WotLK DPS spreadsheet - Page 39

Hunterlin · 12/15/08, 4:11 AM

Originally Posted by Zerlu

Patch 3.0.2 - On Debuffs, Buffs, and Raid Stacking

I'm fairly sure it does stack, but I don't have a druid near by to test with. On a side note, I have its spore cloud set to auto cast, but it never does, not even with full focus. Has anyone else experienced similar issues?

EDIT: I can confirm that the DoT will be applied whether or not Faerie Fire is up, however I'm unsure as to whether or not the Ignore Armor function is being applied in that situation. Is there a way I might be able to test this?

I have tested this with druid and spore cloud's armor debuff does not stack with FF.

Iroared · 12/15/08, 6:44 AM

The gear comparison thing still isnt working properly. E.g. envoy of mortality is shown as one of the lowest DPS weapons and gives 0 dps increase.
And with other items, same thing. Black ice is rated lower than runeblade of demonstrable power, but when I switch between the two in the gear tab (even without the gem) it shows dps increase for black ice.

Shandara · 12/15/08, 7:25 AM

Originally Posted by Iroared

The gear comparison thing still isnt working properly. E.g. envoy of mortality is shown as one of the lowest DPS weapons and gives 0 dps increase.
And with other items, same thing. Black ice is rated lower than runeblade of demonstrable power, but when I switch between the two in the gear tab (even without the gem) it shows dps increase for black ice.

1) Are the filters set correctly to show the loot involved?
2) Have you run the 'Calculate Attributes' button?
3) Have you run the 'Ranged Weapons' button?
4) Have you run the 'Sort' button?

If you have done all 4 in this order and it's still showing Envoy as the lowest weapon then you might have found a bug. The same for Black Ice.

Selmarix · 12/15/08, 11:07 AM

I made a crude hack to the spreadsheet to evaluate the dps of BM and MM hunters in spreadsheet version 80 at different points in item progression. The assumption is that the item stats increase linearly with item level.
The evaluation is at full raid buffs with a cat as pet.

This is the BM hunter (total dps blue, pet dps red):

The MM hunter (total dps blue, pet dps red):

The x axis in both cases is the percent of item stats from gear below (negative) or above (positive) a 10 man geared hunter.
Only gun/quiver/ammo is not changed (as that was not quite that easy to hack in for the gun).

Dch48 · 12/15/08, 2:13 PM

Originally Posted by Iroared

The gear comparison thing still isnt working properly. E.g. envoy of mortality is shown as one of the lowest DPS weapons and gives 0 dps increase.
And with other items, same thing. Black ice is rated lower than runeblade of demonstrable power, but when I switch between the two in the gear tab (even without the gem) it shows dps increase for black ice.

In mine the Envoy of Mortality shows as the top weapon by far in the gear planner with a delta of 100.49. I'm not seeing any bug here on that item but Black Ice rates below the Runeblade of Demonstrable Power if you don't need the hit rating on it and we know haste doesn't do much any more. If you do need the hit on Black Ice, then it jumps up to a higher position. Make sure that the assume 100% hit option on the gear planner is set to no.

So much of the budget on Black Ice is spent in hit and haste that the other stats are not all that great.

Dch48 · 12/15/08, 2:47 PM

There is a bug in the talents page. If you put one point in longevity, dps goes up as it should. If you put in a second point, dps drops. Adding the third point produces an increase. Something is definitely wrong with that second point.

Xoran · 12/15/08, 3:23 PM

No, it is not, if you are using a cat, as has been pointed out numerous times here.

Keltan · 12/15/08, 4:19 PM

In regards to why Longevity 3/3 > Longevity 1/3 > Longevity 2/3 when using a cat.

Originally Posted by Shandara

The calculation in the sheet as it is now is correct, it's just a bit kludgy. The results won't change.

It comes from the fact that Rake ticks 3 times. Every 3 seconds for 9 seconds. Now if you have 2/3 or 3/3 Longevity (i.e. 8 or 7 sec cooldown) you'll cut off the last part of the Rake DoT.

In case of the 2/3 and coupled with pet GCD you waste nearly a whole tick (at a 1.25 sec pet GCD Rake will fire in ideal situations every 8.75 seconds). You'd have gotten the 3rd tick at 9 seconds so you waste 2.75 seconds of time. This is what leads to the dps LOSS.

In case of 3/3 Longevity it's the same, but with a 7 sec cooldown you waste less time. But, at the same time you get an added benefit from the reduced CD on Bestial Wrath/Rapid Fire, because of how the cooldowns line up. This leads to the substantial DPS boost.

This is all in theory and in the sheet of course. Testing will have to determine whether or not it's close enough to the truth.

Hunterlin · 12/16/08, 2:58 AM

There are some bug in gear planer, 3 of top ranged weapons (Envoy of Mortality, Arrowsong and Final Voyage) have 0 dps value.
Top weapon shown for me is Nerubian Conqueror. If I chose those weapon in gear list dps go up as it should.
I have no clue what causes them have 0 value in gear planer (and so they are in bottom in gear combobox).

Edit: I did as in instructions above and situation did become worse, 3 savage weapons did had 0 value too after ranged weapons calculation.
All filters are on(did uncheck and check them again).

Iru · 12/16/08, 3:09 AM

Try using the directions in the post six above yours

ScarySniper · 12/16/08, 4:33 AM

I´d like to test a 0/53/18 specc with imp AS but it seams that there are no L´n´L proccs with the refreshed serpsting. (testet both versions 79 and 80)

snail · 12/16/08, 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by Cranch

Per the calculations page, Grim Toll averages out to around 100 ArP. You can put in to the hand-adjust fields on the Gear page the same values as that trinket (83 hit, 100 ArP) and get the same results as putting the actual trinket in. So there's nothing broken with the trinket implementation.

It is true that the gear planner undervalues Grim Toll by about 21 dps for some reason but the gear planner is just a guide -- you should always insert your gear into the Gear page for the best estimation of actual dps.

I think the issue with grim toll being rated so low in some situations is the massive amount of hit on it.
I always assumed that the gear in the planner was rated based on dps change if the item in question replaced what was currently equipped.
The problem with Grim Toll, to my un-excel-expert eyes is that when the value of the trinket is being calculated it is done so based on your total hit, not on what your %hit would be without the +83 hit on the trinket. Check the contribution of the trinket when you are 80 hit below cap vs when you are at the cap (i.e. with and without the trinket). Make sure that you hit the "calc attributes" button between comparisons so that +hit is given the right contribution amount.

Faerdael · 12/16/08, 11:29 AM

Very minor bug [Perfect Bright Bloodstone] appears to be identified as a yellow gem instead of a red one.

Also, I am wondering if it would be possble to do any kind of manual adjust to the rotation. I notice any type of build with Readiness acting rather funny; ie. on Rotation Test tab I see Readiness called at 184s before the Rapid Fire that is already off CD. Is there a way I can correct for this?

Shandara · 12/16/08, 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by Faerdael

Very minor bug [Perfect Bright Bloodstone] appears to be identified as a yellow gem instead of a red one.

Also, I am wondering if it would be possble to do any kind of manual adjust to the rotation. I notice any type of build with Readiness acting rather funny; ie. on Rotation Test tab I see Readiness called at 184s before the Rapid Fire that is already off CD. Is there a way I can correct for this?

Are your priorities good? If Readiness is higher than Rapid Fire it'll be used first. Yet the logic waits for Readiness to get off CD before using Rapid Fire itself.

CrowneVict · 12/16/08, 12:49 PM

Originally Posted by ScarySniper

I´d like to test a 0/53/18 specc with imp AS but it seams that there are no L´n´L proccs with the refreshed serpsting. (testet both versions 79 and 80)

I've had LnL issues as well - LnL actually shows up as a DPS loss when trying to use AS.

Scrith · 12/16/08, 1:34 PM

If you are having problems seeing the 25-man Naxx weapons, try hitting the Ranged Weapons button on the Gear Planner.

CrowneVict · 12/16/08, 1:45 PM

Originally Posted by Scrith

I am having a similar problem: the 25-man Naxx ranged weapons are not showing up in the gear planner.

What I've done so far: downloaded the spreadsheet again and re-entered my info, made sure I have the 25-man box checked in the gear planner, made sure I have the Naxx button checked in the gear planner, hit the calculate attributes button, hit the test rotation button, made sure assume 100% is off, created other profiles for hunters I know (these weapons don't show up for them either). What am I missing?

Actually, this reminds me - For those of us unable to check the boxes in the gear planner, would it be possible to have them all checked by default? I run the sheet on a mac, so I'm unable to get any of the macros, boxes, etc working.

Shandara · 12/16/08, 4:44 PM

Originally Posted by CrowneVict

Actually, this reminds me - For those of us unable to check the boxes in the gear planner, would it be possible to have them all checked by default? I run the sheet on a mac, so I'm unable to get any of the macros, boxes, etc working.

You can edit the fields on the 'Control Data' tab if you know how to unhide it.

Synergy · 12/17/08, 7:06 AM

Is there a reason why it tells me that picking another piece and losing a 2 or 4 set bonus is a dps increase? That seems impossible to me.

Shandara · 12/17/08, 7:17 AM

Originally Posted by Synergy

Is there a reason why it tells me that picking another piece and losing a 2 or 4 set bonus is a dps increase? That seems impossible to me.

The Gear Planner is currently not account for t7 2-set bonus (or 4-piece). This will be in the next release.

Andawari · 12/17/08, 12:59 PM

@ Shandara:

Are there any plans to create an OpenOffice version (WotLK)?

Synergy · 12/17/08, 3:46 PM

Originally Posted by Shandara

The Gear Planner is currently not account for t7 2-set bonus (or 4-piece). This will be in the next release.

Ok that's what I thought but I wasn't sure. By the way, great work Shandara, this is good stuff.

Kathucka · 12/17/08, 6:04 PM

Originally Posted by Zerlu

I can confirm that the DoT will be applied whether or not Faerie Fire is up, however I'm unsure as to whether or not the Ignore Armor function is being applied in that situation. Is there a way I might be able to test this?

No guarantees if it will work, but you might try Beast Lore. I think that reports current armor.

Alex234 · 12/17/08, 9:08 PM

Thx for this spreadsheet !
But one thing - it always telling me that Arrowsong is better than Nerubian Conqueror, its really better ?

turbo_012 · 12/18/08, 12:34 AM

Ok I managed to reproduce the pet issue I had before and I just want to make sure if it's intended or if I'm doing something wrong.

Here's the screenshot of the pet pane to explain what I'm talking about.

The family is set to Cat correctly and the talents should be correct as well, I had to manually decide what the skill rotation should be and make the ones with cooldowns priority. The question is if it's correct to see 0.00 dps next to "call of the wild" and "rabid".