Alright, I could not find anything in this topic that covered this...

What if you spec'd your SV hunter using this spec: (0/20/51) with a glyphed Hunter's Mark? (assuming there are no other hunters with glyphed ImpHM)

If I did my calculations right, the hunter's mark would give around 450RAP (instead of 300AP) on the marked target. If you were soft haste capped, would taking Rapid Killing and Imp Hunter's Mark be justifiable over taking the 1-2 points in Imp AotH, and glyph? I have not reached soft haste cap yet so I cannot try this myself, but I would be interested in seeing some data. The 2 mins off Rapid Fire and a glyphed Imp Hunter's Mark might make this build viable (as long as you are soft-capped). It would also increase raid damage if there are more hunter's in the group.

Another alternative to this build would be to remove the 2 points in Rapid Killing and putting them in Improved Stings (since quite a few boss fights last shorter than 3 minutes making rapid killing useless).

In my case this would mean that the last 2 ticks of explosive did MORE threat than Aimed + Explosive's first tick (as I stated there was no autoshot between those instas) AND our MT missed just "in time" then. Possible? Yes, but would involve some lucky crit ticks over the span of that raid night. I will try to test this a little more I guess

Hi guys. I'm using hunter since a lot of time and now with the new patch i've back to Survival (used few times during my life) and now i've some doubts like :

* Focused Aim reducing Crit Return -> so after lot of page that i've read before is that true :O ?
* That's my spec now for 25 Raid HERE
and that's my current gear The World of Warcraft Armory

Any suggestion are well accepted ! Consider that: for the Hit in raid i always use Well Feed (+40) and buff. So i don't know if i can leave Focused Aim :|

As I see in Armory, you are in mostly a PvP gear gemmed for PvP. PvP s*cks for PvE. It has (almost) no hit, no intellect.
Get some PvE gear from HC's, badges, leatherworkers.

First of all, you need to get 263 hit rating (with 3/3 FA about 165). This is a MUST.
Then re-gem. 16 agi in red sockets, 16 crit in yellows, and 7agi-12sta in blues. (If you need hit replace these with 8agi-8hit (red), 16 hit (yellow), 8hit-12sta (blue).
Then re-enchant for PvE: Agi, AP is the priority. (1 Agi is better then 2 AP)

Your talents:
Forget 5 point in Hunting party. 1 or MAXIMUM 2 is enough. (if you got 2 shadow priests and some mana totems, you need no point in these talent)
Put 1 point in Wyvern sting and 3 points in Noxious stings.
Forget Rapid fire, you can not use RF in current bossfights (most of them dont last really longer then 3 min.)
Put 1 point in Aimed Shot and use it on CD.

I think this would be a good start.

Some amendments to the previous advice:

If hit capped yellows should be deadly (8 agi 8 crit) assuming the socket bonus is worth taking.
For the first blue socket you should use a siren's tear (6 all stats) which not only gives a blue socket bonus but counts for yellow/blue gem requirements on the relentless meta; after that the 7agi/11 stam.

Avoid Focused aim if at all possible through gear. Pets are still 15-20% of a SV builds dps, and the points aren't there to spare anyway. Work on hit cap from gear/gems, relying on a food buff can be risky, and anyway 40 agi is worth more in the food buff slot.

So I had an idea the other day that I've tried in a couple of 10 mans and it seems to work pretty well. Was hoping to see if anyone else has tried this or if I'm gimping myself trying to make it work.

Basically, in any encounter where there are adds, I hit everything with Serpent Sting. The goal is two-fold: boost my volley damage on the adds by the 3%, and, more importantly, significantly increase the chance to get a LnL proc.

I'm completely confident that having Serpent Sting on multiple targets causes LnL to proc much more quickly, but what I'm not sure about is if it would be better to spend that time and mana doing something other than spamming Serpent Sting, especially considering that most adds don't live for the full duration of the sting.

Nekondas, have you tried fighting with sniper training yet?

Now, it sounds to me in this post like you don't have a concept of the internal LnL cooldown. Perhaps you're just saying for that many stings being up, the chance to proc is higher as soon as the internal CD is down. Either way, it's highly DPS inefficient. Extra 3% damage on our crippled Volley now is worth nothing. What you SHOULD be doing on fights with adds is sting up on boss, and frost trap down on adds. That's how I've gotten plenty of huge LnL streaks on fights like Kel'Thuzad, Noth, etc.

Here's hoping they don't hotfix frost trap being off the internal CD. *crosses fingers*

Sorry guys ! I was in wintergrasp last time ^_^ ! now i've the PVE GEAR ! If you don't see the PVE GEAR just wait that armory update Sorry for the previous post you was perfect on your post with the socket and anything but that was PVP gear ! Sorry again

Anyway why Wyverin and Noxious....they are mostly for PVP right ? I remember that in previous patch boss was immune (of course immune to sleeping but even immune to the damage :| )

I noticed this happening. I thought it was a fluke, or my eyes were messed up -- while fighting adds for the SoH dailies I frost trapped and got two LnL procs in a row. This may not be a bug, but in fact intentional as it would make resourcefulness viable for PvP now that frost traps aren't on the internal CD, and due to the fact that most bosses are just immune to frost trap we still cannot trap dance.

Nice find!

I tried before patch.
For me problem is that in our raids totems that buff hunters are placed by enhancement shaman(s) means they are close to boss.
Now when i try get more than 30 yd range i move out of totems range
Thats why i only (edit) took Noxious Stings.

Why would putting Serpent Sting in front of Aimed Shot hinder your dps. If I recall, Aimed isn't on the the GC and SrS and Aimed arrive on target very close together. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm at work at can't test.

Aimed Shot is definitely on the global cooldown.

Noxious Stings has two effects, one of which is that all of our damage is increased by 3% when your serpent sting is on the target.

Ok, thanks for the correction. But I still don't see the logic against SrS -> AS if you craft the shot rotation to refresh the SrS properly.

I fixed my previous post Gozardina, writing here and raiding at once isnt good idea

Can anyone confirm if the frost trap alleged bug still works? Getting back to back Lock and Load procs last week was pretty killer.

I'm interested in this as well and I'd prefer an actual calculation rather than just looking at WWS logs, however, since I am unable to use the DPS spreadsheet to it's fullest potential (silly Macs) I'm wondering if anyone could provide further insight on this topic.

Assuming that you will be haste soft capped with an IAotH proc, will additional talent points be better spent in more IAotH? or in Improved Stings?

Because when you defer a shot that's ready to go, you're essentially reducing the DPS contributed by its previous cycle. In this case, although you boost your next Aimed Shot by 3%, by burning a GCD on Serpent, you've essentially reduced the previous Aimed Shot's DPS by spreading its damage contribution over an additional 1.5 seconds, which costs you much more than 3%. Conversely, although Serpent does 5k or more damage per cooldown, its DPS contribution is much lower, and therefore so is the cost of deferring it.

I know the "bug" still works, I am doing it right now. To test I would serpent sting mobs until it proc'd, then follow up witha frost trap...4 free explosive shots

That doesn't make any sense. Assuming it has time to tick until completion, there's no difference between the damage being frontloaded or a DoT. All of the arguments you make regarding aimed shot's cooldown can be applied to serpent sting's duration as well, you should really just fire off whichever does more total damage.

An example:
2 Shots, both do 2k damage, 1 is instant with a 10s CD, the other is a DoT that ticks for 20s or just has a 20s CD.
The first does 200 DPS (2000/10).
The second does 100 DPS (2000/20).

Delaying the first Shot by 1.5s lowers it's DPS to 2000/11.5 = 173.9 DPS (-26.1 DPS)
Delaying the second by 1.5s lowers it's DPS to 2000/21.5 = 93 DPS (-7 DPS)

I think that is what Catalept meant and it makes perfect sense to me. Sorry if I got it wrong.