The answer is all over the place. You could try the spreadsheet and see what it is for YOU, but in general they are pretty close. If you have a secondary SV spec then go AGI, if you have a BM spec you use often then go AP. For me AGI wins out 1.411 to 1.217 per budget point.

I think we are still working out the numbers, and matching it each other, but so far, it looks as if most MM hunters will take some points into IHM. How many will depend on other factors. Me for example, would only have 2 points to invest in it, since I like the aimed shot glyph (dps on the run is king, in my opinion in ulduar), and therefor value Imp Barrage more than most.

Since the spread sheet will most likely show a dps increase for 3 points in IHM over Imp Bar or ISS, I would guess a lot of hunters will go that way, and if you raid with 3 hunters, its a no brainer.

Unless the glyph gets altered, it would be a dps loss in all accounts, even with 3 hunters present in the raid (from my very very quick math)

I have two questions

1) I see a lot of MM builds that have 2 points in Rapid Killing. As has been discussed the secondary increased dmg effect rarely applies in boss fights and is of little use, so the decreased cooldown on Rapid Fire is the main benefit, but isn't that redundant when using readiness every cooldown brings Rapid Fire to 3 min anyway?

2) Assuming Rapid Fire is being used every 3 min on boss fights would 2 points in Rapid Recuperation or 2 in Efficiency yield better results?

1. Rapid Fire and Rapid Recuperation are picked up together, not by themselves. Since when did Readiness do anything to alter the cooldown of Rapid Fire? To get 2 x Rapid Fire the second time around, you need 2 points in Rapid Killing.

2. Refer to 1. This especially goes for Rapid Recuperation.

Regardless of who places the HM, all get the standard benefits from the HM (the 500 AP).

If you have IHM and/or the HM glyph and apply it to the target, all hunters on that target get the benefit of the improved glyph since it is applied to the mark itself. However, if another hunter without the better HM cast it on the target and you did not, all the hunters on that target only get the base HM since it is applying that person's cast and not yours. Thus, if you are the hunter in the raid with the better HM, you better be casting it or else you are not getting any benefits from the talent and/or glyph. I believe that those with the best HM will overwrite the HM casts of any hunter with a lesser HM and those hunters with a lesser HM cannot overwrite the cast of a better HM.

Concerning Marked for Death, only those with the talent get the talent's benefit from the HM. Here is the actual talent text:

Increases your damage done by your shots and the damage done by your pet's special abilities by 5% on marked targets, and increases the critical strike damage bonus of your Aimed Shot, Arcane Shot, Steady Shot, Kill Shot and Chimera Shot by 10%.

Thus, on any target with an HM cast by any hunter, you get the damage bonus if you have the talent. The critical strike damage bonus is a passive ability of the talent and applies regardless of whether there is an HM on the target.

1) I think you are missing the main point of Readiness. It is not used to effectively decrease the CD of RF to 3 mins. It is used to decrease the CD of RF to 0 every 3 mins. Hence, we do not use Readiness to do a RF every 3 mins instead of 5 mins. We use RK to reduce the CD of RF to 3 mins, which nicely matches the CD of Readiness. Then every 3 mins we can do 2 Rapid Fires (RF->Readiness->RF). Thus, between RK and Readiness, the effective CD of RF is about 90 seconds.

2) RR > Eff. 2 points in Efficiency only saves you 6% mana (on shots and stings) over the course of a fight. This savings does not apply to the mana costs of other actions like applying HM, MD, FD, Deterrence, Disengage, RF, Mend Pet, Kill Command, Scare Beast, Revive Pet, Flare, Traps, melee attacls, and some other rarely used abilities. Plus, the amount you save is dependent on the cost of the ability used. On the other hand 2/2 RR provides 4% mana every 3 seconds during the 15 seconds of a RF. That is 20% mana back per RF and applies whether you are doing anything or not during the RF. Considering as stated in 1) that we usually use Readiness to do back-to-back RFs, that is 40% mana back every 3 mins. For a fight where you can do 4 RFs (at least about 3:30 minutes long), that is 80% mana back. The absolute amount back is dependent on the size of your mana pool. Thus, a larger mana pool means that you get more mana back from this talent. With all the int on hunter gear (especially now that we have Careful Aim), our mana pools are decently large when fully raid buffed. Another benefit of this talent is the additional 6% mana you get back whenever you gain Rapid Killing buff. This is a nice additional benefit on bosses with adds you are killing and while speed pulling trash.

I didn't express myself very well, I know Rapid Fire and Rapid Recup have nothing to do with one another. Readiness does reset the cooldown of Rapid Fire however, so it doesn't seem to matter that rapid fires cooldown is 5 min when it can be reset every 3 min with Readiness, at least that's what I'm trying to figure out.

The second and completely unrelated question is 2 points in Rapid Recuperation yield more mana regen than 2 points in Efficiency saves?

Right..ok, ty, wheres my head

Better still is to hit readiness immediately after hitting rapid fire.

Actually I would hit it right after Chimera Shot since it resets that cooldown. RF > Chimera > Readiness > Chimera and Rapid Fire again when it fades.

I agree but I actually use Rapid Fire then all three of my instant casts (Chimera, Aimed, Arcane) before I hit readiness. It really maximizes the burst potential and doesn't waste a GCD that could be anything other than Steady Shot.

How do you get them aligned so all are off cooldown?

It's not that hard. If they weren't all on cooldown at some point you would never use Steady Shot.

I've also been wondering about MM's viability on a fight like Vezax with the 3.1.3 mana buff. The spreadsheet says that without any mana regen buffs, MM now beats out Surv by a surprising 200 DPS (in my current gear). Does this sound about right? If that's true, then it looks like MM is going to be the clear winner above Surv for any fight in Ulduar, even without JoW etc.

MM actually has great viability on Vezax if you can organize your Shadow Crashes a little bit (for the mana cost reduction more than the damage boost which is small for MM).

True, but in order to fire them all in succession they all need to be *OFF* cooldown at exactly right time.

I tend to wait to pop Readiness until they all come off cooldown and are able to be put back on cooldown, if that makes any sense. In other words, I wouldn't pop Readiness if my shot(s) are coming off CD in 1-2 seconds, but I would after I put them back on the CD.

Seems like if you raid with a MM hunter that has 3/3 IHM and a enh shammy/blood DK, 7/57/7 will give you the most dps from spreadsheet.

delete please.

I haven't verified this with the spreadsheet (posting from my phone) but I think you'd be better off taking a point or more from Improved Steady Shot if you wanted to pickup IHM.

If you're having mana issues at all in your raid composition (as in you have to go into viper or shoot a viper sting) then don't drop RR. I would drop points from ISS and\or Imp. Barrage to move to IHM.

I'll be using something like

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?hunt...4&version=9901

If you don't raid with a Blood DK\Enhance Shaman I would drop one point from Imp Barrage to move it to TSA

A lot of people are using Silencing shot and it can be a great way to boost your DPS by about 1-2%. It does come at a huge mana cost though, so thats kind of a personal decision based on how much replenishment you have in the raid.

According to the spreadsheet, Silencing Shot doesn't increase your Viper uptime by that much in 3.1.3. I was thinking something like this, with no TSA:

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

With 3 points to spend in either Imp HM or Imp Barrage or something, depending on if you can convince the other hunter(s) you raid with (if any) to take Imp HM instead. According to the spreadsheet, 0 points in Rapid Recup is just barely enough to last an entire tank and spank fight, and with all the extra stuff we are required to do in Ulduar, it seems wise to keep at least one point in it.

It's definitely looking like Silencing Shot is a welcome addition to the rotation in 3.1.3, even moreso than it already is.

EDIT: This all assumes ideal mana regeneration through Replen, JoW, etc.

Did you check Aimed glyph? It's about 20dps higher than Steady Shot in my setup. Granted I'll probably get the Mark glyph once the patch is out.

Oddly enough it's the other way around for me, Steady Shot glyph is about 20 dps higher than Aimed Shot glyph. Are you using the rotation test?