sonofgloin

We have plenty of Draenei in the raid.

Any other tips?

Or am I relying too much on having my Draenei close to me?

 

IceyDevil

No, he's right on. He's alliance and probably runs with a draenei in his group, giving him 8.01% hit.

Damage done for the night includes wipes, of which your damage was top notch. Factor in that the death knight (the only person who beat you in wipe damage) did less damage than you on most kills, and you've got yourself a #1 damage dealer for the night, yet losing on actual kills to several people who didn't perform as well during wipes.

It may help you to separate heroic kills from normal kills, as well as to simply look at each kill individually. Total damage done is never a good indication of your performance, as it factors in too many things that don't really matter (such as wipes). Unfortunately, hunter damage in top end raids isn't near the top, so you can't really hope to top the meters all the time like other classes. Compare yourself to your spreadsheet values, not to other people, that is the only real way to judge your own personal performance.

 

sonofgloin

Thanks for the notes. Yes I am just looking at H NRB25 kill for right now, mostly a tank n spank. I'm comparing myself against Duece, a great hunter, also Survival, #2 on that kill. I was #5.

FemaleDwarf says his DPS potential with full buffs would be 8231, mine should be 8481.

Am I clipping shots or something, or my priority messed up? I can't tell.

 

alienangel

This is worth commenting on, since in my raid at least I see a lot of people just assuming they have the 1% hit because there's a dranei in their group. I set up an aura to warn me whenever I don't have Heroic Presence on me, and on just about any fight with a little bit of mobility it see myself without the buff a LOT (and consequently have learned where my usual draenei tend to stand in each phase of each fight).

All that being said though, the 1% hit is usually around 1% dps on the spreadsheet, which is going to be 70-100 dps for most raiders, which isn't going to account for any massive differences in your performance.

 

Iru

Judging by the autoshot and steady shot count differences on that fight, you're moving a lot more than he is.

 

Cranch

Testing tonight on TotC-25 Icehowl, feigning while someone else was targeted did not work, and neither did stoneform nor deterrence. In all cases, I was stunned and unable to cast any spell. I didn't try a PvP trinket.

 

MizarAlcor

I haven't tried it myself, but a guildy confirmed that PVP trinket works. However, the DPS loss for the whole fight as a result of equipping it might not worth the couple of times you got frozen, except for humans of course. Also, I'm pretty sure iceblock and bubble work. That's why I was wondering whether Deterrence, being intended as our "inferior bubble", might work if done at the split second of ice breath's casting.

 

tws311

I've looked this up in both the boomkin thread and the hunter pages, and have not found a good answer, for the "to hit" debuff that the scorpid sting and un-glyphed insect swarm applies to the boss. who takes the less dps loss to keep up the buff? from looking at our wss's and world of logs it seems the druid should un-glyph but I'm meeting serious resistance and don't want to play the "I'm the dps officer do what i say" card so i was hoping to find some solid numbers some were. if you guys can help me out I'd appreciate it.

 

boli

I don't know much about druids, but from a hunter POV the dps loss is far from negligible. As only one kind of sting can be up on any one target (per hunter), the hunter keeping up Scorpid sting would obviously lose the Serpent sting. Most raiding hunters will have either 2 pieces of T8 gear (+10% damage on Serpent Sting), 2 pieces of T9 gear (Serpent Sting ticks can crit) or possibly both.

As such the dps loss of not having Serpent up is very noticeable. To give you a rough idea: the EJ hunter spreadsheet puts Serpent Sting at about 7% of my damage. In reality (according to WoL logs) it's usually a bit more (I do have the T9 bonus, but not the T8 one), but that may be partially due to multi-dotting. The average damage contribution of Serpent Sting over all our kills last night (TotC-25, Onyxia-25, Ulduar-25) was 8.4% for me, and 7.6% for a fellow hunter.

Also of note: insect swarm costs 8% of base mana whereas Scorpid Sting costs 11%. Scorpid Sting does last quite a bit longer though: 20s (compared to Insect Swarm's 12s).

I don't know if the druid would "lose" only one GCD every 12s as well as some mana, or something more as well. I'm sure any druid in your guild would happily tell you exactly what.

 

Bambislayer

... Just to add to what Boli said.

Boomkins use insect swarm as part of their normal rotation. Unglyphing it and replacing it with another glyph, such as starfall or focus, would be a minor DPS loss for them, if at all. In AoE fights it would probably be a DPS increase in fact.

As a hunter, applying scorpid is a DPS loss and a huge one too. we have nothing extra to add to scorpid to even try and compensate. Your boomkin should apply the debuff if it is needed.

 

alienangel

This is off topic to the thread, but PvP trinkets are arguably worth wearing not because you can trinket yourself out of a freeze, but because if the person Icehowl is targetting with his breath trinkets out of it, icehowl immediately ceases casting and everyone affected by it is instantly released. So even if each individual is hit my multiple breaths targetted at different people (of which he'd only be able to trinket himself out of the first one), if each of the primary targets has a trinket (or human racial) everyone is always broken out immediately with minimal damage taken or downtime.

This is all unnecessary if you have a ret pally in the raid with the stun removal on BoF talent though, since it has the same effect when cast on the primary target.

If FDing the cast directed at you has the same effect as trinketing out after it hits you, hunters would never need to consider wearing a trinket though, which would be nice.

 

KraxisSingular

It is actually even worth it sometimes if you have two Resto Druids to have one as a dedicated IS applyer rather than Hunters doing it. It is that much of a difference. I know a few who will gladly do it when our Boomkins decide to not tag along.

And while Serpent Sting is a considerable part of our damage all by itself there are several factors playing in too.
In the case of a BM (least loss) the Steady glyph is lost, which afaik is the most direct damage from glyphs for them.
In the case of Survival the loss is also from Noxious Stings, which doesn't include Scorpid, and if the Hunter has planned around T9/2 and gone for 1/3 EW the loss is that much more accentuated.
And in the case of MM I shouldn't need to say it.

 

Loady

I have one simple question. So, the other night, I finally managed to get rid of my outdated black ice, causing me to lose 2,2% hit, which subsequently caused me having a bad case of missing hit. I was on ~7% before that, but now I've dropped down to a staggering 4,9%. Problem here is, I have nothing to supplement this hit with. I do have my old gear pieces stored in bank, but there's nothing that would improve my situation. Right now, I have saved up just over 100 triumph badges, so I've been considering buying MoS for 50 of them to get me back on the line. I've heard that this trinket isn't all that good, but I myself don't think it's that bad, at least not in my situation. I'll still have enough badges to get the ring and I've already got 2/5 windrunner. Any advices on what to do?

 

Enova

I don't see your spec, but unless you already have 3/3 Focused Aim, you should consider spending 3 points there until you sort out your hit gap.

Most specs have some talents you can safely drop the 3 points from (Improved Hunter's Mark, Master Tactician, 1-2 points from Expose Weakness, Wild Quiver, Improved Steady Shot, Rapid Recuperation, etc), while minimizing the loss of dps.

Guilty as charged ^

 

Tyren

Just a simple question here. Ive tried to google the answer and browsed through many pages here, but couldnt seem to find the answer. I was trying to spec my hunter with a MM build. After reading a few good articles, I was left with the choice between Focused Aim and Efficiency. I can put 3 points in Focused Aim, or 3 in efficiency. My question is what is more beneficial for raiding vs. 5-mans?

I am hit capped so the 3% hit from Focused Aim would be overkill. My hunter currently does some raids when I have time. So I've had the opportunity to experience ToTc. From what I have gathered there isn't much raid damage going around to warrant 3/3 Focused Aim and the reduced pushback of 70%. Where as the mana from efficiency might be more beneficial but I could be wrong. What are the communities thoughts?

 

Bambislayer

Having looked at your armory you dont currently have a MM spec, and you dont link to one your considering so it is difficult to advise you on. However, Focused Aim you would really only take if you needed the +hit, the push back resistance is just a bonus.

Efficiency is a weak Talent too in my experience. I am sure, no matter your build, there would be better ways to spend the 3 points. I too have 3 points to play around with and if they are not needed in Focused Aim i normally split them between Imp. Hunter's Mark and Rapid Recuperation.

Edit: also consider using the spread sheet or the DPS analyser at femaldwarf to determine the answer for yourself. very useful hunter tools for answering simple questions like yours

 

Sharoman

Im sure this has been asked before but i cant seem to find it.
What would be the optimal amount of haste i need as a MM hunter, especialy considaring im using Glyph of the Hawk.

 

Whitefyst

That is really an MM specific question that is answered in the MM threads. However, to save you the trouble of digging.

If you are concerned about getting your Steady Shot casts down to the 1.5s GCD at all times, then:
- The 15% "quiver" bonus gets your Steady Shot down to about a 1.74s cast already
- This means that you need about another 16% haste or about 525 haste rating to get to the GCD

The next question is whether it is worthwhile to acquire that much passive haste to get to the haste softcap. For most MMs, the answer is no since:

- Haste is our least important stat. For my character, it is only valued at 0.623, while: agility is 1.655; Arp is 1.549; crit is 1.336; AP+2 is 1.358; and even Int is 0.784. You have to give up a lot of more beneficial stats, many of which are twice as good, in order to acquire it.

- Most dynamic haste effects will get us to the softcap with either just a little passive haste or none required. Even the unglyphed QS's 15% haste gets us within 28 haste rating of the soft cap when it is up. Bloodlust/heroism, rapid fires, and speed pots will get us over the softcap. Considering how often we are under dynamic haste effects (probably 50-75% of the time), the value of passive haste is less.

- The needs of our rotations.
-- For those MMs, like you, that do not have any glyphs that reduce the CD of our shots, especially CS, then you should have a 10s rotation of CS->AiS->SSx4 (with AiS and CS possibly being switched depending on which gives highest ISS benefit). The two instant casts shots take 3s of the 10s. This leaves 7s for 4 Steady Shots. This means that your average SS cast needs to be less than 1.75s, which it already is per the "quiver" bonus. Hence, in ideal conditions, you technically need 0 haste rating. However, none of us execute our rotation ideally with latency and reaction time having impacts. Hence, you need to acquire at least a little haste to counteract your latency and reaction time in the situations where you have no dynamic haste to maintain a tight rotation. How much passive haste that is depends on your situation. For reasonable latency and reaction time, I recommend about 3% haste or about 100 haste rating, if possible. When under dynamic haste effects, you will have a small wait time with this rotation after the last SS before CS/AiS is off CD to restart it.
-- Rotations with shots with reduced CDs from glyphs can require additional passive haste to be ideal so that you maximize the benefit of the reduced CD, but how much depends on which glyphs, which rotation, latency, and reaction time. Since this situation does not currently apply to you and is much more complex, I will pass on that discussion.

Thus, assuming you have relatively low latency and decent reaction times, it looks like you have sufficient passive haste currently.

By the way, due to MMs with the Marked for Death talent getting the SS glyph benefit for free currently, you can replace that glyph with something else. I recommend either the KS glyph so that it will fit right into your 10s rotation in place of a SS or the TSA glyph for more AiS crits.

 

Thetalisker

My sincerest apologies if this has been asked before, but I've searched and couldn't find it - I was wondering how the healing reduction from Aimed Shot is working if several hunters are using it simultaneously.

I know it doesn't stack with similar debuffs from other classes, so it would stand to reason that multiple Aimed Shots won't stack either, but I can't find any confirmation.

 

KraxisSingular

It's exclusive, otherwise stacking certain classes would bring too much benefit for certain encounters, or heck even in PvP.

 

Ninaev

I was looking at stats from Koralon fight where Kripparrian (Exodus, US Ysondre) had 11k dps on Koralon and noticed this when I looked at his list of buffs in that fight

WoW Meter Online - Combatlog Replay

He had 2x greatness, 2x Mjolnir and 2x Dark Matter procs...Procs from 3 trinkets. Can anyone explain that?

edit: On this Algalon fight

WoW Meter Online - Combatlog Replay

He had 5x Greatness, 6x Mjolnirs and 6x Dark Matter procs...trinket swapping? Or I risk to make complete fool of my self...

 

• Allara

The Greatness in question is the buff that is applied when your T9 4-piece bonus procs. The hunter gains the buff, even though only the pet receives the attack power.

 

Ninaev

Thanks. Also saw that he uses potion of wild magic rather than haste one. Spreadsheet says potion of speed is better so I guess wild magic is more useful only on Anub 25 hard mode when volley is more than 60% of our total dps or am I wrong?

 

Enova

I doubt *that* is the reason, because Volley does benefit from haste, unless I'm mistaken. Also, Volley doesn't actually scale with spell power

Wild magic might come in handy if you time it during other haste effects (Rapid Fire, Heroism), or if you actually managed to gather enough haste to reach the soft cap (and given the amount of haste going around some of the gear, it's not really hard).

Guilty as charged ^

 

alienangel

I think he was positing use of Wild Magic during volley because the crit from it is useful for volley (while the haste from Speed isn't).