WotLK DPS spreadsheet - Page 82

akbinhil · 01/13/09, 6:12 AM

Originally Posted by ankah

the numbers for the spore cloud's dps is in the spread sheet, just not transferring over. Just check out the Pet calculation tab, and it will show the max dps and the actual dps, as long as you have the spore bat selected as pet, and have the skill on the rotation.

Few things to point out:

1. It did make it the number 1 pet for me (15/51/05, with 4 points into UF), in my case by 8dps.
2. The spore cloud's armor debuff is being calculated regardless of minor debuffs (calculations tab, armor penetration shows By Pet Debuffs of -630 armor), so it increases the pet's overall dps (in my case 18dps).
3. In short, it still did less than a cat/raptor (again, for me it was 10 dps less).

Since this is going to get out sooner or later: I did the test on live today, Spore Cloud at level 80 was stacking with both Faerie Fire and Sunder. Which means the entire raid gets another 700 (read 10%) armor penetration on the boss on top of the Major and Minor debuffs. My numbers fully raid buffed (according to the spread sheet--which doesn't factor in damage from Spore Cloud) put it *just* under cats when you add in that Spore Cloud damage. Expect a ninja fix soon I guess?

*edit as well*

I just calculated that extra 630 armor reduction as a 40-50 dps increase for me as SV explosive shot. Probably won't make up for CotW (I lose 60 personal dps due to losing CotW, but all other physical damage dealers in the raid will benefit as well--just one other hunter means the difference is evened out)

Breakerone · 01/13/09, 6:57 AM

I hope I didnt oversee that it was asked already, but is there an option to not rate mana related gains as +/- dps?
I wish I could model my talents and not lose dps by not getting invigoration, which is no dps increase if you dont run out of mana. Since there is no way to change the passworded settings, I guess this would be a viable option, dont you think?

Ursu · 01/13/09, 7:30 AM

Originally Posted by Breakerone

I hope I didnt oversee that it was asked already, but is there an option to not rate mana related gains as +/- dps?

In the settings tab, there is an option "Aspect behavior" in "hunter option - Misc option". Put "always on" to stay in dragonhawk (no viper). In this case, mana is not taken in account as dps (more mana or more mana regen is a benefit for dps if you have to put viper).

Breakerone · 01/13/09, 8:55 AM

Originally Posted by Ursu

In the settings tab, there is an option "Aspect behavior" in "hunter option - Misc option". Put "always on" to stay in dragonhawk (no viper). In this case, mana is not taken in account as dps (more mana or more mana regen is a benefit for dps if you have to put viper).

Perfect, thanks a lot. I guessed there must be an option. I didnt realize at all, that you can alter things on the setting page

Vitaro · 01/13/09, 9:02 AM

Originally Posted by akbinhil

Since this is going to get out sooner or later: I did the test on live today, Spore Cloud at level 80 was stacking with both Faerie Fire and Sunder.

Following your post I just went out to tame a Spore Bat with Spore Cloud (Rank 5) and tested at the dummy: It did indeed stack with Sunder Armor (which is a Major Armor Debuff) but not with Faerie Fire (which is a Minor Armor Debuff) (full listing of stacking types). Can you please explain how you came to the conclusion that Spore Cloud stacks with Faerie Fire? Is it only the final rank (Rank 6) that my level 75 bat does not have yet?

Breakerone · 01/13/09, 9:34 AM

I have another thing, that got me wondering. I was filling out both spreadsheets, the pre-ptr and the ptr one to see the difference. But while the sum on the pet dps breakdown is obviously incorrect (complete dps has it correct again), I just cant find out why I would lose on 4.2 percent of crit with the exact same spec and the exact same gear and zero buffs.

To make this easier I attach two screens of the overview.

Pre-PTR:

ImageShack - Image Hosting :: preptrdm7.jpg

PTR:

ImageShack - Image Hosting :: ptryz8.jpg

akbinhil · 01/13/09, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by Vitaro

Following your post I just went out to tame a Spore Bat with Spore Cloud (Rank 5) and tested at the dummy: It did indeed stack with Sunder Armor (which is a Major Armor Debuff) but not with Faerie Fire (which is a Minor Armor Debuff) (full listing of stacking types). Can you please explain how you came to the conclusion that Spore Cloud stacks with Faerie Fire? Is it only the final rank (Rank 6) that my level 75 bat does not have yet?

--Edit---
Don't go buy a new stable slot for a spore bat just yet, further testing is required since my server went down before I could completely finish!
--/Edit---

My Spore Bat is level 80, with rank 6 Spore Cloud.

I did it by using the Screeching Bow (39.1 damage no range) and testing my autoshot against a target first without debuffs. Then with my Spore Bat's cloud debuff on it (a slight increase in autoshot damage). Then with a druid's feral faerie fire (a slight increase in autoshot damage). Then with 5 sunders (a large increase in autoshot damage).

With each debuff I gained autoshot damage--and since my bow has no more than 4 damage variation (I didn't use hunter's mark, and I removed all equipment that procs), these increases in damage show that the debuffs do indeed stack.

When someone else gets a chance to play with a level 80 Spore Bat and test this again, let me know. My tests were quite rushed as I was trying to beat the server shutdown. So, this test needs to be replicated! Maybe it won't stack with boomkin FF?

I think I calculated it out to about 124 armor pen rating based on the pets's debuff post Sunder and FF--but this number I'm a LOT less sure about. Help me with this one too.

Nakari · 01/13/09, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by akbinhil

--Edit---
I forgot the importation question, are you testing on the PTR or live? US servers are down... so PTR?
--/Edit---

My Spore Bat is level 80, with rank 6 Spore Cloud.

I did it by using the Screeching Bow (39.1 damage no range) and testing my autoshot against a target first without debuffs. Then with my Spore Bat's cloud debuff on it (a slight increase in autoshot damage). Then with a druid's feral faerie fire (a slight increase in autoshot damage). Then with 5 sunders (a large increase in autoshot damage).

With each debuff I gained autoshot damage--and since my bow has no more than 4 damage variation (I didn't use hunter's mark, and I removed all equipment that procs), these increases in damage show that the debuffs do indeed stack.

When someone else gets a chance to play with a level 80 Spore Bat and test this again, let me know. My tests were quite rushed as I was trying to beat the server shutdown. So, this test needs to be replicated! Maybe it won't stack with boomkin FF?

I think I calculated it out to about 124 armor pen rating based on the pets's debuff post Sunder and FF--but this number I'm a LOT less sure about. Help me with this one too.

It's quite simple... Fareie Fire is stronger than Spore Cloud, so in your test Faerie Fire would have overwritten Spore Cloud and thus resulted in increased damage. If you want to know if they truly stack you'd need to make one test with only Faerie Fire and one with Faerie Fire and Spore Cloud up, and see if the damage differs (my guess: it won't).

akbinhil · 01/13/09, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by Nakari

It's quite simple... Fareie Fire is stronger than Spore Cloud, so in your test Faerie Fire would have overwritten Spore Cloud and thus resulted in increased damage. If you want to know if they truly stack you'd need to make one test with only Faerie Fire and one with Faerie Fire and Spore Cloud up, and see if the damage differs (my guess: it won't).

Yes you're right, now I look like an ass

. I'll give it a try when my server comes back up. Damn being in a hurry and tired!

danglebombs · 01/13/09, 10:20 AM

On my spreadsheet in the gear planner section, the entire helms section, a couple items in the hands section, the entire trinket, ring, and shoulder section are all coming up as #N/A. I don't have any idea wahts causing this seeing as I haven't done anything differently than I did before.

thehittmann1981 · 01/13/09, 10:39 AM

Just wondering...

Why does dps increase when noxious stings talent is taken? The talent itself should add 0 dps?

thehittmann1981 · 01/13/09, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by Shutruk

I don't know if this has been reported yet, but when I read my gear from the armory, it doesn't pick up the "Darkmoon Card: Greatness", It just displays my "Bandit's Insignia" twice.

Guessing it has something to do with the same ID numbers on the Darkmoon Cards between Int, Agi, STR and Spirit?

I have Darkmoon Card: Greatness and it imports it on my spreadsheet with my other trinket and everything else I have without failing, I don't think the trinket has an issue... possibly someting else you have.

Fierra · 01/13/09, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by thehittmann1981

Just wondering...

Why does dps increase when noxious stings talent is taken? The talent itself should add 0 dps?

From Thottbot: increases all damage done by you on targets afflicted by your Serpent Sting by 3%.

If you are using the spreadsheet, it is taking into account damage dealt while your target is afflicted by SrS.

thehittmann1981 · 01/13/09, 10:49 AM

Ahh so the wyvern sting actually has nothing to do with the increase and does not need to be dispelled for it to occur. Got it.

Iru · 01/13/09, 11:03 AM

Originally Posted by Breakerone

I have another thing, that got me wondering. I was filling out both spreadsheets, the pre-ptr and the ptr one to see the difference. But while the sum on the pet dps breakdown is obviously incorrect (complete dps has it correct again), I just cant find out why I would lose on 4.2 percent of crit with the exact same spec and the exact same gear and zero buffs.

See this thread for the details. Current thinking is the level mechanics for crit have changed to mimic weapon skill, defence etc which means you lose 4.8% crit against a boss level mob. As that drop has been verified for both hunter and melee classes, the spreadsheet now takes it into account.