Beast Mastery Bible 3.0 - Page 51

Aern · 12/19/08, 11:32 AM

Osse I notice you're using a Haste pot during you're third BW to keep the haste buffs going, are you also waiting for Quick Shots to proc or just going right when the CD comes up? I also noticed that you didn't gain AotB so I'm assuming you were AotDH through most of the fight, maybe starting out with Beast and then going into DH. Question there is I dunno how you're getting your pet to do almost 500 more dps than mine. Kibler's bits and 2 points in CS I don't really think are making THAT much of a difference, but I'll definitely be going with every little bit this week to see if I can duplicate your numbers. I just can't seem to figure out how your pet is doing 493 more dps than mine. >.>

DPS from last Patchwerk for comparison

Fimbo I know in the past it used to be a general rule that 35% crit was the point at which you could drop 1 point out of GftT, but with the lower cost on pet family specials, and the fact that we dont have a wind serpent eating 50 focus per special now, I believe the number is drastically lower.

Osse · 12/19/08, 12:45 PM

Fimbo I haven't looked for the hot spot for when 1 point in GftT is enough to keep scorpid happy but I'm certain that 35% crit is enough.

Aern I do try to stack all the haste buffs for BW's and yes I only used AotB for the first two BW's mainly because in the past I've found myself without aspect while running to Grobbulus trash, damn rapid fingers clicking aspect off.

That dps difference seems to pile up from various things which in the end results in a big difference. CS, kibler's bits, slightly slower kill time, dodge RNG, slightly lower AP and AotB are the things I can find when comparing WWS's.

Thing is, with scorpid 3/3 CS is actually pretty huge advantage over 1/3. Our gear and raid setup is rather similar and claw dps difference is almost 210. Those two extra points in longevity essentially do nothing unless you change glyph of bestial wrath to serpent sting, certainly not 105 dps per talent point.

I guess if we got one more reset before 3.0.8 I'll shift two points from rapid killing to imp HM as they give zero dps on Patchwerk and push for even higher numbers assuming that they don't hotfix HAT rogues.

Aern · 12/19/08, 1:34 PM

From what I have been told by our rogues the multiple point gen coming from multiple hat rogues in the same group has already been hot fixed so I believe the talent is working as intended now.

As for CS/Long issue, what glyphs are you using with 1/3 Long? I'd assume Steady Shot Imp AotH and BW, seeing as how those are fairly standard. As for the points going into Imp HM and out of rapid killing I probably won't go that far considering it is a rather hefty advantage on fights that aren't ridiculously short. Anyhow hopefully this week with my significantly better trinkets (went from zerker's call and mirror of truth to bandit's insignia and fury of the five flights) I should be able to pull in higher average scorpid stacks, combined with using AotB I better be seeing over 3k pet dps or I'm gonna kill someone's kitten!

Also I dunno if all you BM guys are aware of the change to SV yet but Explosive shot is back to 18% AP modifier per tick so 54% total. Basically its a MONSTER again and as a result we might be seeing some more competition for top dps since so much of our gear seems to be pretty well itemized for MM/SV with all that haste. Just some food for thought.

Osse · 12/19/08, 1:39 PM

You guessed the glyphs right. If HAT has indeed been hotfixed then I guess there's not much point respeccing as my guilds kill time will probably go down by 30 seconds.

Esoth · 12/19/08, 3:50 PM

Originally Posted by Osse

Fimbo I haven't looked for the hot spot for when 1 point in GftT is enough to keep scorpid happy but I'm certain that 35% crit is enough.

I know this has been brought up before, but 1/2 GftT is only ever "enough" if your crits are evenly distributed among all of your shots. Crit strings can give your pet more focus than it can use at that particular time (since they can't build up more than 100 focus), while non-crit strings can leave your pet with too little focus. Although the final result may show you having crit the same percentage as your character sheet, it doesn't necessarily reflect usable focus points. The second point in GftT is insurance against the RNG.

This is a known limitation of Shandara's spreadsheet, which assumes a steady generation of focus based on your crit. What you would need is a method to tell you how likely you are to starve your pet based on your crit, in which case I can very well see the probability being low enough to make 1/2 GftT more desirable at some crit levels. As far as I know, no one has modeled this and until then one person being certain that "35% crit is enough" is not good enough for me

Osse · 12/19/08, 3:55 PM

This has been debated over and over again so I'll clarify my earlier post a bit here.

My 35% crit guideline is based on me staring at my scorpids focus bar during bosses for several weeks and it literally never starves on stand and shoot fights.

Polycarp · 12/19/08, 7:11 PM

Originally Posted by Osse

Get 263 hit rating and spent FA points in improved stings. Second point in go for the throat is wasted.

80 ap food, 180 ap flask, kibler's bits and mammoth cutters as consumables.

50/21 would be the key to success before 3.0.8

Your guilds kill time is the real dps killer though.

Yea It'd be nice to actually have a full complete and balanced raid, but its very slim pickings on nordrassil. I havent played with the spreadsheet in week because it doesnt have some of the gear I have cuz im lazy and havent updated it, so im doing most my experimenting in raids. Ive tried mighty thoughts elixir in conjuntion with the armorpent, agil, or crit one. And tried crit food, armor pent food, agi food, and always use kiblers. Ill give straight AP a whirl next raid..which wont be til jan 4th for the holidays sadly. Has anyone been using several pieces of gear with armor pent on them? And is it as significant as it once was? Thinking about buying the 25man badge boots. Plus the added hit is hawt.

Oh and the fact that you're orc is substantial. lol...whats it like getting drops u want?

vulturesrow · 12/19/08, 7:19 PM

You guessed the glyphs right. If HAT has indeed been hotfixed then I guess there's not much point respeccing as my guilds kill time will probably go down by 30 seconds.

Osse,
I thought the conventional thought on glyphs was Bestial Wrath, Serpent Sting, and Steady Shot? Im sorry if it is a noobish question but I was wondering why the IAotH glyph vice Serepent Sting?

Koonihc · 12/19/08, 11:31 PM

moved

Osse · 12/20/08, 2:25 AM

Originally Posted by vulturesrow

Osse,
I thought the conventional thought on glyphs was Bestial Wrath, Serpent Sting, and Steady Shot? Im sorry if it is a noobish question but I was wondering why the IAotH glyph vice Serepent Sting?

Due to it's high uptime. You can expect over 50% uptime for quick shots. That's 50% of the fight with 6% extra haste.

Actually I checked the uptimes from my most recent Patchwerk and found that I had 17.8% uptime while my guildie hunter had 60%. Seems like I got screwed over by RNG properly that go.

vulturesrow · 12/20/08, 3:35 AM

Originally Posted by Osse

Due to it's high uptime. You can expect over 50% uptime for quick shots. That's 50% of the fight with 6% extra haste.

Actually I checked the uptimes from my most recent Patchwerk and found that I had 17.8% uptime while my guildie hunter had 60%. Seems like I got screwed over by RNG properly that go.

Osse,
Any idea how much a DPS increase this yields over the serpent sting glyph?

Polycarp · 12/20/08, 4:33 AM

Originally Posted by Osse

Due to it's high uptime. You can expect over 50% uptime for quick shots. That's 50% of the fight with 6% extra haste.

Actually I checked the uptimes from my most recent Patchwerk and found that I had 17.8% uptime while my guildie hunter had 60%. Seems like I got screwed over by RNG properly that go.

But with as much haste as a lot of gear has now, is 6% helping you or hurting you? guess it depends on your current haste rating. Im close to 400 and i got rid of that glyph. still tryin diff things

Osse · 12/20/08, 4:50 AM

I don't know about exact dps increase but how exactly can 6% extra haste not help me? It will always be 6% extra haste to auto shots and higher proc chance /uptime on various abilities. (quick shots, trinkets, cobra strikes, etc)

Kisla · 12/20/08, 5:51 AM

Originally Posted by Osse

Does anyone have a WWS for Patchwerk that's above 6147? Would be interesting to see what kind of setups people run with to get those kind of dps figures. We killed Patchwerk in 2 mins 38 seconds which is absolutely horrible compared to the top WWS's so I'm easily losing 200 dps compared to those due to our kill time. We also had no call of the wilds as the new hunter didn't respec his pet. I got slightly screwed by the auto shot RNG but I guess it's not so big. I guess if patch won't go live next week we might be close to two minute kill as the fourth rogue will be HAT and we'll go with 5 healers.

Wow Web Stats

Only log I found close was this. They had five cats and 25 second faster kill time though. :>

Our thursday kill Wow Web Stats 6287 dps on a 2'43'' kill, can't wait untill we try to push raid dps instead of just clear the thing.

Osse · 12/20/08, 8:06 AM

Interesting. I suppose it'll be full AotB and glyph of AotB for next weeks Patchwerk then.

Seeing that you didn't use potion of speed or 3/3 CS build 6.5k should be doable with 2'30 ish kill time.