Ditto, both myself and another hunter pulled aggro multiple times on Gorefiend despite being a long way behind the MT according to Omen. FD wasn't resisted and to make sure it wasn't a lag thing I let the full FD animation play and still pulled aggro following this.

This happened to me last week, too. After a couple of FDs (assuming the position for a couple of second each time), a Flame of Azzinoth decided it wanted to lick my face . The usual barrage of 'l2FD, huntard' followed shortly thereafter

I seem to recall reading a blue post (many moons ago now) to the effect that FD was bugged, and the bug was 'very hard to fix' due various arcane reasons. I don't recall seeing any mention in patch notes that it's been fixed, and the damn thing is so elusive that determining whether it (still) exists at any given point in time has largely been a matter of totalling up anecdotes

Personally, the fact that FD doesn't show up in the combat log has always made me suspicious that, much like Auto Shot, FD is something of a hack.

Hopefully, the new combat logging system will throw some light on the situation (or at least prove that we did FD, and it wasn't resisted, so STFU about it already).

Did you stay down for a second or two after the FD?

Omen clears the threat imediately from the list, while FD accually takes about 1 second to truely clear it. A good way to make sure your threat is accually cleared is to wait for your charactor to finish his/her dramatic death and fall all the way to the ground before resuming dps. For me as an orc, the animation takes about 1.5 seconds.

As for pets, they have their own seperate agro. Turn on growl in a raid sometime and watch how high they get. (Its never enough to pull agro, but you'll see them on there as a brown bar)

Umm... I beg to differ. If I forget to turn off growl, my pet will pull aggro off the tank everytime. Even well geared tanks who know what they are doing (T4+).

This is due to the scaling of growl with AP. Try it sometime... ask for a BoM on your pet, turn on growl and try to pull aggro. It's also why Survival pets can't hold aggro at all and why MM pets (recieveing their owner's TSA) can out-aggro BM pets (unless they use intimidate).

If you give a pet TSA, BoM, BoK, Battle Shout, Kibler's bits, and a target with EW* & 5/5 IHM* they will do upwards of 2500tps (less with resists of course).

*I'm unsure if these affect the growl, I suspect Growl is based upon the pet's char cheet AP and thus they would not.

Appologies to the tanks, but unless the hunter is vastly outgearing the tank, and the pet pulls agro with growl on, the tank isnt anywhere close to maximizing their TPS.

Also, my mention of it was in a raid scenario. In 5 mans, I'll agree that a pet can taunt off the tank, especialy if the group is low on CC and the tank is holding more than one mob.

Comment edited because of wrong thread. sorry

Values fluctuate a bit based on certain pieces being swapped around, but right now self-buffed, with stat-less ashtongue trinket:

[1] If you are in a BT/Hyjal guild, how much AP, Crit, and Hit do you have? : ~2100, ~32%, 139
[2] With what spec are these stats associated with? : as BM
[3] If BM, what pet are you using? : wind serpent
[4] If you are running WWS reports, what is your sustained DPS on fights like Teron and RoS? : Teron tops out at 2k, hit 2.2k last night but probably because i died at 50% to an unnoticed FD resist . RoS is weird because of the phases, P1 is somewhere between 2.3k and 2.9k iirc (can't check WWS now), other phases drop the overall down to 2kish.
[5] What type of shot rotation are you using? - 3:2 macro spam once threat is solid, sometimes multi's thrown in.

My pet's growl can pull off a tank in a 25man boss fight. Its happened exactly ONCE, and let me tell you, there's not much more humiliating to me than being called onto the carpet for something that stupid. *sigh* I've never let it happen again.

Is this with the tank holding one mob? Did your pet have salv? (I would guess not since hunter pets share a mass-palibuff table with warriors) Unless you severely outgear the tank, he must not have been paying attention to allow the pet to get that high. Unless for some reason all of his rage was burned and several of the skills were blocked, parried, or dodged (which would take extremely bad luck) Im really having a hard time seeing a pet anywhere near the tank on the agro meter.

Also, what pet are you using? My cat has never been able to generate that kind of agro without me purposefully using intimidate and BW to put him there. Im just wondering if theres other pet skills contributing to the higher threat production, because I dont believe growl to be able to solely push the pets TPS above a tanks.

With BM raidspec, 15% quiver and weapon with 2.9 speed, should I be using 3:2 or 1,5:1 macro?

My pet with growl will pull aggro from most tanks I have played with. The tank being very well geared (T4/T5, kara, Gruul, SSC geared) and me having 1 T4, mixed kara & PvP epics. In some cases my pet will pull aggro, the tank re-gaining aggro from my pet, then my pet pulls aggro again.

I don't raid much so I have done it more than once, luckily not for wipes.

Gore crits might do it, or perhaps a larger ammount of threat due to pet type?(Although I thought thats a normalized value?) Even with a string of crits on bite, claw, and white (well, orange on the standard blizzard UI combat text scroll) hits, my cat never comes anywhere near the tank, even with growl on. He can get up there, and if I ever see him anywhere on Omen, I know growl is on, but I've never had the cat pull agro in raid, even without salv (which he usually doesnt have due to the shared buffs with wars)

I have been recently seeing posts on wind serpents and it's the first time that I have researched into them. I currently use the ravager because of it's high dps during raid bosses and according to this post the wind serpent seems to be the best pet if I have 35% crit chance (I assume unbuffed?). Should I focus my stats around using this pet effectively or should I continue with the ravager?

I am currently doing Lurker, Leo, and Void Reaver, so I am assuming for these instances the wind serpent is definitely superior, not quite sure about other boss encounters.

I am not sure if this is the right place to post this question. I hope it is allthough I am not sure how anyone will find it buried this far into a thread, hehe. So to my question. After 8 1/2 years of EQ raiding I needed a break to try something different so started a WoW character. Everyone said make a Hunter they're a good all around class to get your bearings in the new enviornment. My character is only level 61 atm and I am just using a Talent tree I found on one of the threads here that was for a person named Polina, it seems to work very nicely. Coming from EQ I have no interest in PvP at all, pretty much all PvE either solo'ing or raiding. I tried to ask questions on the Blizz WoW boards for Hunters but they seem to attack anyone that isn't a PvP'er with a 2000+ rating (which I have no idea what that even means). So seeking to avoid the abuse for what is undoubtly a dumb question I figured I would ask over here where the quality of information I have found so far has been fantastic.

There are a number of stats that are new to me in WoW that I am not sure how they effect things or which ones are most important. First I was told AGI above all else, then crits, but now I am also reading about Power (ranged) now. The thing is since getting into Outland and doing quests I am getting items that raise one of these attributes at the detriment to the others and I am not sure which one is more important for what I am doing, solo'ing now and raiding when I get to 70 I am guessing.

Is the statistic order weighted by importance Crit Chance ..then Power (ranged) ..then Agility? Where does Hit Rating fall into this? I have a ring that drops my Crit chance a bit but doubles my Hit Rating (and raises my hps by a good amount). No clue how these stats interact other than that more AGI gives me more Crit Chance or which is more important as I try to select between gear items. For example, right now I have two 2h weapons, one gives more Power but less Crit Chance, the other the opposite, obviously. Not sure how much weight to put in the stats or how much difference is a lot, or whether melee DPS matters at all as far as that goes. Thanks for any help for a newb to WoW and I appreciate the information.

I have a few questions related to attack speed and latency. Firstly, if I use a macro that forces a 1:1 rotation all the time, at what attack speed do I lose the benefit of further haste? Right now I have a 1.89 attack speed normally, and with quickshots that goes down to 1.64. I also use a DST though, and if they are both active my attack speed is 1.37. I would think that any amount faster than the GCD would be wasted with a 1:1 rotation, since if both steady and auto fire in under 1.5 seconds I still have to wait for the GCD to start another one. But I am not sure if this is the case.

Secondly, how much of an effect does latency play when using this macro? My latency is normally around 250, which according to Cheeky's spreadsheet should make all of my haste effects really undesirable. It appears to work under the assumption that whenever my shot speed gets to 1.5s + latency, any further haste is wasted. The way I thought it worked was after my steady shot goes off, my auto shot starts casting. And in that .5 second cast time if I try and start another steady shot, the server will queue that shot to start immediately after the auto goes off, thus negating latency. That is how it works, right? So in theory, even with a 250 latency I should be able to benefit from extra haste effects.

My final question is, how exactly does the macro at the end of this post work. This is the one I use all the time, regardless of how many haste effects I have going. I know it's not optimal, but so long as it's pretty close I'm not too worried about it. However, one thing occurred to me which may mean this macro isn't working the way I wanted it to. Since it forces a 1:1 rotation, does spamming the macro before the autoshot finishes casting do anything? I mean, is it purposely not sending a command to the server to queue a steady shot until my client sees the autoshot go off? If this is the case, then the benefit of server side queuing would not be recognized, and my high latency would indeed be a hindrance when I have multiple haste effects going.

/castsequence reset=2 Steady Shot, !Auto Shot
/cast [target=pettarget, exists] Kill Command
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()

When MM specced before the expertise changes buffing tanks, and in t4/t5 content, I have no doubt my Owl (spamming growl and screech with GfTT) would have outaggroed tanks. Definitely on fights with aggro drops, probably on some other fights as well. My Windserpent probably wouldn't have had any chance to do so though, and it certainly doesn't now that I'm BM specced.

Since the person who pulled was talking about something happening in the past, maybe he meant in early TBC with an MM spec?

The articles here and here on wowwiki have a lot of good information on stat conversion and other topics for Hunters.

The reason agility is such a good stat for Hunters is because it impacts our attack power, chance to crit, dodge and armor. For leveling I would say look for agility > critical strike rating > hit rating.

If you mean me, SHE was talking about something that happens currently as BM spec.

I'm not trying to argue the point into the ground. Just disagreeing with the initial response that said a pet could never pull aggro off a tank with growl. My point merely was that pets can and do often pull off tanks with growl (and can pull off lesser geared tanks without using growl). My experience is much like Taidaisher in that, watching the target of target, I can see my pet pull off the tank, the tank pull back, pet pull off again, etc., until I turn growl off or pet dies.

Thanks a ton for the information and links. Tons of great information to study. Didn't know about the WoW wiki stuff, only been doing this a few weeks. I bookmarked them all and am reading through them now. Thanks again for all the help, great stuff.

This is why I have a /stopcasting (not even sure if this helps, though) /say macro for when I feign. It's the source of amusement and slight mockery, but noone ever says I didn't feign.

Certainly does help. Maybe not with what you are talking about, but it helps in that you Feign right away even in the middle of a Steady Shot or what not.

What I do hate is that you can activate FD while moving, but you won't drop to the ground (or anything that comes close to the animation), the CD will just be ticking. So if you stress a little on a mobile fight you can end up with FD on cooldown without ever having gotten the benefit. It doesn't matten a lot to me at least, but when it does happen it is couldn't possibly have come at a worse time. I mean there is a reason you are stressing, and that is the time when you really need that FD to go through.
Of course I have noticed this a bit more in PvP, but that is another discussion for another day.