook and found out what..... nahhhhh the guy was just using aimed shot in is rotation, thus bringing a lower dps.

But all this brought me to think of something. For hunter people, I have a somewhat classic survival build of 5/20/33 which result on getting Imp AOTH, mortal shots and thrill of the hunt for some mana regen. But after thinking a little, and making some stupid calculation, I came up with an idea which I need your advice, your idea or just your bashing to tell me if it would or wouldn't be good lol.


I was thinking if it was possible that taking the 5 point from Imp AOTH away and getting myself readiness could actually bring more dps!!


Here is how I saw it:

Imp AOTH procced 16 time on a Morogrim fight of 11 minutes. that give me a 15% speed boost to my range attack for 3 min 20 sec.

If I would get readiness, here is how I would use it(given the best situation for sure):

PS: for the time of cast, im really bad for that, so I putted .5 sec for auto shot and same for arcane, feel free to notice me if its longer or shorter than that.

rapid fire
aimed shot 1.5
arcane shot .5
(auto) .5
readiness GCD
aimed shot 1.5
arcane shot .5
(auto)
steady .9
(auto)
steady .9
Repeat that until your at the real end of rapid fire and aimed shot before it goes down(cooldown of it should be finished)

Rapid fire yet again
aimed shot 1.5
arcane shot .5
(auto) .5
steady
(auto)
steady .9
(auto)
steady .9

aimed shot when cooldown is up duhh



In the same fight of 11 minute, I roughly calculated that you could use the rapid fire up to 5 time.

Now would that combo of rapid-aimed-readiness surpass the gain from Imp AOTH or not =S that where I want your advice.



PS: take into account that you also get a boost of dps from the 5 point in Master tactician(even if its not a great boost its still something)


sorry again for the long post :S

just to destroy my own idea :S I forgot aimed shot reseted the auto shot timer -_- all this hard work for nothing I guess

Your logic is flawed in that aimed shot resets the auto shot cooldown which doesn´t even factor in any haste. So this means if you use an aimed shot and your weapon has got a 3.0s unhasted speed it takes those 3.0 seconds after your aimed shot regardless of any haste for your next auto to get ready.

So you can either do:

0.00 auto
1.50 aimed
2.25 steady
3.75 steady
4.50 auto

or

0.00 auto
0.75 steady
1.50 auto
2.25 steady
3.00 auto
3.75 steady
4.50 auto

To be honest, you´ll propably not be able to execute it as perfect as this and somewhat clip your autos, but in the end it´ll still be vastly superior damage to using aimed shot.
As far as I see it aimed shot is really only useful if you either want to pack as much punch as possible into a single shot for misdirection or need the healing debuff and no warrior is available (who can debuff much more effectively).

edit: Doh, got it yourself I see.

damnit i was in hope that I could finally find a good pve use for that stupid readiness

Rapid Fire and Misdirection may be nice to have twice, but there are also thing like getting a second Feign Death, Frost or Freezing traps, Deterrence that also come in handy, both raid and PVP wise. I can tell you I've managed to tank the last 2% of an old Gruul near wipe by popping Deterrence twice. Sure, it comes in handy once every million years, but it's awesome utility.

You need to start capitalizing or your stay on these forums will be a short one.

As long as you are marks you are going to have to deal with Multi-Shot and the complications it brings (10.5 second between them). Survival hunters have the option of using Improved Arcane to tune their rotation and skip Multi, greatly simplifying things.

If you are having problems with your rotation on gorefiend, I would imagine on the many active fights in T6 your dps dips even lower. I would suggest BM at this point. You can drop your Mark of Conquest for a DPS trinket, your Talisman will be more effective since you will be firing more steadies, perhaps switch out your bracers and a ring for a bit more haste and you will be at 2k dps easy.

Many fights may seem pet unfriendly, but once you get used to managing your pet a little, every fight but Archimonde/Algazor your pet can contribute a meaningful amount of damage. And as you have seen, the DPS a BM hunter puts out aside from their pet is still respectable (I got killed on this weeks Archi kill but was doing good damage till I did.)

Algazor - Wow Web Stats

Damn! What the hell am I doing wrong, then, if I can't break 900 DPS on Gruul, in T4 and T4-equiv gear?

Provide a WWS, we can take a look and let you know if we see any glaring problems. In full T4 I think you should be able to hit about 1K DPS in a fight like Gruul.

My logs from being in just T4 gear include the old Scorpid mechanics, so they wouldn't be very useful. All our WWS for Gruul's can be found here, if you want to take a look anyway.

It may not be your stats, it may be your DPS uptime. Are you spending too much time repositioning before/after shatter? Bandaging a lot? There is a such thing as playing too cautiously.