So.....Testing the ap given to a pet from beast.
My findings are that aspect of the beast increases the pets component in his AP by 21%.
The glyph increases that 21% to 25.5% approx. Tested this with several pets and the numbers come out to be very close.
The hunters component of the pets AP is only derived from the hunters ranged AP never from his melee. I concluded this because I added a scroll of str to my hunter which never changed the pets AP.
Now aspect of the beast increases the hunters benefit to the pet from 22% to 26.5% unglyped and from 22% to 27.5% while glyphed.
Reasoning behind this madness? No clue, but that seems to be what I'm seeing consistently. Shandara, If you don't want to incorperate this current information about beast could you give us an unlocked spreadsheet so I can make the changes and model beast to see how it compares to dragonhawk?
Can anyone else test this and see if you see similar results?
So.....Testing the ap given to a pet from beast.
My findings are that aspect of the beast increases the pets component in his AP by 21%.
The glyph increases that 21% to 25.5% approx. Tested this with several pets and the numbers come out to be very close.
The hunters component of the pets AP is only derived from the hunters ranged AP never from his melee. I concluded this because I added a scroll of str to my hunter which never changed the pets AP.
Now aspect of the beast increases the hunters benefit to the pet from 22% to 26.5% unglyped and from 22% to 27.5% while glyphed.
Reasoning behind this madness? No clue, but that seems to be what I'm seeing consistently. Shandara, If you don't want to incorperate this current information about beast could you give us an unlocked spreadsheet so I can make the changes and model beast to see how it compares to dragonhawk?
Can anyone else test this and see if you see similar results?
Thank you
I was already working on this and it is in the next release. My test results are the same as yours.
Well, Aspect of the Beast increases your melee AP by 10%.. so that alone will boost the pet's AP up some past what you'd expect.. it's not just a flat 10% increase.
Edit: Nevermind, I am seeing that pets don't gain anything from Melee AP.. interesting.
My raw numbers:
WITHOUT Aspect of the Beast Glyph:
1478 Pet AP before AotB
1789 Pet AP after AotB
311 (21.04%) gain from AotB
WITH Aspect of the Beast Glyph:
1478 Pet AP before AotB
1854 Pet AP after AotB
376 (25.43%) gain from AotB
Well, Aspect of the Beast increases your melee AP by 10%.. so that alone will boost the pet's AP up some past what you'd expect.. it's not just a flat 10% increase.
That goes against this:
Originally Posted by dragoonvengance
The hunters component of the pets AP is only derived from the hunters ranged AP never from his melee. I concluded this because I added a scroll of str to my hunter which never changed the pets AP.
It makes a lot more sense to scale off your ranged AP. Come to think of it, I think that's even in an in-game tooltip somewhere on the character/pet screen. I had always assumed it was ranged AP.
So for fun, I basically entered best gears for each slot with T7 shoulders and legs.
With all raid buffs, it's sitting at 6019 AP, 42.9% crit, 99.83% hit, and some haste, ArP etc.
Now, the spreadsheet is indicating that 2 AP > 1 Hit, which I've never seen before (2 AP = 1, 1 Hit = .97, 1 Agi = .88, 1 ArP = .686, 1 Crit = .545).
Do we scale that well with AP? We might not even have to hit cap if this is true.
I also see that scorpid is about 400 dps higher than cat at this AP. A big nerf bat inc?
I know that scorpid poison dps is situational (i.e. if we can maintain the poison on one target the whole fight or not), but it still seems way too good.
Ah good to see some results on the Beast issue, it is definately strange at this time. But that calculation in the FAQ thread was pretty damn convincing, I guess it was just a coincidence.
sihyunie, that's a tough question to answer since the spreadsheet doesn't take into account the pethit that only jumps in full percentages. That means the closer you get to a percentage in Hit, the more valuable Hit becomes. Conversely, as soon as you pass a percentage, Hit takes a nosedive of epic proportions. So Hit should always be applied in large chuncks.
AP scales pretty much the same all the time so it is always a dead given value.
With Hit and AP that close, and you have the best gear in that setup, how many options are really around where you will sit and look at 20 AP vs 10 Hit? It is going to be hell of a lot more varied. So for ease of 'stacking' calculate them even. Though I would say that Hit holds another advantage that the spreadsheet can't factor in. Tranq might yet become highly important, don't want misses there... And, a miss to a Kill Shot might just be that last little loss of hitrating. Only one shot... But what a shot to miss with. The AP loss for a Kill Shot isn't that much (20 AP on a Kill Shot is hardly worth mentioning), but the miss itself is. AP is even across the board, misses aren't.
So when the variance is that small I wouldn't go and say AP is better. What does surprise me is the value of ArP though. Especially compared to Crit (of course at 43%, Crit is hardly that important anymore, most procbased talents are filled to the brim by then).
ranged: (with 400/400 bow skill and "reinforced bow" white bow with no stats)
damage 67-83
speed 1.91
power 328
hit rating 0
crit chance 0.60%
hope it helps! Trying to help the stats be the same as the in game one. It kinda bothers me when i get the same gear and talents and everything setup but it show some offsets. So I can't fully say "oh I do x dps".
I'm not sure what your problem is with Hawk and Dragonhawk.
Aspect of the Hawk is rank 1-8 and ends at level 68 with 155 AP.
Aspect of the Dragonhawk is rank 1-2 at level 74-80 with 230 and 300 AP.
You can select rank 9-10 Hawk (from before the addition of Dragonhawk) in the sheet but if you do that's definitely 'user error'. Both hawk and dragonhawk use the same table of spell values on the "Spell Values" tab. This was the easiests way to incorporate Dragonhawk into the sheet since it is purely a cosmetic name change and none of the effects actually change.
Been using the spreadsheet for awhile and just like to say thanks for all the work you have done on it. I have not had any issues with the sheet until today when I saw my hit at 277 but my hit chance vs lvl 83 mob was 100%.Now as you can see if you click armory link I dont have focused aim in talents or any buffs to boost hit currently on the sheet either, so my question is has the hit cap without FA changed? or is it a spreadsheet bug?
Been using the spreadsheet for awhile and just like to say thanks for all the work you have done on it. I have not had any issues with the sheet until today when I saw my hit at 277 but my hit chance vs lvl 83 mob was 100%.Now as you can see if you click armory link I dont have focused aim in talents or any buffs to boost hit currently on the sheet either, so my question is has the hit cap without FA changed? or is it a spreadsheet bug?
Hawk
Maybe you should read Hit rating and also try reading this thread
I'm not sure what your problem is with Hawk and Dragonhawk.
Aspect of the Hawk is rank 1-8 and ends at level 68 with 155 AP.
Aspect of the Dragonhawk is rank 1-2 at level 74-80 with 230 and 300 AP.
You can select rank 9-10 Hawk (from before the addition of Dragonhawk) in the sheet but if you do that's definitely 'user error'. Both hawk and dragonhawk use the same table of spell values on the "Spell Values" tab. This was the easiests way to incorporate Dragonhawk into the sheet since it is purely a cosmetic name change and none of the effects actually change.
I wasn't aware that there was a rank 9-10 for hawk, I guess it was only from beta. So When I change from hawk to dragonhawk I assumed it would go from hawk rank 8 to dragonhawk rank 2 because those are the skills I have. That's what I was confused about. If the hawk rank 9-10 were outdated why keep them?
I wasn't aware that there was a rank 9-10 for hawk, I guess it was only from beta. So When I change from hawk to dragonhawk I assumed it would go from hawk rank 8 to dragonhawk rank 2 because those are the skills I have. That's what I was confused about. If the hawk rank 9-10 were outdated why keep them?
Because it saved me the hassle of changing any calculations. Selecting Dragonhawk uses rank 9-10 Hawk and is just a cosmetic change.
Important: This release includes the upcoming nerfs to various abilities, use the previous version if you don't want them.
Update:
- Aspect of the Beast now double-dips
- Implemented -4,8% crit depression for level 83 targets as per Vulajins testing (both hunter and pet). Also changed target dodge for pets to 6,5% for level 80 pet vs 83 boss)
- Saving a profile now stores the used buffs for that profile as well (this breaks the importing of gear/settings, but not saved buff profiles/talent specs)
- fixed socket on Grotesque Handgrips
- Readiness now also resets Kill Command
- Implemented hand enchant 'Hyperspeed Accelerators'
- Heroism is now averaged over a 5minute duration, setting to turn it off or 'once per fight' on Settings tab. Reduces both hunter and cast speed
- Steady Shot scaling now 10% Ap
- Readiness no longer affects BW
- Kill Shot CD now 15 seconds
- Kindred Spirits now 3/6/9/12/15% pet damage
- Serpent's Swiftness now 2/4/6/8/10% pet speed increase
Is there a way other than using the custom gear sheet to input values and calculate results? Basically what I'm interested in is simulating my damage output with current gear pre-nerf and post-nerf as well as extrapolating what my dps would be pre-nerf with, say, 8000 AP and 45% crit and then comparing it to post-nerf dps to get an idea of the impact of these changes on hunter scaling
After a quick test with the new version of the spreeadsheet it resulted in a loss of around 65 dps. I exptected much more. Now the main question is the cat nerf
Notes from the user:
as of now the spreadsheet lists 30 less agi and 21 less intellect
stamina/strength/spirit was ignored since they are not dps related.
A quick bug report: In v80, my bow (Arrowsong) doesn't seem to register at all in the gear planner; it worked fine in v79a.
Also a quick feature request: A location in the gear planner for comparing two-handers with two one-handers, including one-hander enchants versus two-hander enchants, as enchants is where one-handers seem to make the most gain on two-handers.
Anecdotally, with the nerfs factored into the new sheet, my straw-man DPS went down from 6100 to 5500 with a Scorpid, and 5600 to 5200 with a Cat. Given that I've only been able to hit 5500 with a Scorpid on Patch, I'd say I'll be knocked down to 4800-5000 after the nerfs. These results are OK (a little low given my gear and in comparison to Mages/Locks I raid with), but the scaling with gear in the future seems problematic.
Thanks so much for working on this Shandara, it's an invaluable resource for all of us and your hard work is very appreciated.
12/08/08, 7:46 PM
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