Fierra

Scorpids are getting VERY nerfed, they will no longer have a stack of poison doing such impressive damage anymore. It is being replaced with a single-stack DoT that does good damage still, but nowhere near comparable to its current dps.

 

tachycardia

So if L&L's % chance to rpoc off serpent is 10%, the whole discussion of trap dancing viability may be pointless. That's assuming, of course, that there is no 30 sec CD. I've seen others note that on the PTR the 30 sec L&L CD doesn't exist, as they are proccing it every 24 secs with resourcefulness.

Without a 30 sec CD, serpent should proc L&L the same amount as traps (assuming no resourcefulness). Then it just becomes a choice of whether you want to spend 3 pts in resourcefulness, and have to trap dance, in order to get that 24 sec L&L. I'd suspect it's not worth it. Sniper training and not trap dancing, for example, would likely give better results than resourcefulness + trap dancing.

 

Ferrari_13

There is still a LnL cd on the recent PTR.

 

• Garby

Scorpids were nerfed very heavily in all the numbers that we've seen Ghostcrawler deliver.

 

Evil ZeR0

i dont think they will keep the cooldown on LnL it would make it pointless.

 

Hic

for PVP

 

Woodent

why PVP only, in absence of cooldown trapdancing is always a welcomed DPS boost, which is what Blizz are trying to avoid, apparently. Increasing the proc rate without preserving the cooldown is the outright damage boost to the talent and Surv tree in general - definitely not the thing devs are trying to implement

 

KraxisSingular

It could be the first step towards limiting the trap proc to CC traps and not DPS traps. If that was done and then the CD was removed the proc on sting would be slightly better, without making OP.

 

centrius

Does anyone know how much the Cats have been nerfed? Are they still gonna be the nr 1 pet (tbh i dont count the scorpion since it bugged in both TBH and Wrath). Or will there be a new nr1 SV pet?
Would be nice to try out the scorpion before the nerf to see how much dmg i get on patch My 4700 dps on Patch was with a Cat (main pet), wonder how much a scorpion would give extra.

 

Woodent

if I am not mistaken, some of the CC traps (namely, frost trap) are triggered (as opposed to resisted, as in case of freezing traps) by bosses, just don't affect them. However, the triggering effect is sufficient for LnL procs. So just limiting the number of traps to CC ones won`t do the trick, some deeper boss-to-trap interaction mechanisms will have to be altered, as people have discussed in this thread a couple of pages ago

 

ankah

they changed primarily how the cat scales, but the nerf is not huge, scorpion on the other hand not only did it get nerfed so it scales for a lot less, they took away the 5 stacks of poison....

I don't know what spec you are, but for me, being a MM, the scorpion is about 400dps more (25 man raid buffed) than a cat

 

Misaki

just out of curiosity, isnt it more worthwhile to put +agility when you are dual wielding, seeing as you survival values agility more than ap?

most hunters i've seen use +ap on both weapons, but i've been gathering some mainhands/offhands solely for the purpose of them having more agility than a 2hand weapon.

 

centrius

Ofc it is better. im still w8ting for my 2 x Webbed Death (link)
that should give a whoping 138 agi and some good AP number Oo still kicking myself for not bidding on the first that droped. went for minimum dkp. Imo, 2 x WD is way better for a SV then Black Ice IF your hitcapped ofc since u will get -hit (10 i think) vs BI.

 

Misaki

Thanks for your answer, I currently have got a collection of dual wielding options atm, I've got Webbed Death, Twilight Mist, Hailstorm and The Hand of Nerub - quite a collection, but i came to realize that hailstorm and the hand of nerub arent that good, so I'm hoping for a Widow's Fury to knock on my bags ^^

 

Woodent

With the Journey's End becoming a hunter stat stick in 3.0.8 I don't see why would anyone who is hit-capped want to dual-wield. In case of 2xWD you are loosing about 0.5% of crit versus about 100 extra AP on the JE. Agility ultimately boils down to AP+crit, it is not valuable per se.

 

centrius

How do u figure that? JE has 58 crit and 87 agi, 2xWebbed Death gives 62 crit and 138 agi with the enchants. And btw, do u know how much AP the new staffs will have?

Imo Agi > all (in most cases) since you scale so rediculus in raid surounding, i peak almost at 2500 agi in raid.
Those 100 ap u where using as an argument vs 2xWB isnt a good one since with kings+MotW+food+elixer u will get so much more AP by just pure scaling. If u have the Greatness card as i have its even a more non issue for me since it procs with 300 agi every 45s (again, scaling). In raid i have been over 9600 ap as SV (with Call of the Wild) up and im pretty sure im higher now.

@ Misaki
Imo Webbed Death + Hailstorm isnt a bad combo, i would use it.

 

Fierra

2 WD results in an extra 51 AGI if both enchanted properly over Journey's End; this means, with kings, you get an extra 56 AGI total, or 58.65 agility if you're SV, just to clarify that it's not a 'huge boost.' Here's a breakdown of the two compared sets. AP is just the weapon's added AP, total AP is assuming 100% Int->AP conversion, and SV AP is assuming 30% Stam -> AP and enhanced AGI.

2 Webbed Death w/Exceptional Agility (+26) (stats rolled together)

Agility: 138
SV Agility: 158.7
Stamina: 74
Hit: 42
Crit: 62
Haste: 0
AP: 132
Total AP: 270
SV AP: 312.9

Journey's End w/Massacre (+110 AP)

Agility: 87
SV Agility: 100.05
Stamina: 114
Hit: 0
Crit: 57
Haste: 75
AP: 338 (since in 3.0.8 druid staffs will remove STR and give twice that as AP)
Total AP: 425
SV AP: 472.25

Differences:
Agility: 2XWD comes out with 51 more agility, or 58.65 if full SV.
Stamina: JE has 40 more.
Hit: JE has none, 2XWB has a total of 42.
Crit: 2XWB has 5 more crit rating together; barely a difference.
Haste: 2XWD has none, JE has 75.
AP: Rolling total APs together, JE has 155 more AP, or 159.35 more if you're deep SV.

The Agility difference is important, but not as much as over 150AP in my opinion. Even counting in what extra AP you'd get from expose weakness, and the bit of extra AGI you'll garner from other buffs when having a base 50 more AGI, it's not enough to overcome the massive AP difference. Once 3.0.8 hits, Journey's End, all the way!

 

centrius

Sigh guess ill be the most hated hunter in the guild then when i steal this ^^ thx for the numbers.

Btw this might be a super stupid question, but i never got what ES scaled with? Is it agi or ap? Or something else?

 

Fierra

It scales just like our other shots; with AP.

 

Celfydd

Ranged attack power. See the tooltip.

 

centrius

Ah yes, think i read the ingame one and the RAP wasnt in the tooltip so i figured that it wasnt gonna say anything in the talent calculator. Shame on me i guess

 

Woodent

you can always dodge your bears' wrath by getting Betrayer of Humanity - Item - World of Warcraft. The thing is almost identical to JE in all major aspects.

 

tachycardia

The only reason I could see anyone caring if a hunter takes a JE over a druid is if they are ignorant and think that just because JE is a druid wep now it should always remain one.

After the patch, JE will provide as much of a boost to hunters as it will to druids. Also, druids will be taking weapons that were previously considered hunter weps (stat heavy polearms).

 

hecub

Druids will benefit from the weapon dps, we don't. So that's just like any other cac weapon, we will get it only after cac dps got equivalent dps weapons.